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Intern
Joined: 19 Jul 2008
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Is the good idea to mention school's grade nondisclosure policy as one of the reason for applying to that school? I was thinking something on these lines ' XXX's grade nondisclosure policy helps foster cooperation rather than competition.' Does this do any good to application?

thanks
Director
Joined: 20 Feb 2008
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I wouldn't mention it. You probably want to stay away from saying anything about not wanting competition. May make you seem lazy and not willing to work hard. Of course it may not, but why take the chance? I certainly won't help you make a case for admittance.
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dagrobo wrote:
Is the good idea to mention school's grade nondisclosure policy as one of the reason for applying to that school? I was thinking something on these lines ' XXX's grade nondisclosure policy helps foster cooperation rather than competition.' Does this do any good to application?

thanks

Personally, I would probably stay away from this. While it might be true, I don't think you want to open the door to let the school possibly think you're overly nervous about grades. And at some schools, grade non-disclosure policies are periodically reviewed and voted on by the students, so it might not necessarily be in force in coming years. But that's just my opinion.
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if you're talking about Wharton, i wouldn't recommend mentioning it. the professors and administrators don't seem to necessarily like the policy that much.

RVD.
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dagrobo wrote:
Is the good idea to mention school's grade nondisclosure policy as one of the reason for applying to that school? I was thinking something on these lines ' XXX's grade nondisclosure policy helps foster cooperation rather than competition.' Does this do any good to application?

thanks

I would stay away - even at the Chicago GSB reception i went to, opinion was divided about this policy. I'm sure there are other more compelling reasons you want to go to that school
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I think the majority of bschools practice GND; so you're probably better off not mentioning it.
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ac8706 wrote:
dagrobo wrote:
Is the good idea to mention school's grade nondisclosure policy as one of the reason for applying to that school? I was thinking something on these lines ' XXX's grade nondisclosure policy helps foster cooperation rather than competition.' Does this do any good to application?

thanks

I would stay away - even at the Chicago GSB reception i went to, opinion was divided about this policy. I'm sure there are other more compelling reasons you want to go to that school

Really?

Last year I think THREE people voted to overturn it.
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You can talk about how much you like the team aspect of a school and the way it values teamwork and the ability to work together without mentioning the GND and certainly without mentioning anything about competition.

These are the types of things that get very qualified people dinged each year.
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Joined: 10 Apr 2007
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GSB students pimped their GND policy as being a big reason its not highly competitve there. Ironically, they do seem to have that reputation with people who don't attend the school. An adcom even stated that during an event I went to.
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rhyme wrote:
ac8706 wrote:
dagrobo wrote:
Is the good idea to mention school's grade nondisclosure policy as one of the reason for applying to that school? I was thinking something on these lines ' XXX's grade nondisclosure policy helps foster cooperation rather than competition.' Does this do any good to application?

thanks

I would stay away - even at the Chicago GSB reception i went to, opinion was divided about this policy. I'm sure there are other more compelling reasons you want to go to that school

Really?

Last year I think THREE people voted to overturn it.

Yea I was suprised too - 2 of 4 current students I spoke with said they loved the policy, how it allowed them to be adventurous in taking classes, etc. 1 said that he didn't like how he couldn't show his grades b/c he'd done so well. 1 said that he thought it was a cop-out for some of the students and didn't like it.
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I don't know what the big deal is, almost everyone gets a "High Pass" in schools with no GND anyway. Only the real gunners go after the "Honors." Everyone I've spoken to at CBS (one of the schools with no GND), has insisted that mostly "High Passes" with a couple of "Passes" and one odd "Low Pass" thrown in is no big deal for 90% of recruiters.

No one ever fails unless they make a conscious decision to reject every form of help the school offers. Virtually everyone (with the "right" attitude) in their second year goes for the easy classes anyway.

I personally feel GND takes away a bit of the academic discipline that I would expect in a graduate student. A collaborative community does not get built on grades or their lack thereof.
Director
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solaris1 wrote:
I personally feel GND takes away a bit of the academic discipline that I would expect in a graduate student.

I agree. While there was grade disclosure at my undergrad business school, I feel that the experience would have been better if my peers were more focused on classes and learning than on getting good jobs. I think, but I'm not sure, that GND can more easily lead students to blow off their academics and use the program as just a recruiting tool.
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rca215 wrote:
I think, but I'm not sure, that GND can more easily lead students to blow off their academics and use the program as just a recruiting tool.

Hmmmm . . .
Manager
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GND isn't necessarily a bad thing. As many mentioned here, it's great for collaboration and experimentation. You can take classes that you are very weak in without worry that a C will hurt you, etc.

But as most things in life, it can be abused. Some students skip a lot of classes, don't put much of an effort into studying, etc...because "I just have to pass"...

At Wharton, one of the responses to GNP is the LT (lowest 10%) policy. The bottom 10% of every class (except classes that are too small (e.g. under 25 or something like that)) is reported and if you get too many LTs, you're out of the program. But as other posters have said, it's still pretty hard to completely fail out of school. I think generally those students have other factors in their lives that are contributing to these problems (divorce, death in the family, etc.) In the first year you typically take around 13 classes and if you LT 5 of them you are out. If you LT 8 total over the 2 years, you are out.

I think in general, most students like the policy and most professors don't like the policy. There are also many opinions in the middle. It's safest to just stay away from talking about it.

RVD.
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Senior Manager
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kidderek wrote:
rca215 wrote:
I think, but I'm not sure, that GND can more easily lead students to blow off their academics and use the program as just a recruiting tool.

Hmmmm . . .

You think??

To be perfectly honest though, I'm much more interested in the people you meet, the speakers that come to school and the events than in the academics; I've studied most of this stuff in uni or in the CFA anyway. Hush hush.
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Audio wrote:
kidderek wrote:
rca215 wrote:
I think, but I'm not sure, that GND can more easily lead students to blow off their academics and use the program as just a recruiting tool.

Hmmmm . . .

You think??

To be perfectly honest though, I'm much more interested in the people you meet, the speakers that come to school and the events than in the academics; I've studied most of this stuff in uni or in the CFA anyway. Hush hush.

I (and most students) believe that the networking opportunities are just as important as learning the material.

In the microeconomics class that we just took in the EMBA program, there hadn't been a student who was an econ major in college get an A in the class. Last year that run was broken by one student.

Accounting is different...the students with CPA/CFA type experience (if you have the certification you generally waive out of accounting) seem to do pretty well.

The point is that I think the classes sometimes tend to be a little different at Wharton from the way the same topics were taught in the past.

RVD.
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Audio wrote:
kidderek wrote:
rca215 wrote:
I think, but I'm not sure, that GND can more easily lead students to blow off their academics and use the program as just a recruiting tool.

Hmmmm . . .

You think??

To be perfectly honest though, I'm much more interested in the people you meet, the speakers that come to school and the events than in the academics; I've studied most of this stuff in uni or in the CFA anyway. Hush hush.

I think schools with grade non-disclosure want to make sure that people who were not business majors and don't have feeder-type experiences have a chance to acclimate to business school live and still have a legitimate chance with recruiting. It's not only a chance for people to branch out and take challenging classes, it's also an opportunity for people to consider other career tracks. Otherwise, people might find it too risky to compete for certain jobs if they don't have favored backgrounds.

The flip side, of course, is that the true slackers will not be punished for slacking off; they'll be allowed to hang around and compete for jobs. Honestly, I think few people in business school really slack off. However, I think I would be a little sick to my stomach if someone slacked off (or couldn't keep up) in class big time and had the opportunity to compete for a job I really wanted.
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