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# Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for

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Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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27 Apr 2011, 22:26
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Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for the number of murders committed in this city. This fact points to the decreasing ability of our law enforcement system to prevent violent crime.

City Official: You overlook the fact that the city's population has risen steadily since 1970. In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970.

Which one of the following, if true, would most strongly counter the city official's response?

A. The incidence of fraud has greatly increased int he city since 1970.
B. The rate of murders in the city since 1970 decreased according to the age group of the victim, decreasing more for younger victims.
C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.
D. The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.
E. If the health care received by assault victims last year had been of the same quality as it was in 1970, the murder rate in the city last year would have turned out to be several times what it actually was.

I have trouble to understand the choice E, how does the quality of health care relate to the murder rate? Also, how does this choice counter the city official's argument?

Thanks,
[Reveal] Spoiler: OA

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27 Apr 2011, 23:41

A better health system clearly justifies fall in Death rate of murder victims and counters the City Official's argument well.
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28 Apr 2011, 23:27
E is a clear shot.
Just because of the health care services the number of murders are slightly lower,as sighted by the city official.Else, the numbers will be higher.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 03:05
I picked D
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 07:55
I also chose D, what's wrong with D, please explain.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 08:10
what's the difference between option C and E ? if option C is true, the rate would be bigger. i don't understand
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 11:30
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lucasITA wrote:
what's the difference between option C and E ? if option C is true, the rate would be bigger. i don't understand

Yes, C and E are pretty close; however

C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.

we cannot be sure that the rate will be bigger, we can say that is "likely" to be bigger; and moreover we do not know "how much" bigger.

But there is also another reason to pick E: E talks about murders only , C talks about murders and other violent crimes. So when we want to evaluate " In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970." E is better.

Hope I've explained myself well.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 12:27
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aryabhatta wrote:
I also chose D, what's wrong with D, please explain.

Hi aryabhatta

D says:
The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.

D only talks about the increase of the number of law officials. But we're talking about "rate of murders" and "population", not "rate of law official/population". Thus, it does not help to weaken/strengthen the city official's argument. In short, D is out of scope.

Hope it helps.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 12:40
Zarrolou wrote:
lucasITA wrote:
what's the difference between option C and E ? if option C is true, the rate would be bigger. i don't understand

Yes, C and E are pretty close; however

C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.

we cannot be sure that the rate will be bigger, we can say that is "likely" to be bigger; and moreover we do not know "how much" bigger.

But there is also another reason to pick E: E talks about murders only , C talks about murders and other violent crimes. So when we want to evaluate " In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970." E is better.

Hope I've explained myself well.

I've been thinking about this question, and i change opinion. I think option C is wrong, because only E offers an alternative explanation about the decline of the rate, in order to deny the "merit" of the police. On the contrary option C SUPPORTS the city official's statement. Am i wrong ?
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2013, 12:47
Expert's post
lucasITA wrote:
Zarrolou wrote:
lucasITA wrote:
what's the difference between option C and E ? if option C is true, the rate would be bigger. i don't understand

Yes, C and E are pretty close; however

C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.

we cannot be sure that the rate will be bigger, we can say that is "likely" to be bigger; and moreover we do not know "how much" bigger.

But there is also another reason to pick E: E talks about murders only , C talks about murders and other violent crimes. So when we want to evaluate " In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970." E is better.

Hope I've explained myself well.

I've been thinking about this question, and i change opinion. I think option C is wrong, because only E offers an alternative explanation about the decline of the rate, in order to deny the "merit" of the police. On the contrary option C SUPPORTS the city official's statement. Am i wrong ?

Hi LucasITA, I was just going to respond to you about that. Answer choice C says that things were much worse before, which is exactly what the city official is stating. Answer C is a strengthener of the city official. This is a 180° answer choice that can be confusing because of all the negation. However, logically, it says all the right things but points the needle in the wrong direction.

Thanks!
-Ron
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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03 Aug 2013, 01:53
aryabhatta wrote:
I also chose D, what's wrong with D, please explain.

The citizen in the argument talked about the ability of the officials but in D the number of them is concerned which is not the concern of the citizen. So D is out in my opinion. Correct me if I am wrong.

I want to do some clean up on C as well

Look, C said that the number of report increased. Although the reports increased but still the official argued that the murders decreased. So C is by the offical side. C fails.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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18 Aug 2013, 21:15
pqhai wrote:
aryabhatta wrote:
I also chose D, what's wrong with D, please explain.

Hi aryabhatta

D says:
The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.

D only talks about the increase of the number of law officials. But we're talking about "rate of murders" and "population", not "rate of law official/population". Thus, it does not help to weaken/strengthen the city official's argument. In short, D is out of scope.

Hope it helps.

Hi pghai,

Can you explain why is option C incorrect??

C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.

If Murders and Violent Crimes are more likely to be reported now, then we can assume that previously in 1970's, murders used to happen, but the reporting was not done. So that increases the no. of murders in 1970's, hence no. of murder/ 100 people increases in the past.

Now, this no. of murders/100 in 1970's > no. of murders /100 currently.

Thanks,
Jai
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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17 Jan 2015, 01:44
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Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for [#permalink]

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17 Jan 2015, 10:57
jaituteja wrote:
pqhai wrote:
aryabhatta wrote:
I also chose D, what's wrong with D, please explain.

