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# Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009!

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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 12:33
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terp06 wrote:
djhouse81 wrote:
Everyone's concerns about ED are not unfounded. ED is only for applicants who have decided that Columbia is their first choice. If you have researched schools and have discovered that everything that Columbia offers fits with who you are and what you want to be then the rolling and early aspects of Columbia's ED round can be really appealing. This is how I saw it, hence I applied ED. If you like Columbia, but it might be your 2+ choice, or it is neck and neck with your first choice, then you are better off going RD. RD might be more competitive, but we're talking about 2 years of your life that could plot the course for the rest of your life. Don't go for Columbia ED just to get the application process over with quicker, do it because Columbia is where you want to go for business school.

For what reasons do people choose Columbia over Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, or Chicago? Is it purely based on proximity to Wall Street and the location in New York City, or are there other things that go into this decision as well?

There's a lot of reasons why students to choose Columbia over the other schools you named. I'll name a few:
1) location, both NYC and Wall Street
2) Finance
3) Consulting (McKinsey LOVES!!! Columbia)
4) Particular alumni show the quality of the school: Buffet, Kravis, Mario Gabelli, Vikram Pandit
5) Students - I never visited the other schools, but I felt an instant connection with the Columbia students; plus, they have the Hermes Society and Peer Advisors, which are groups of current students whose sole responsibility is to welcome prospective and accepted students
6) Value Investing Program
7) Renowned faculty, such as Bruce Greenwold and even the former Chair of the Council of Economic Advisors who is now our current Dean
8) Real Estate Program - NYC real estate is a great case in itself for a real estate program
9) Healthcare and Pharma Mgmt Program - one of the best for MBA's
10) A Private Equity focus
11) An international nexus as far as MBA programs go, as well as U.S. cities
12) New core curriculum
13) An incredible pre-MBA "World Tour" initiated and facilitated by '10's (there's a 14-week itinerary, website, and leaders for each leg, talk about initiative...incredible!!!)
14) Yield - Columbia's is 17%, very presitigious
15) Ivy League (ok, Harvard and Wharton have that)
16) Plus Columbia has everything that top-tier programs should have, such as short and long abroad programs, a focus on entrepreneurship, every club under the sun, intramurals, class groups and teams, happy-hours, student-organized shows, a cohesive class of students, excellent job placement, great compensation packages upon graduation
17) I could go on and on and on...

Every school has its strength. If you want to work out West, at Google, or Silicon Valley, then Stanford and Haas would be better than Columbia. If you want a very different leariing experience, then Ross might be your best bet with their MAP program or Darden's case study system. No matter where you go amongst the top schools, you'll be able to write your ticket. If you come from Columbia, Wharton, Harvard, Chicago, or Stanford, I'll hire any of you in a heartbeat--assuming I can afford you! So you are better off just finding where your ideals fit the school's ideals, and go from there.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 12:51
djhouse81 wrote:
terp06 wrote:
djhouse81 wrote:
Everyone's concerns about ED are not unfounded. ED is only for applicants who have decided that Columbia is their first choice. If you have researched schools and have discovered that everything that Columbia offers fits with who you are and what you want to be then the rolling and early aspects of Columbia's ED round can be really appealing. This is how I saw it, hence I applied ED. If you like Columbia, but it might be your 2+ choice, or it is neck and neck with your first choice, then you are better off going RD. RD might be more competitive, but we're talking about 2 years of your life that could plot the course for the rest of your life. Don't go for Columbia ED just to get the application process over with quicker, do it because Columbia is where you want to go for business school.

For what reasons do people choose Columbia over Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, or Chicago? Is it purely based on proximity to Wall Street and the location in New York City, or are there other things that go into this decision as well?

