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# Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants!

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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  12 Dec 2011, 17:27
1
KUDOS
Thanks Johnny, glad to hear I'm not the only one. I've been checking out this board for a little while, although I haven't contributed anything until now. You guys do an excellent job of posting relevant information.

As for the speculation about Consortium rankings, I can add only this to the discussion. Not only do all the schools see them, they also matter big-time in terms of admission (not just for the fellowship and regardless of what Ross says). I have it on very good authority from a friend who works in admissions at a Consortium school that the admission rate for Consortium applicants usually hovers around half of the general application admission rate for most schools. That means that a school with an admission rate of 30% will accept 15% of Consortium applicants. Don't let that statistic fool you though:
(1) to protect their yields, schools will rarely accept students that rank them below 3 and in many cases below 2 (especially true for the Tuck's and Stern's of the Consortium)
(2) the caliber of many consortium applicants is well below the general population of applicants, which is partly why programs like MLT and SEO are a big plus (they're seen as good preparation and vetting to overcome low GMAT/GPA); if your numbers are at a school's overall average and you're a URM Consortium applicant, you have a very very good chance of getting in because you'll be well above the pool that you're being compared to (other URM Consortium applicants)
(3) as a result of (1) your chances of getting in actually improves over the general rate of acceptance if you rank a school highly in your Consortium rankings even if your numbers aren't great or trend closer towards the Consortium average
(4) keep in mind that the average GMAT for an accepted Consortium student in 2010 was 644, GPA was 3.24 - don't put too much weight into that though because the higher ranked schools will have higher averages for their Consortium students.
(5) essays are even more important for Consortium applicants than they are for regular applicants because (a) whether you like it or not you're pigeon-holed as a diverse candidate and that needs to come across (but don't be overbearing about it) and (b) if they don't think you're going to come to their school they'll deny you, so you have to show specific interest in the program in the school's essay(s) and preferably otherwise.

Good luck guys, I hope that helps. None of this is dispositive, so don't get too worked up - it's just what I took away from a very long conversation with a candid AD.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  13 Dec 2011, 20:50
1
KUDOS
#2 has been a hot topic the last couple years on this board. I can speak honestly that every school views the rankings differently. There are some that it is really really important. There are others that don't even look at it until after an admission decision is made (and they mean it). And there are others where it's only a single data point in the total application, but is not over weighted. The key is to know the schools you're applying to really well and what they value.

If I reverse the logic that admissions and fellowships are most likely to occur the higher up on your list, my ranking was backwards then because my lower rank schools were the most interested on both accounts. I say all this to conclude that there is very little you can do to game the system because at the end of the day, what matters most is who you are, what you offer, and how you stack up against the other people applying to the school (which you really don't know). Too much strategy/time/effort in your rankings hits a point of diminishing returns REALLY REALLY fast.

Just my 2 cents.

With any luck this will turn into an respectful debate on ranking strategy, thinking through the application process and assessing your candidacy.

Before I give my 7 cents I have to agree with the statement 'know your schools' and how they value your engagement and affection towards them. Also, if the Consortium fellowship aka the \$ is your numero uno priority then rank your schools according to where you think you can get the money. But if you are making your decision on the school you love, keep reading...

I'm one of these naive people who believe over synthesizing your ranking strategy and trying to outsmart adcom's will likely backfire. If you are confident your candidacy will stack up to your peers why wouldn't you rank your schools in accordance to where you want to go??? Many of us have it on 'good authority' from students, AD's, alumni and professors what to and what not to do -- but ask yourself; how much 'good authority' is enough for you to make an informed choice as an individual candidate -- just think about it. At the end of the day you have to live with the school you end up at; what if you ranked school B number two but they were really number five? Will you be satisfied ending up near your bottom? That said I think there are two factors (yes, another unsolicited opinion) that should drive everyone's choice of where to apply:

1. Where do YOU want to go to school?
2. Are you confident that you have a compelling candidacy that is (not perfect) but competitive?

This year we introduced statistical tools that can help (not define) assess your candidacy with 3 data points. ~Shoutout to #bb, #johnnygmat and #method for helping spearhead this~ But there are other components you all need to consider before making an ad hoc decision based solely upon GMAT, GPA and WE.

