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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo

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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 06 Aug 2006, 10:35
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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a cheaper alternative became available in that year.

Which of the following is an assumption on which the argument depends?


A) No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.

B) Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.

C) The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.

D) The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.

E) Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.
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Last edited by akkane on 17 Apr 2013, 16:15, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: A newly discovered painting on wooden panel [#permalink] New post 22 Mar 2011, 22:12
No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.: Regardless of the stock of the pigment existed or not, if Michelangelo abandoned this pigment in 1509 as stated as a fact in the question statement, we know that he wouldnt have used the pigment after 1509. Author doesnt need this assumption to support his statement, as he presents its implication- michelangelo not using the pigment after 1509- as a known fact
Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.He could have started the painiting before 1507, painted the 1507 coin during that time and could have used the pigment in/till 1509 and could have contnued painting it without that particular pigment after 1509 for several years! If Michelangelo painted this painting over several years, the facts given in question statement seem to be of no value to predict the timing of this painting. Hence Author's claim stands a chance only on the basis of given assumption. Correct option.
The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.The coin was released in 1507, so this statement is irrelevant, if the statement said that the coin was known to general public in say 1497- then we can say that Michelangelo might have painted it without/before the coin being minted. But the assumption is of no value because of the year it claims.
The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.Wooden panel being used for estimating age is not used by author as an argument
Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509just as D, paiting style is not used as an argument by the author. so cant be usaed as an assumption.
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Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 01 Jun 2011, 01:17
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a cheaper alternative became available in that year.

Which of the following is an assumption on which the argument depends?

a. No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.
b. Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.
c. The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.
d. The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.
e. Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.

The correct answer does not makes sense to me. Please help.
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Re: Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 01 Jun 2011, 02:44
The rreasoning behind answer choice b is that if Michelangelo had worked on the painting for several years he could have used pigment for part of its painting while working on it before 1509 but completed the painting after 1509 w/o using said pigment anymore (i.e. using a different pigment)
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Re: Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 01 Jun 2011, 21:34
You had better use search engine and try to find this question, which has been discussed before. The same for other questions.

to find a correct answer in assumption question, you have to negate the answer. If it weakens the argument, than the answer is correct.

Topic locked.
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Re: CR - Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 08 Aug 2011, 20:51
Manhantat CR questions is very nice and brutal.

My friends, Please, help me out.

Why is A wrong?
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Re: A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 21 May 2012, 01:24
No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509. - It has been stated that Mic abandoned the pigment for a cheaper alternative. Does not qualify to be an assumption - Incorrect
Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years. - If it is argued that Mic worked on the painting for several years, then it might include 1507 and 1509 as well, the years which are discussed in the passage. Hence B is the assumption - Correct answer
The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507. - Passage does not talk about the coin available to the public - Irrelevant information - Incorrect
The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age. - No reference to wooden panel to determine the age of the painting - out of scope - Incorrect
Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509. - This does not determine or conclude anything about the painting - Incorrect
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Re: A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 21 May 2012, 02:15
noboru wrote:
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a cheaper alternative became available in that year.


Which of the following is an assumption on which the argument depends?
No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.
Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.
The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.
The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.
Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.


option A says that no stock existed after 1509 period - anywhere, not just in Michelangelo's possession. Is it possible that the pigment still existed in the world but Michelangelo didn't use it for the stated reason? Sure - that wouldn't affect this author's claim that the painting was painted between 1507 and 1509.

For option B, however, try this: Michelangelo started painting the canvas in 1505, but put it aside for a while and then finished it in 1507, at which time he painted in the new coin. Or, Michelangelo started painting with the old pigment in 1508 and finished that particular color then. He finished the rest in 1510 but didn't need to use the particular pigment in question again - maybe it was blue and he was done with all of the blues in 1508 but added some yellow in 1510. If either of those scenarios is true, there goes the author's claim.
Thus B is correct
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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 30 May 2012, 12:55
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a cheaper alternative became available in that year.

Which of the following is an assumption on which the argument depends?
A No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.
B Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.
C The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.
D The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.
E Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.



I don't understand the OA.
My logic : We have to assume that
- central figures carries a coin from 1507 and
- old pigment before 1509.
Someone can explain the OA and comments my logic?
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Re: MGMAT CR Question [#permalink] New post 31 May 2012, 01:32
The answer should be B.Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.
If Michelangelo did work on the painting over the course of several years,there could be several possibilities
He might have used coin in the year 1507
he might have used the pigment in the year 1509
and still the possibility exists that the painting is not finished till the year 1509.