There's a lot of reasons why students to choose Columbia over the other schools you named. I'll name a few:
1) location, both NYC and Wall Street
2) Finance
3) Consulting (McKinsey LOVES!!! Columbia)
4) Particular alumni show the quality of the school: Buffet, Kravis, Mario Gabelli, Vikram Pandit
5) Students - I never visited the other schools, but I felt an instant connection with the Columbia students; plus, they have the Hermes Society and Peer Advisors, which are groups of current students whose sole responsibility is to welcome prospective and accepted students
6) Value Investing Program
7) Renowned faculty, such as Bruce Greenwold and even the former Chair of the Council of Economic Advisors who is now our current Dean
8) Real Estate Program - NYC real estate is a great case in itself for a real estate program
9) Healthcare and Pharma Mgmt Program - one of the best for MBA's
10) A Private Equity focus
11) An international nexus as far as MBA programs go, as well as U.S. cities
12) New core curriculum
13) An incredible pre-MBA "World Tour" initiated and facilitated by '10's (there's a 14-week itinerary, website, and leaders for each leg, talk about initiative...incredible!!!)
14) Yield - Columbia's is 17%, very presitigious
15) Ivy League (ok, Harvard and Wharton have that)
16) Plus Columbia has everything that top-tier programs should have, such as short and long abroad programs, a focus on entrepreneurship, every club under the sun, intramurals, class groups and teams, happy-hours, student-organized shows, a cohesive class of students, excellent job placement, great compensation packages upon graduation
17) I could go on and on and on...

Every school has its strength. If you want to work out West, at Google, or Silicon Valley, then Stanford and Haas would be better than Columbia. If you want a very different leariing experience, then Ross might be your best bet with their MAP program or Darden's case study system. No matter where you go amongst the top schools, you'll be able to write your ticket. If you come from Columbia, Wharton, Harvard, Chicago, or Stanford, I'll hire any of you in a heartbeat--assuming I can afford you! So you are better off just finding where your ideals fit the school's ideals, and go from there.

Many of these things seem to be present at Chicago or Harvard. I guess what I'm really wondering is - how did you decide that you didn't want Chicago or Harvard? The above present a very good case for why you wanted Columbia, but to sacrifice your chances at every other school and apply ED is a big step. I suppose that it could just be a fit thing.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 13:16
terp06 wrote:
Many of these things seem to be present at Chicago or Harvard.

I'm not going to go through every single bullet point, but I thought I'd share my thoughts on a couple of these:

1) location, both NYC and Wall Street
FACT: Harvard and Wharton are not in or near New York City. They do not provide the same level of access to hedge funds, money managersm and private equity firms. This is very clear in the placement reports. A 20 person hedge fund isn't taking a trip to Chicago to recruit somebody. They're hopping on the A line to 116th.

2) Finance
FACT: Columbia's wins both in terms of # of classes and also because of the Master Classes taught by REAL Wall Street professionals. I don't want to read a case on how to run a distressed debt hedge fund. I want to meet a Wall Street Pro in his/her office (a couple of the value investing courses are taught on site!) and have him telling me about his strategy and what his firm actually does to execute their strategy.

5) Students
I feel the same way as dj. I visited Columbia two weeks ago. Huge difference in character quality between Harvard and Chicago (in particular Harvard). If you don't notice a difference, that's unfortunate, because the difference is pretty clear and stark in my opinion. I'm not saying anything bad about H or C, just stating I believe there is a clear difference, and my personality preferences strongly favor Columbia.

6) Value Investing Program
No other school comes close on this one. If you don't believe me, you need to do some more research on this.

8) Real estate program
This one should also be a no brainer
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 13:22
Terp you need to also remember not everyone gets into all their schools. In fact only nervousgmat clean sweeps tons of top schools. I mean Terry got into Stanford but not HBS. So someone might apply to Chicago/Columbia/Wharton/HBS and only get into one that makes an easy decision. Also some people are realistic about their chances, I know chances of me getting into Stanford were so slim that I decided not to waste the  and effort to apply.
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Kellogg Class of 2010...still active and willing to help. However, I do not do profile reviews, don't offer predictions on chances and am far to busy to review essays, so save the energy of writing me a PM seeking help for these. If I don't respond to a PM that is not one of the previously mentioned trash can destined messages, please don't take it personally I get so many messages I have a hard to responding to most. The more interesting, compelling, or humorous you message the more likely I am to respond.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 13:37
Quote:
If you come from Columbia, Wharton, Harvard, Chicago, or Stanford, I'll hire any of you in a heartbeat--assuming I can afford you!