My final point, and I find this particularly troublesome, is that every now and again a seemingly reputable source could throw candidates for a tailspin who really want to go to School A, but instead Rank School D number one and will always wonder, "What if?" Don't fall into this trap. The only reputable source at the end of the day is the candidate and their honest assessment of their candidacy -- they tell the story of who you are -- not the adcom -- and not a gmatclub member.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  15 Dec 2011, 04:43
1
KUDOS
Outlaw and Senator, you make very good points and I encourage you to take a closer look at the implications of my post because it's not inconsistent with anything you're saying. It's impossible to accurately generalize about all schools in the Consortium because of the different priorities that schools have in admissions. But you're making a big mistake if you don't try maximize your potential as an applicant by taking into account all available information. I provided some general information, which like all general information, is inapplicable in certain circumstances. I intentionally didn't make any recommendations about how to rank schools; I suggested only that the higher you rank a school, the better your chances of acceptance and a fellowship as to that particular school. That is to say only that holding all else equal your chances of getting in and getting a fellowship at X school are better if you rank them 1 than if you rank them 5. If we're talking logic, the upshot of that isn't that you're more likely to get admission and fellowships at your higher ranked schools than at your lower ranked schools. Nor is it that you have no chance at schools you rank lower. Thank you guys for pointing out potential misinterpretations and good luck to you both.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  15 Dec 2011, 15:09
1
KUDOS
Expert's post
New stats & tables added to the first post.

THANK YOU TheSenator for your initiative and direction!

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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  20 Dec 2011, 10:11
1
KUDOS
Nessy26X wrote:
Anyone hear from Darden yet? It seems calls started going out very early this morning.

Nope, eagerly awaiting! Tomorrow is the official date but I guess from prior years it was common for people to get called the day ahead of time (sometimes by a current student). Good luck everyone!!
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  21 Dec 2011, 08:26
1
KUDOS
TheSenator wrote:
Yesterday was mixed with lots of emotions and humbling realities... In the end, I keep telling myself it will all be worth it... and when it's done I'll look back and laugh at myself for the basket case of emotions I was.

Or will I?

At the risk of sounding soapboxy/cliche, your post recalled in me a story I read about MLK. It comes from a biography written by Harvard Sitkoff, and it centers on the Montgomery Bus boycott. King was essentially the new preacher in town and nominated by the community on the first day of the boycott to lead the Montgomery Improvement Association (MIA), which would continue the protest against the city's bus segregation -- a rather dangerous position. According to Rosa Parks, King was selected because he hadn't been there long enough to build up any enemies, but according to the other preachers, if things went south then King had the least to lose and could leave to another city.

Some recall King saying that if he had given it more thought it he would have declined the nomination. On the first day's night, King was nearly overtaken with fear because he had to address a packed church. He felt inadequate and unsure of what to say, despite a long-built reputation for oratory greatness.

To close in short, the rest is history. The lesson I took away was that even this exceptionally rare leader, a man of great skill and presence, was humbled in the moment of greatness by the disorienting emotion of fear. But it is that exact presence of fear that is a signal we are challenging ourselves to do something beyond our known capabilities. It is a signal that we are in the right place.

Whether anyone gets into a business school or not, the truth is that we are pushing ourselves to evolve and take the next step of leadership. Most of us are daring to be great, and we're giving up the security of our known lives. I have no doubt that the process is giving us all pause to consider our lives and dreams, and this long, arduous journey will pay off -- whether we get in to our dream schools or not.

Like you, I have an ebb and flow of emotions, but again for me, I find comfort knowing that I'm pushing myself in new ways.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  21 Dec 2011, 17:28
1
KUDOS
Hey guys - Senator talked me into creating a profile.

I was waitlisted at Darden as well after interviewing Monday - think I may have met some of you guys. Senator, did you and I discuss Chris Paul by any chance? I received two waitlists as well this week (Darden and Wharton), frustrating stuff.

DJ - sorry to hear about Darden, if I met you Monday I'm surprised to hear the news because I was really impressed by the fellow interviewees.

Either way, wish you all the best and hoping to see some admits coming through soon. I'm going to try to throw in 1-2 more R2s. Hang in there everyone.

Ranked my schools:
1. Tuck
2. Yale
3. Haas
4. Darden
5. Stern
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  28 Dec 2011, 15:47
1
KUDOS
One thing I would add for all of you Round Two folks about margins and formatting... Utilize your real estate. Headers and footers are there for a reason. Also, paragraph spacing can be condensed from 12 pt. to 8 pt. You'd be surprised that you may be able to fit an extra line or two on the page.

gablaze, response has been good on my end. One waitlist so far but seems pretty common place for the particular school I'm talking about.

Posted from my mobile device
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  28 Dec 2011, 16:10
1
KUDOS
gablaze23 wrote:
To R1 applicants here: How did you do in your bottom-ranked schools? Did you get an admit?