Hi aryabhatta

D says:
The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.

D only talks about the increase of the number of law officials. But we're talking about "rate of murders" and "population", not "rate of law official/population". Thus, it does not help to weaken/strengthen the city official's argument. In short, D is out of scope.

Hope it helps.

Hi pghai,

Can you explain why is option C incorrect??

C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.

If Murders and Violent Crimes are more likely to be reported now, then we can assume that previously in 1970's, murders used to happen, but the reporting was not done. So that increases the no. of murders in 1970's, hence no. of murder/ 100 people increases in the past.

Now, this no. of murders/100 in 1970's > no. of murders /100 currently.

Thanks,
Jai

If more people report to police, they directly help police in decreasing the murder rate, reinforcing the city official claim. People become police's eyes and may help officials to avert murders resulting from violent crimes. On the other hand answer E says that police is no better than in the '70, but hospitals can take better care of assaulted victims, saving victim's lives at a greater rate leads to --> fewer deaths from murders --> Police Official's argument falls.

hope it helps,
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Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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07 Jun 2015, 23:15
Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for the number of murders committed in this city. This fact points to the decreasing ability of our law enforcement system to prevent violent crime.

City Official: You overlook the fact that the city's population has risen steadily since 1970. In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970.

Which one of the following, if true, would most strongly counter the city official's response?

A. The incidence of fraud has greatly increased int he city since 1970.
B. The rate of murders in the city since 1970 decreased according to the age group of the victim, decreasing more for younger victims.
C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.
D. The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.
E. If the health care received by assault victims last year had been of the same quality as it was in 1970, the murder rate in the city last year would have turned out to be several times what it actually was.
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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07 Jun 2015, 23:42
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Start from 30:38 to know detailed reasoning from the man himself, Brian Galvin
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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08 Jun 2015, 02:36
NightsKing wrote:
Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for the number of murders committed in this city. This fact points to the decreasing ability of our law enforcement system to prevent violent crime.

City Official: You overlook the fact that the city's population has risen steadily since 1970. In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970.

Which one of the following, if true, would most strongly counter the city official's response?

A. The incidence of fraud has greatly increased int he city since 1970.
B. The rate of murders in the city since 1970 decreased according to the age group of the victim, decreasing more for younger victims.
C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.
D. The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.
E. If the health care received by assault victims last year had been of the same quality as it was in 1970, the murder rate in the city last year would have turned out to be several times what it actually was.

This is duplicate of topic:
citizen-each-year-since-1970-a-new-record-has-been-set-for-112895.html
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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08 Jun 2015, 03:08
Harley1980 wrote:
NightsKing wrote:
Citizen: Each year since 1970, a new record has been set for the number of murders committed in this city. This fact points to the decreasing ability of our law enforcement system to prevent violent crime.

City Official: You overlook the fact that the city's population has risen steadily since 1970. In fact, the number of murder victims per 100 people has actually fallen slightly in the city since 1970.

Which one of the following, if true, would most strongly counter the city official's response?

A. The incidence of fraud has greatly increased int he city since 1970.
B. The rate of murders in the city since 1970 decreased according to the age group of the victim, decreasing more for younger victims.
C. Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970.
D. The number of law enforcement officials in the city has increased at a rate judged by city law enforcement experts to be sufficient to serve the city's increased population.
E. If the health care received by assault victims last year had been of the same quality as it was in 1970, the murder rate in the city last year would have turned out to be several times what it actually was.

This is duplicate of topic:
citizen-each-year-since-1970-a-new-record-has-been-set-for-112895.html

I understand that this is a repeat post. But I was not satisfied with the wrong answer explanations for this question, that is why I re-posted the same. I was confused between C and E. Chose C in the end.

I read in the official explanation that C is a strengthener of the city official's argument. Can anyone please explain how?
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Re: Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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08 Jun 2015, 03:15
Patronus wrote:

Start from 30:38 to know detailed reasoning from the man himself, Brian Galvin

Thanks man!! But can you tell me why C cannot be the answer?
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Citizen: Each year since 1970 [#permalink]

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08 Jun 2015, 03:17
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NightsKing wrote:
I understand that this is a repeat post. But I was not satisfied with the wrong answer explanations for this question, that is why I re-posted the same. I was confused between C and E. Chose C in the end.
I read in the official explanation that C is a strengthener of the city official's argument. Can anyone please explain how?

Hello NightsKing

Let's draw example:
in 1970 was 10 murders and 100 citizens - 10 murders per 100 citizens
in this year 100 murders and 10000 citizens - 1 murder on 100 citizens

So citizen is wrong because quantity of murders per 100 persons really dropped in 10 times.

And if we pick variant C which says that "Murders and other violent crimes are more likely to be reported now than they were in 1970."
we can infer that in 1970 was not 10 murders but 20 murders because 10 murders was unreported (for example).
So actually in 1970 per 100 citizens was not 10 but 20 murders, and position of official is became even stronger because rate of murders drop not in 10 but in 20 times.

Does that make sense?
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Citizen: Each year since 1970   [#permalink] 08 Jun 2015, 03:17

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