Hence even though the argument fulfills all its condition,it will not give the required conclusion.
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Re: MGMAT CR Question [#permalink] New post 31 May 2012, 19:36
Yep, your reasoning in the argument is okay:
- central figures carries a coin from 1507 and
- old pigment before 1509.

But choice D drive you in different way, which stated that the wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age => this is irrelevant to the issue.

We can negate this choice: the wooden ... can be tested accurately for age => so, what is happening, nothing? The argument is still okay. So, this choice is the correct one.

Beside, with choice B, if Michaelangelo bought pigment and used (painted) in several year, we cannot know when he bought these pigments and when he completed the painting.

Please, let me know if you still misunderstand. Thank a lot.
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Re: MGMAT CR Question [#permalink] New post 02 Jun 2012, 11:52
tuanquang269 wrote:
Yep, your reasoning in the argument is okay:
- central figures carries a coin from 1507 and
- old pigment before 1509.

But choice D drive you in different way, which stated that the wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age => this is irrelevant to the issue.

We can negate this choice: the wooden ... can be tested accurately for age => so, what is happening, nothing? The argument is still okay. So, this choice is the correct one.

Beside, with choice B, if Michaelangelo bought pigment and used (painted) in several year, we cannot know when he bought these pigments and when he completed the painting.

Please, let me know if you still misunderstand. Thank a lot.


Thank you tuanquang269 and ankitranjan.

I understand that the assumption is based on the moment he painted, and the argument says that he works between 1507 and 1509.
So the assumption might be that Mickael Angelo didn't work on the painting over the course of several years because he works only in 1507 or 1508 but 2 years is several years? no?
So Can he could works several years?
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Re: MGMAT CR Question [#permalink] New post 07 Jun 2012, 00:20
If Mic would have started painting before 1507, the coin in the painting would not have been there because the coin was minted from 1507 onwards. Mic even would not have painted after 1509 as it contains a pigment that Mic have abandoned the same year due to availability of a cheaper variant.

Hence it is clear that Mic have started painting after 1507 and finished before 1509.
Option B is the answer.
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Re: A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 25 Jun 2012, 02:09
Straight B.

This answer option circumvents both the paint and coin premises, and tackles the time period conclusion directly. Negating the option, we discover that Michelangelo actually worked on the painting over several years and the paint and coin premises actually are only circumstantial/anecdotal and really provide us with no tangible clues on when the painting was finished.

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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 24 Jul 2012, 20:43
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have
been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted
earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was
not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it
contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a
cheaper alternative became available in that year. Which of the following is
an assumption on which the argument depends?


A) No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.

B) Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.

C) The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.

D) The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.

E) Michelangelo’s painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.
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Re: CR - Assumption - Painting [#permalink] New post 24 Jul 2012, 23:13
IMO B.

A. This is irrelevant because we are concerned about the usage of pigment rather than its existence

C. This is already given in the stimuli.

D. We are concerned about when the painting is drawn not about the age of the wood.

E. Seems contender..but even the style changes he cannot change the pigment and the coin image..

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Re: CR - Assumption - Painting [#permalink] New post 25 Jul 2012, 07:20
KyleWiddison wrote:
vikky267 wrote:
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have
been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted
earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was
not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it
contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a
cheaper alternative became available in that year. Which of the following is
an assumption on which the argument depends?


A) No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.

B) Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.

C) The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.

D) The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.

E) Michelangelo’s painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.


Assumptions fit in the logical gap between premises and the conclusion. Here the conclusion is that the painting must have been COMPLETED 1507-1509. Premises are 1 - the coin inclluded that was minted in 1507 and 2 - Pigment used that M. was KNOWN to abandon in 1509.

A - Existence of pigment is irrelevant because the premise says he was known to abandon the pigment regardless of its existence
B - The conclusion discusses the paintings COMPLETION, so you are assuming that if it contained pigment abandonded in 1509 it was also completed that year. You can also try negation here: Michealangelo DID work on the painting over the course of several years. The negated assumption destroys the conclusion, making it a necessary assumption.
C - This provides additional information about an already established premise, not an assumption.
D - Wooden panel age is out of scope.
E - M's painting style is not discussed in the argument therefore it is also out of scope.