Dj- does that mean you wont hire me?
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 13:38
You will see what I mean when you research and visit schools, or at the very least interact with them and the students. For example, when you travel to NY, you realize that a Goldman Sachs Senior Manager can call you up for dinner and to discuss job opportunities, and you can be right there! But, then you may see that NYC is just too bustling for you. Then, you go to visit Harvard, and you instantly love the city! To you, being in Cambridge and having to travel a little further for recruiting trumps living in Goldman Sach's backyard and having to live in NYC. It's all a matter of fit, and the unique aspects of Columbia (do more research if you think that the criteria that I listed is not unique to Columbia) fit with me more so than the unique aspects of other schools.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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29 Apr 2008, 13:51
dosa_don wrote:
Quote:
If you come from Columbia, Wharton, Harvard, Chicago, or Stanford, I'll hire any of you in a heartbeat--assuming I can afford you!

Dj- does that mean you wont hire me?

Dosa, I'll write up a contract now if I know that I can secure you come graduation time! I was just using those schools because terp mentioned them, but I would be lucky to have anyone of this forum work for me! Most likely it will be the other way around because I am not starting a business anytime soon.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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04 May 2008, 03:06
djhouse81 wrote:
terp06 wrote:
djhouse81 wrote:
Everyone's concerns about ED are not unfounded. ED is only for applicants who have decided that Columbia is their first choice. If you have researched schools and have discovered that everything that Columbia offers fits with who you are and what you want to be then the rolling and early aspects of Columbia's ED round can be really appealing. This is how I saw it, hence I applied ED. If you like Columbia, but it might be your 2+ choice, or it is neck and neck with your first choice, then you are better off going RD. RD might be more competitive, but we're talking about 2 years of your life that could plot the course for the rest of your life. Don't go for Columbia ED just to get the application process over with quicker, do it because Columbia is where you want to go for business school.

For what reasons do people choose Columbia over Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, or Chicago? Is it purely based on proximity to Wall Street and the location in New York City, or are there other things that go into this decision as well?

There's a lot of reasons why students to choose Columbia over the other schools you named. I'll name a few:
1) location, both NYC and Wall Street
2) Finance
3) Consulting (McKinsey LOVES!!! Columbia)
4) Particular alumni show the quality of the school: Buffet, Kravis, Mario Gabelli, Vikram Pandit
5) Students - I never visited the other schools, but I felt an instant connection with the Columbia students; plus, they have the Hermes Society and Peer Advisors, which are groups of current students whose sole responsibility is to welcome prospective and accepted students
6) Value Investing Program
7) Renowned faculty, such as Bruce Greenwold and even the former Chair of the Council of Economic Advisors who is now our current Dean
8) Real Estate Program - NYC real estate is a great case in itself for a real estate program
9) Healthcare and Pharma Mgmt Program - one of the best for MBA's
10) A Private Equity focus
11) An international nexus as far as MBA programs go, as well as U.S. cities
12) New core curriculum
13) An incredible pre-MBA "World Tour" initiated and facilitated by '10's (there's a 14-week itinerary, website, and leaders for each leg, talk about initiative...incredible!!!)
14) Yield - Columbia's is 17%, very presitigious
15) Ivy League (ok, Harvard and Wharton have that)
16) Plus Columbia has everything that top-tier programs should have, such as short and long abroad programs, a focus on entrepreneurship, every club under the sun, intramurals, class groups and teams, happy-hours, student-organized shows, a cohesive class of students, excellent job placement, great compensation packages upon graduation
17) I could go on and on and on...

Every school has its strength. If you want to work out West, at Google, or Silicon Valley, then Stanford and Haas would be better than Columbia. If you want a very different leariing experience, then Ross might be your best bet with their MAP program or Darden's case study system. No matter where you go amongst the top schools, you'll be able to write your ticket. If you come from Columbia, Wharton, Harvard, Chicago, or Stanford, I'll hire any of you in a heartbeat--assuming I can afford you! So you are better off just finding where your ideals fit the school's ideals, and go from there.

Great post!
I also interest in PM you soon to be advised about Columbia!
Thanks
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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04 May 2008, 08:26
Hi Everyone,

I am so excited to apply to Columbia. After I visited I just really fell in love with it. I have visited all the schools on my primary list, and decided that Columbia and I have the most spark (maybe fireworks in this case) I'm so glad that I found this thread. We'll help each other for the final victory. YaY! Thank you djhouse for staying around to advising us newcomers.

