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FT-2009 rankings out

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FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 21:26
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LBS and Wharton joint #1 with HBS #3.

http://rankings.ft.com/businessschoolra ... a-rankings
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 22:17
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+1 Thanks for the post!

2009 FT Global MBA Ranking:

1 University of Pennsylvania: Wharton
1 London Business School
3 Harvard Business School
4 Columbia Business School
5 Insead
6 Stanford University GSB
6 IE Business School
8 Ceibs
9 MIT: Sloan
10 New York University: Stern
11 University of Chicago: Booth
12 Iese Business School
13 Dartmouth College: Tuck
14 IMD
15 Indian School of Business
16 Hong Kong UST Business School
17 University of Cambridge: Judge
18 Esade Business School
19 Yale School of Management
20 University of Oxford: Saïd
21 Northwestern University: Kellogg
22 Duke University: Fuqua
23 University of Michigan: Ross
24 Emory University: Goizueta
24 Nanyang Business School
26 Rotterdam School of Management, Erasmus University
27 Lancaster University Management School
27 University of Virginia: Darden
29 HEC Paris
29 UCLA: Anderson
31 University of California at Berkeley: Haas
32 Manchester Business School
32 Australian School of Business
34 Cornell University: Johnson
35 National University of Singapore School of Business
35 Cranfield School of Management
37 Warwick Business School
38 SDA Bocconi
39 Imperial College Business School
40 Georgetown University: McDonough

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WOOHOO YALE IS #19!!! Higher than Ross and Kellogg! :P

Also, this is the article/logic related to the new ranking:

London Business School tops FT's MBA tables for first time

By Della Bradshaw and Michael Jacobs

Published: January 26 2009 02:00 | Last updated: January 26 2009 02:00

A European business school has topped the table and a Chinese institution has been placed in the top 10 for the first time since the Financial Times began its rankings of MBA programmes a decade ago.

London Business School is ranked in the number one slot jointly with the Wharton school at the University of Pennsylvania. Previously only two US schools, Wharton and Harvard business school, have held the number one slot.

The FT MBA 2009 ranking also charts the rise of the Asian business schools. Shanghai-based China European International Business School (Ceibs) was ranked number eight, becoming the first Chinese business school to make the top 10.

Three Asian schools, two in China and one in India, feature in the top 20. This does not include Insead, the French institution ranked five, which has a campus in Singapore as well as in France. London Business School has been ranked among the top in the world since the inaugural FT rankings began in 1999, when it was placed eighth. Since then, the UK school has climbed slowly up the table, ranking second last year.

As well as having the number one-ranked full-time MBA programme, LBS also tops the FT Executive MBA rankings with the EMBA Global programme that it runs jointly with Columbia Business School in New York. EMBA programmes are designed for working managers.

The ranking of the top 100 full-time MBA programmes is dominated by American business schools, with 56 of the 100 based in the US.

Yet the FT rankings have also over time reflected the growth in high-quality MBA programmes outside the US, first in Europe and more recently in China, India and Singapore. In 1999, 17 of the top 20 schools and 31 of the top 50 were from the US, while in 2009 there are only nine US schools in the top 20 and 23 in the top 50.

Many Asian students are preferring to study for MBAs in their own country. They are being well rewarded. Salary data collected for the rankings show that Chinese students who study in China receive comparable salaries to those who go to a US or European business school. Indian students who study in India and then work in India after they graduate receive the highest salary increase of all Indian students. Their pay outranked that of their peers who complete MBA courses in Europe or the US.

US graduate schools have suffered due to tightened visa restrictions, although a change of policy has since shortened processing times and led to a rebound in applications. But 65 per cent of US graduate schools still reported fewer international applicants last year than in 2003, according to the Council of Graduate Schools.

The FT MBA ranking 2009 was compiled from data supplied by 9,000 business school alumni working in 130 countries.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ab071268-eb49 ... fd2ac.html

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 22:23
But ranked lower than Indian School of Business.....

ninkorn wrote:
WOOHOO YALE IS #19!!! Higher than Ross and Kellogg! :P[/size] [/color]
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 22:30
ninkorn wrote:
The FT MBA ranking 2009 was compiled from data supplied by 9,000 business school alumni working in 130 countries.


Very interesting ranking......they rank schools based on data submitted by bschool alumni????

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 22:50
LBS and Insead above Stanford? Very suspect indeed!
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 23:17
Everyone knows that FT ranking is meaningless. Cmon, its all messed up! I dont even know where to start. Should I complain abt Kellogg being ranked outside the top 20 or abt ISB and Ceibs being ranked that high. this ranking is total BS....and we were complaing abt BW rankings. :-D
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 23:37
Like any other rankings out there, the FT is not perfect. However, it is the only ranking that tries to genuinely compare international programs with each other. Whether it uses the correct criterion for making that call is anybody's guess but I do appreciate their effort. I for one would like international programs such as LBS, INSEAD, Oxford, Cambridge, AGSM (now Renamed Australian School of Business) in one consolidated ranking to see where they stand.
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 02:42
If we sort the data for US schools ..heres how it look

1) Wharton, 2) HBS, 3) Columbia, 4) Stanford, 5) MIT, 6) NYU, 7) Chicago, 8) Dartmouth, 9) Yale, 10) Northwestern, 11) Duke, 12) Michigan, 13) Emory, 14) Virginia, 15) UCLA, 16) Berkeley, 17) Cornell, 18) Georgetown, 19) Arizona, 20) Maryland, 21) North Carolina, 22) Rochester, 23) Texas, 24) Carnegie Mellon, 25) Rice
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 03:30
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bsd_lover wrote:
it is the only ranking that tries to genuinely compare international programs with each other.