I am so sorry but I cant help but really stress about the schools I ranked 5th and 6th.

I was waitlisted at my #5 (Tepper) and Interviewed awaiting decision at my #6 (Kelley). If I could do it all over again I would only apply to 3 or 4 through Consortium and apply to the other schools separately.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  04 Jan 2012, 07:30
1
KUDOS
treydingo wrote:
TheSenator wrote:
Trey,

Congrats on the submit! I can shed some light on your questions:

1) Consortium will release your application when all materials have been completed in their entirety. They usually do all of the applications at once so expect to get an e-mail from them about a week after you have submitted.

2) Depending on the schools you are applying to they will have different times when they confirm. Some schools will send receipt and an invite to interview all at the same time. From the schools you are applying to you should hear something within a two - three weeks of when you get the confirm e-mail from CGSM. Yale was very quick for me, Johnson sent me an invite to interview with their confirm. And I cannot speak to Stern.

Good luck with everything and don't worry to much if you don't hear anything right away.

Thanks! That really helps me out.

I just had one more question. Can you check the status of your mission recommendation like you can with the regular recommendations? Is there a way to see if they have submitted the recommendation or not?

Hey trey,

Hope this helps
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  05 Jan 2012, 06:34
1
KUDOS
Nessy26X wrote:
Anyone accepted at Johnson yet? How soon after the interview did you hear from them?

Rd 1 Consortium decisions will be made by a week from today, 1/12

Last edited by johnnyGMAT2k10 on 05 Jan 2012, 08:04, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  05 Jan 2012, 09:08
1
KUDOS
johnnyGMAT2k10 wrote:
I just got an email out of nowhere about accessing my Johnson Consortium application, and gave me login info that I already had. Did anyone else get this? Could this be a ding or just standard procedure?

Got the same e-mail. Perhaps they've wrapped up evaluation of our apps in prep for the onslaught of Round Two. I remember reading on last year's forum Tuck did something similar prior to releasing decisions.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  05 Jan 2012, 09:27
1
KUDOS
johnnyGMAT2k10 wrote:

No sir.

Submission Status: Submitted
Submitted Date: 1/1/2011 EST
Complete - Your application is complete for final review by the selection committee. We will post your final decision or send an update by 9 a.m. Eastern time on the published notification date for your round.

You can exhale now.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  05 Jan 2012, 09:43
1
KUDOS
johnnyGMAT2k10 wrote:
TheSenator wrote:
johnnyGMAT2k10 wrote:

No sir.

Submission Status: Submitted
Submitted Date: 1/1/2011 EST
Complete - Your application is complete for final review by the selection committee. We will post your final decision or send an update by 9 a.m. Eastern time on the published notification date for your round.

You can exhale now.

phew!

Thanks man!

Ha! Same thing happened to me, started to freak. As for the Darden decisions you mentioned, I noticed the same thing, I don't think I've heard of any CGSM round 1 takers, but there were plenty waitlisted. Maybe they're lumping them in with R2?
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 00:37
1
KUDOS
......AMENl!!!

well said Mbahopesful, you have me itching to throw on my black leather trench coat, shades, leather gloves, and pick my fro' back out with that one!!.....I 100% agree, I hope I wasn't coming across like the gmat was one of my major hot buttons, I just didn't think this forum was a realistic representation of the general CGSM pool... I've been looking at the consortium for about 8 years now... (yes I said 8 years, yes I'm old) since about 2003 and at the beginning 600 was the average gmat score of the group of individuals that I talked to who were accepted, and accepted to great schools... and I talked to a lot of people (close to 20)... and now people are ashamed to talk about their score if it is less than 700, but the candidates have not seemed any more or less impressive, some just dedicated larger chucks of their life to taking this test if they had those chunks to give......I still believe the balance of your package is most important.

My life is past the stage where I take heed of harnessed myopia at the pursuit of goal attainment... wish it wasn't, but hey, much like what Mbahopesful said.... I would hope adcoms don't neglect reading and at least trying to read the totality of my character and my potential impact on whether or not I know how to FOIL a f@#*ing equation in 2 mins or less.....

But even I may go back to the drawing board in terms of the gmat just incase of the dreaded waitlist

Last edited by suchdaddy on 06 Jan 2012, 09:52, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 09:31
1
KUDOS
Anyone get an interview invite from Anderson? Got an email last night 8:00pm EST.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 09:35
1
KUDOS
Mbahopesful wrote:
I’m not trying to take away from those that score extremely well on the GMAT. But if we’re all trying to really get back to the Consortium’s mission then lets put our money where our mouth’s are and stop buying into this obsession of extraordinarily high GMAT scores, that after a certain threshold no longer serve any evaluative purpose. Rather, the inflated scores’ sole purpose is to move the business school up in the rankings, while inadvertently keeping black and latino admissions down, because of their typically lower GMAT numbers.