Program: MBA FT
Area of interest Post MBA: IB (career switcher)
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GPA: >3.5 BSEE & MSEE
School: one of the top 5 engineering school
Work experience(WE): 4 years at matriculation. Software - Quantitative Finance (reputable company)
Nationality: Chinese American
Age: 26 at matriculation
Gender: Female
Extra-curriculars:leadership in college alumni local chapter and high school north America chapter (I went to high school oversea), tutoring and mentoring middle school students, column writer for local Chinese School newspaper
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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04 May 2008, 11:39
Are the recommendation questions same from year to year?
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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04 May 2008, 21:43
happybunny wrote:
Are the recommendation questions same from year to year?

They have been the past two years. They ask for a fairly extensive recommendation compared to other schools, so make sure you give your recommenders plenty of time.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 06:20
Has anyone thought about the 2nd question on J-term's essay topics? experiencing on closing the gap between theory and practice?
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 07:17
happybunny wrote:
Has anyone thought about the 2nd question on J-term's essay topics? experiencing on closing the gap between theory and practice?

It seems pretty straightforward. Think back about a time in your life, either personal or professional (I'd lean towards the latter if possible) in which you learned a good lesson. This would be a type of lesson that you couldn't learn through a textbook or wikipedia. That's the whole point of the Master Classes - to learn from industry experts (i.e., people who are actively involved in their fields and doing hands on work.) If I want to understand how a real estate professional actually makes an investment decision, it's one thing to read through a case study, but it's another to look at current deals that somebody is actually deciding between and the process and methodology that he/she is going through.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 11:42
For some reason, Columbia is catching my eye the last few days. I have a question for those who have or are planning to apply to Columbia:

How do you plan out the rest of your application strategy if you choose to apply to Columbia ED?

I take it that most people want to submit their Columbia ED application in August or September. Given that it will take about 10 weeks for them to review your application, interview you, and make a decision - do you apply to other schools in Round 1?

What should your Round 1 strategy be if you are applying to Columbia ED?

Theoretically - would this make sense?

August/September - Apply to Columbia ED
September/October - Apply R1 at the following schools: Harvard, Wharton, Chicago, UCLA

I would be out a lot of application fees if I apply to 4 schools in R1, but I figure it is probably worth it to cover your bases in case you get rejected from Columbia ED.

Also - does anyone know the acceptance rate for ED?
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 11:48
Terp,

Not sure on exact acceptance rate, but I thought I read it is significantly better than Regular decision... I want to say maybe 20-25%? Compared with the teens for Regular Decision.

~Sam
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 11:52
no idea although it's definitely not easy. You see people on these boards get denied from columbia ED get accepted to Chicago or Wharton in RD 1. So probably not too much of a difference but definitely some edge since everyone says RD is impossible.

You will need to apply to RD1 schools since those deadlines come before the decision for ED (unless you hear earlier than 10 weeks)

Also, you have to figure more weaker candidates are going to apply ED so that will bring down the acceptance rate. If I were to guess I'd say it's even. Although that may be different then chances of getting in. If you have a good-strong profile , better shot in ED than RD .
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 12:17
If you are going to apply to other schools R1 and Columbia ED, keep in mind that the deposit for ED is due 3 weeks after you are accepted.

It seems like the RD acceptance rate is really low, but I don't think the ED acceptance rate is much higher. The overall acceptance rate for ED and RD is lower than the 16% that they publish because the overall average number includes the J-Termers, which has a higher acceptance rate. I'd like to see the acceptance rate throughout ED--August/September ED versus October+ ED. I think you will be a much greater number amongst those who apply in the first couple of months compared to those who apply after that.

If you are certain about Columbia, then apply early ED, the adcoms obviously like to see a the foresight to apply right away and a strong desire to attend their school. These are inherent advantages when you apply early in the round.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 13:49
djhouse81 wrote:
If you are going to apply to other schools R1 and Columbia ED, keep in mind that the deposit for ED is due 3 weeks after you are accepted.

It seems like the RD acceptance rate is really low, but I don't think the ED acceptance rate is much higher. The overall acceptance rate for ED and RD is lower than the 16% that they publish because the overall average number includes the J-Termers, which has a higher acceptance rate. I'd like to see the acceptance rate throughout ED--August/September ED versus October+ ED. I think you will be a much greater number amongst those who apply in the first couple of months compared to those who apply after that.

If you are certain about Columbia, then apply early ED, the adcoms obviously like to see a the foresight to apply right away and a strong desire to attend their school. These are inherent advantages when you apply early in the round.