Don't forget the Economist also does MBA rankings:

http://mba.eiu.com/index.asp?layout=2008rankings

Although these seem to have no correlation to the FT rankings, since the Top 5 according to the Economist (2008) are:

1. IMD
2. IESE
3. Chicago Booth
4. Stanford
5. Tuck

And sorry ninkorn, in this case Yale (#30) is below Kellogg (#16) and Ross (#22).

At the end of the day, we can chalk up any rankings under the category of "lies, damn lies and statistics." They're all somewhat subjective and use different criteria. What really matters in terms of reputation is the school's reputation among future potential employers in the industry and geography you're interested in.

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 03:42
NJMike wrote:
What really matters in terms of reputation is the school's reputation among future potential employers in the industry and geography you're interested in.


That about sums it up.

The company I work for (big pharma) actually recruits from Michigan State and University of Minnesota, but not from Harvard or Stanford.

Figure that one out.

RF

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 03:59
One of the biggest flaws with the FT methodology is its emphasis on what it calls the "weighted salary." There was an extremely good write about it last year here : http://onwardtomba.blogspot.com/2008/02 ... nking.html

This kinda explains schools such as CEIBS and ISB making their appearance in the top 20. The writer, like me, also appreciates how FT makes its ranking criteria transparent.
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 05:13
I wonder when they took the PPP for this. It could be that if they took it any time up to September, that London salaries, in dollars, are inflated by a magnitude of about 40% to what they currently are.

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 06:23
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There is column which says "Alumni Recommend Rank" - Business schools from which alumni would recruit MBA graduates.

Ranking as per this column is :

1. HBS
2. Wharton
3. Stanford
4. Kellogg
5. LBS
6. INSEAD
7. Chicago
8. Columbia
9. MIT
10. NYU
11. Tuck
12. Haas
13. Ross
14. Duke
15. Darden
16. IMD
17. UCLA - Anderson
18. IESE
19. Rotman
20. Ivey

Does the ranking make more sense now?
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 06:33
The LBS data was last audited in 2004, maybe that's a reason the weighted salaries are a bit higher?

3underscore wrote:
I wonder when they took the PPP for this. It could be that if they took it any time up to September, that London salaries, in dollars, are inflated by a magnitude of about 40% to what they currently are.


And I don't consider considering "weighted salary" to be a flaw at all in a ranking that tries to compare schools across the globe. Cost of living simply has to be adjusted for to make comparisons consistent.

Finally, for everyone who's saying "ranking X sucks!" simply because it doesn't hold up to popular perception, why not point out exactly what the flaw in the ranking's methodology is? There is some great data in the FT ranking, and comparing schools based on "Aims Achieved", "Placements" and "Employment" should give one a good picture of how satisfied the surveyed alumni were with their overall academic experience and how much the school helped them in their job search.

Oh and here is last year's FT ranking thread. We go through the same arguments every year it seems. :roll:
http://gmatclub.com/forum/103-t59175?sk=t&sd=a
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 06:53
solaris1 wrote:
And I don't consider considering "weighted salary" to be a flaw at all in a ranking that tries to compare schools across the globe.


Only flaw I could see is if the salary data provided by the US schools uses FX rates to convert salaries for foreign jobs to USD, while the FT translates salaries for non-US schools into USD using PPP. I'm not familiar enough with the data to know if this is the case.

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 07:06
Bit of a non sequitur, but when does the latest version of US News come out? March?
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 07:18
abhyudaya wrote:
There is column which says "Alumni Recommend Rank" - Business schools from which alumni would recruit MBA graduates.

Ranking as per this column is :

1. HBS
2. Wharton
3. Stanford
4. Kellogg
5. LBS
6. INSEAD
7. Chicago
8. Columbia
9. MIT
10. NYU
11. Tuck
12. Haas
13. Ross
14. Duke
15. Darden
16. IMD
17. UCLA - Anderson
18. IESE
19. Rotman
20. Ivey

Does the ranking make more sense now?


This is probably what the rankings would have looked like had they been published by USNews.
I would love to see IMD in top 10/12. I think 16 is a little too low. :)
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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 08:20
Interesting for me is IE, usually in Europe people rank IESE much higher, even in Spain.

There are 4 schools outside US among the Top 10, 3 from Europe and one from Asia. Among top 20 than it's 50%, impressive number, and that may be showing how schools outside the US are really improving their recognition.

I don't like seeing Chicago going down in this ranking, but I would not say that it is meaningless because of that, all schools at the Top are indeed excellent institutions.

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 08:22
NJMike wrote:
solaris1 wrote:
And I don't consider considering "weighted salary" to be a flaw at all in a ranking that tries to compare schools across the globe.


Only flaw I could see is if the salary data provided by the US schools uses FX rates to convert salaries for foreign jobs to USD, while the FT translates salaries for non-US schools into USD using PPP. I'm not familiar enough with the data to know if this is the case.


Perhaps even for US schools, earning 100K in Chicago is different than doing so in NYC for instance, isn't it? But then we are making their model much more complex :lol:

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 08:50
My wife and I were seriously debating location post grad. 100k in Houston is roughly equal to 200k in San Fran or NYC. The companies pay the same for both locations but you can save a lot more money for a few years by going to a cheap area to live. Its not a bad idea especially since its almost inevitable that you will be moving if you are in industry or are leaving IB or MC after a few years. Some companies will pay you lower than others but they are located in areas where the cost of living is dirt cheap compared to others.

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Re: FT-2009 rankings out   [#permalink] 26 Jan 2009, 08:50
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