KW



Y not E because author is concluding that painting has to be done between 1507 & 1509 and if my painting style didn't changed in between these years it did use minted coin in 1507 and adhesive use in 1509. All i am saying is this is the only option that tries to cover the gap between 1507 & 1509. Option B does not specifically mention the time frame
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Re: CR - Assumption - Painting [#permalink] New post 25 Jul 2012, 07:48
KyleWiddison wrote:
vikky267 wrote:
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have
been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted
earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was
not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it
contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a
cheaper alternative became available in that year. Which of the following is
an assumption on which the argument depends?


A) No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.

B) Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.

C) The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.

D) The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.

E) Michelangelo’s painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.


Assumptions fit in the logical gap between premises and the conclusion. Here the conclusion is that the painting must have been COMPLETED 1507-1509. Premises are 1 - the coin inclluded that was minted in 1507 and 2 - Pigment used that M. was KNOWN to abandon in 1509.

A - Existence of pigment is irrelevant because the premise says he was known to abandon the pigment regardless of its existence
B - The conclusion discusses the paintings COMPLETION, so you are assuming that if it contained pigment abandonded in 1509 it was also completed that year. You can also try negation here: Michealangelo DID work on the painting over the course of several years. The negated assumption destroys the conclusion, making it a necessary assumption.
C - This provides additional information about an already established premise, not an assumption.
D - Wooden panel age is out of scope.
E - M's painting style is not discussed in the argument therefore it is also out of scope.

KW


Great Explanation ! +1 Kudos !!!
Kindly put some more light on - Assumption Negation !
It would help many of us here who are still scratching their heads after knowing that why (B) is the right answer.
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Re: CR - Assumption - Painting [#permalink] New post 25 Jul 2012, 15:48
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Quote:
Y not E because author is concluding that painting has to be done between 1507 & 1509 and if my painting style didn't changed in between these years it did use minted coin in 1507 and adhesive use in 1509. All i am saying is this is the only option that tries to cover the gap between 1507 & 1509. Option B does not specifically mention the time frame


E is a tempting choice because it specifically mentions the years in question, but you need to remember that the purpose of the assumption is to bridge the logical gap between the premises and the conclusion. The premises do not discuss his painting style, only the coin and the pigment, so information about the painting style doesn't bridge the gap between premises and conclusion.

Part of the reason why answer choice B is tricky, though correct, is that it doesn't specifically mention either the coin or pigment. However, the length of time spent painting does directly relate to the pigment premise. If he started the painting in 1508 he would be using the old pigment, but if the painting took several years to finish he wouldn't have COMPLETED it until sometime after 1509. For our conclusion to be true (the painting was completed before the end of 1509) we have to assume that he started after 1507 and completed it before 1509, as option B states.

KW
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Re: [#permalink] New post 13 Sep 2012, 05:56
gmatcrook wrote:
Guys, I'm lost in the michelangelo painting!

Can anyone explain how B was the assumption?

I didnt understand the OE!

"In order to conclude that the painting must have been completed before 1509 on the basis of the pigment, we must assume that he did not begin the painting before 1509 using the old pigment and complete the painting after 1509 with the new pigment."

He could have started the painting several years before 1507, could have painted the coin in 1507 and completed the painting in 1509 before he stopped using the old pigment.

Am I reading too much into the argument or too little?



True - the same thing is what I am thinking. Suppose he starts the painting in 1507 or before - take the date as 01.07.1507. Now, he croons and works on it in 1508, very slowly and aesthetically moving his right hand putting the old pigment on the canvass. Then on 15.06.2009 (before 1509?? guess it ends on 31.12.1509), ok say 31.12.08, he celebrates the new year 1509 with the completion of his painting.... and on 17.07.1509 regrets that he started it before and worked on it for years, because a cheaper alternative is now available, which is faster than the older one. He cries every day, goes into a depression and dies in 1564. Damn!
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A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo [#permalink] New post 23 Feb 2013, 13:08
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo must have been completed after 1507 but before 1509. It cannot have been painted earlier than 1507 because one of its central figures carries a coin that was not minted until that year. It cannot have been painted after 1509 because it contains a pigment that Michelangelo is known to have abandoned when a cheaper alternative became available in that year.

Which of the following is an assumption on which the argument depends?
(A)No stocks of the abandoned pigment existed after 1509.
(B)Michelangelo did not work on the painting over the course of several years.
(C)The coin depicted in the painting was known to general public in 1507.
(D)The wooden panel on which the painting was executed cannot be tested accurately for age.
(E)Michelangelo's painting style did not change between 1507 and 1509.
Need explanation................
A newly discovered painting on wooden panel by Michelangelo   [#permalink] 23 Feb 2013, 13:08
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