Wow.... are you sure they combine J Term and the 2 year? That seems odd to me. Especially if J Term has a higher acceptance rate. Do you have any evidence that J Term actually has a higher acceptance rate? Why would a school want to make itself look less selective than it actually is?? Especially a school like Columbia which has a reputation for maximizing yield to lower their acceptance rate. What would be the point of doing that if you then include your accelerated MBA which has a higher acceptance rate? It totally negate their yield maximization efforts. All other schools seperate accelerated and two year apps, I don't see why Columbia would not do the same. I can only think of one reason - J Term actually has a lower acceptance rate than the 2 year. This is the only thing that makes logical sense to me, and it fits with Columbias rep for fudging the numbers.

Another thought, it would make sense now why Columbia apps only went up 7% while the rest of the M7 was up 15-30%... If they include J Term in those numbers those apps were before the recession talk started.
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 14:14
I just did some back of the envelope calculations I'd like to add to the discussion. J Term class size is roughly 190. Assuming the yield is 77% - and if that's overall yield then I think in reality J Term yield is closer to 100% because there really is no other competition in terms of top ranked programs starting in January, especially since J Term has a lot of new yorkers just looking for an accelerated program that allows them to get their ticket stamped and not have to move from NYC. But, anyway, conservatively estimate 77% that means they need to accept around 247 applicants. If the yield were 90% for J Term, they only need to accept 211. So, for them to have a 10% acceptance rate for J Term they would need between 2,110 and 2,470 applicants. This is less than the number of applicants for tiny, remote location programs like Tuck, Yale and Cornell. For a school in NYC and a program popular with NYC bankers that don't want to leave, I think its pretty reasonable they would hit these application numbers. If so..... Sept 07 acceptance rates are actually above 16%
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Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009! [#permalink]

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09 May 2008, 14:37
IHateTheGMAT wrote:
djhouse81 wrote:
If you are going to apply to other schools R1 and Columbia ED, keep in mind that the deposit for ED is due 3 weeks after you are accepted.

It seems like the RD acceptance rate is really low, but I don't think the ED acceptance rate is much higher. The overall acceptance rate for ED and RD is lower than the 16% that they publish because the overall average number includes the J-Termers, which has a higher acceptance rate. I'd like to see the acceptance rate throughout ED--August/September ED versus October+ ED. I think you will be a much greater number amongst those who apply in the first couple of months compared to those who apply after that.

If you are certain about Columbia, then apply early ED, the adcoms obviously like to see a the foresight to apply right away and a strong desire to attend their school. These are inherent advantages when you apply early in the round.

Wow.... are you sure they combine J Term and the 2 year? That seems odd to me. Especially if J Term has a higher acceptance rate. Do you have any evidence that J Term actually has a higher acceptance rate? Why would a school want to make itself look less selective than it actually is?? Especially a school like Columbia which has a reputation for maximizing yield to lower their acceptance rate. What would be the point of doing that if you then include your accelerated MBA which has a higher acceptance rate? It totally negate their yield maximization efforts. All other schools seperate accelerated and two year apps, I don't see why Columbia would not do the same. I can only think of one reason - J Term actually has a lower acceptance rate than the 2 year. This is the only thing that makes logical sense to me, and it fits with Columbias rep for fudging the numbers.

Another thought, it would make sense now why Columbia apps only went up 7% while the rest of the M7 was up 15-30%... If they include J Term in those numbers those apps were before the recession talk started.

I was told by a current student that the GMAT average that you see on the website for the most recent incoming class is averaged using 2-year and J-Term numbers. The same process might or might not apply to yield and acceptance rate, so I can't give you any hard evidence. However, the J-Term average is slightly lower than the 2-year average, so by averaging them together they are just being factual and not trying to skew the numbers.

When I am at school I will try to get some stats. I am curious, as is everyone else, about how much ED affects Columbia's yield. I would not be surprised if it does not affect it as much as everyone thinks. Columbia has a bad rep because of Early Decision, which is really just another style of the application process. I went to an undergrad with an ED round so it's not uncommon. Maybe Linda Meehan came from a school where they did ED. MIT has only 2 rounds. Kellogg has rolling decisions. UCLA has 4 rounds. Columbia only has 2 rounds. Cornell allows application submission after its final round. Most other schools have 3 rounds and a set decision date. Each method has its benefits and drawbacks.
Re: Calling all Columbia Applicants for 2009!   [#permalink] 09 May 2008, 14:37

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