I agree with much of this sentiment, particularly that top business schools rely too heavily on the flawed metric that is the GMAT. But there are a few issues here I want to weigh in on. While low GMAT scores do prevent some URM's from being admitted to top business schools, the numbers suggest that the bigger issue is that URM's do not apply to most top business schools in proportions that reflect our representation in the overall community. That is to say that while Blacks, for example, represent 10% of the US population, we account for a much smaller proportion of the applicant pool (and thus a smaller proportion of the student body). That phenomenon speaks, in part, to the socioeconomic barriers to entry to the corporate world that many of us faced and continue to face before we leave our jobs for the sheltered b-school world. It doesn't necessarily speak to an inadvertently racist agenda by the schools. Broadly speaking, we can't just look at the racial compositions of student bodies alone to draw inferences about the impact of admissions metrics on those compositions.

I say this because I find many b-schools to be progressive, even some famously racially homogenous business schools. We know through the Consortium's admissions statistics that schools will excuse below average GMAT's and GPA's in order to diversify their student bodies. We need to keep in mind from an educational standpoint that business school (and any graduate program, for that matter) is the end of the line and a college degree is a prerequisite for entry. Given that we graduate from college at a much lower percentage than other racial groups and are woefully underrepresented in the corporate world, it's no surprise that so few of us go to b-school. And again, that's before we even take the GMAT into consideration as a limiting factor.

Mbahopesful wrote:
...white and other non-minority applicants seem to think blacks, latinos, and females are getting into business schools by the droves with drastically lower GMAT scores because of affirmative action. This clearly isn’t the case, judging by the pitifully low numbers of UDR’s in business schools across the country.

It's sad that in 2012 we still face discrimination in higher education. But let's not make the mistake of ignoring all that organizations like the Consortium and its member schools have done for us. Despite our well-documented lower standardized test scores and GPA's we get considered for jobs and for b-school admissions where whites and asians with our metrics would instantly be denied. That creates a stigma against us, but it also opens doors that were once completely shut to our communities. Schools recognize that there are forces in the corporate world and in higher education working against us, so we get admitted in higher proportions (relative to the proportion of the applicant pool we comprise) than other races and ethnicities. The open secret here is that many schools actually admit us with PR in mind rather than our personal struggles, but that's a different discussion. My point is that applicants who dismiss our admission to top b-schools as affirmative action are often completely ignorant of racial discrimination in America. Basically, they're fools we need not suffer.

Last edited by Capital on 06 Jan 2012, 10:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 09:37
1
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btsl84 wrote:
Anyone get an interview invite from Anderson? Got an email last night 8:00pm EST.

Congrats! I got an interview invite from Anderson yesterday as well.
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 11:02
1
KUDOS
I submitted my application last night!
But not without a few scares
I could have turned it in a day earlier, but I had a free afternoon after work and felt that one more review would be good. And it definitely was,. I found a few errors and fixed them, but then I ran into some browser issues. By the time I had figured out the problem, switched browsers and submitted, it was 10:33pm MST, but my application said “Submitted: 1/6/2012 12:33am EST” which technically is the day after the deadline!
On top of that, my other apps sent me an immediate email that says my app was received, and usually the next morning I get one that says “we have received all your materials and are ready to review” but my inbox was empty all night AND the next morning…
After a restless night and stressful morning I hopped on this forum, found out that confirmations go out 1 week later, and the deadline is PST not EST and I was instantly at ease, so thank you everyone for you reassurance. I’m not the kind of person to stress about admission decisions, those are just out of my control, but I AM the kind of person to regret messing up my future by being 33 minutes late, especially with all the effort I put into that application and the essays. Finally I can relax

So thanks again everyone for your reassuring information,

Also on the earlier mentioned question about GRE stats:
As for me I would appreciate it because I took the GRE instead of the GMAT. But if the stats only include my score, then they probably aren’t much help for anyone
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Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants! [#permalink]  06 Jan 2012, 11:05
1
KUDOS
as a side note:
I applied to Stern, Johnson, Yale, Tuck, Marshall and Tepper
and I took the revised GRE instead of the GMAT

ill post more stats too if anyone wants them
Re: Calling All Fall 2012 Consortium Applicants!   [#permalink] 06 Jan 2012, 11:05

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