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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
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Quote:
Danzig wrote

In the case in which the original sentence is illogical, here is an example:

Q: The court ruled that the plaintiff should pay full damages.
A. should
C. must
The correct answer is C because "should" means "moral obligation", something that a court cannot impose. So, in the cases in which the meaning of the original sentence is illogical or not clear, we must choose the choice that is logically and grammatically correct.


Notwithstanding whether a court’s task is to impose moral obligation or not, still, idiomatically both the given choices are inferior. This is a typically fit case for the use of command subjunctive since the court’s ruling is a command and it uses the connector – that - to express the command using the base form of the verb pay. The most correct choice will be:

The court ruled that the plaintiff pay full damages
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
the first posting is correct , I think

on gmat sc, we face at leat 2 remaining choices which are correct grammatically. one of them will has meaning problem and is eliminated.

there is 3 cases.
- the meaning is not logic
- the meaning is further from the meaning of the original choice
- the meaining is in wordier expresstion.

gmat favor the second case. the second case offer the logic and grammatical meaning but is wrong because there is another choice which is also logic and grammatical but is closer to the meaning of the original. in many cases the meaning difference between the two is subtle, for example

the following is from og 13,

Nearly two tons of nuclear-reactor fuel have already been put into orbit around the Earth, and the chances of a collision involving such material increase greatly as the amount of both space debris and satellites continue to rise.

(A) as the amount of both space debris and satellites continue to rise

(B) as the rise continues in both the amount of satellites and space debris

(C) as the amount of space debris and the number of satellites continue to rise

(D) with the continually increasing amount of space debris and the number of satellites

(E) with the amount of space debris continuing to increase along with the number of satellites

"with pharse" in D provides context for main clause.
"as" in C shows the simultaneousness

meaning in D is different from in C and D is considered distorted meaning

experts, pls help comment. is my thinking correct?
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
I think the intended meaning here is to give the reasoning for certain prediction using the conjunction "As". The use of "with" here gives impression that given events are the independent events that are occurring simultaneously, and hence fails to establish the causal relationship. Use of "as" is more appropriate here.

Choice (C) depicts the required reasoning and establishes the relationship between two events:
(cause) As the amount of space debris and the number of satellites continue to rise -> (effect) the chances of a collision involving such material increase greatly.

PS: Grammatically "with" can only act as a Preposition. It cannot be used as a conjunction.

Originally posted by PrashantPonde on 30 Dec 2012, 02:47.
Last edited by PrashantPonde on 30 Dec 2012, 03:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
Hi, I have a question about the approach. I'm not a native english and my biggest problem in SC is understand the meaning of the sentence (in particular with long sentence with three or more clause). I have already read MGMAT but as carcass as already said it doesn't cover the meaning of the sentence.
What book explain the meaning in a clear way? How I can improve my ability to understand the meaning? online course such as e-gmat can help me in this way?
Thank you!!
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
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thangvietnam wrote:
the first posting is correct , I think

on gmat sc, we face at least 2 remaining choices which are correct grammatically. one of them will has meaning problem and is eliminated.
there is 3 cases.
- the meaning is not logic
- the meaning is further from the meaning of the original choice
- the meaning is in wordier expression.

gmat favor the second case. the second case offer the logic and grammatical meaning but is wrong because there is another choice which is also logic and grammatical but is closer to the meaning of the original. in many cases the meaning difference between the two is subtle, for example

This entire thread is getting punch-drunk happy on the question on "meaning". Folks are blowing this way out of proportion. In more than 95% of all GMAT SC, four of the answer choices are clearly either grammatically incorrect or stylistically atrocious. Once you recognize the GMAT's standards, four of the five answers always have something absolutely clear wrong with them. As I said in the above post, almost the only time "meaning" comes into play is in sentences that, following incorrect colloquial patterns, choose an illogical construction, and we need to reframe that idea in a logical clear way.
thangvietnam wrote:
Nearly two tons of nuclear-reactor fuel have already been put into orbit around the Earth, and the chances of a collision involving such material increase greatly as the amount of both space debris and satellites continue to rise.
(A) as the amount of both space debris and satellites continue to rise
(B) as the rise continues in both the amount of satellites and space debris
(C) as the amount of space debris and the number of satellites continue to rise
(D) with the continually increasing amount of space debris and the number of satellites
(E) with the amount of space debris continuing to increase along with the number of satellites


"with pharse" in D provides context for main clause. "as" in C shows the simultaneousness. meaning in D is different from in C and D is considered distorted meaning
experts, pls help comment. is my thinking correct?

No, in short you are thinking way too much about the issue of "meaning," and it is not relevant in this question. Four of the answers are 100% incorrect, and only one is grammatically correct. It's that black and white. No need to think about "meaning" at all.

Issue #1 -- space debris is uncountable, so we need "amount of space debris", but satellites are countable, so we need "number of satellites". (A) & (B) botch this up.

Issue #2 -- the word "as" is a bonafide subordinate conjunction, which means it can introduce a full-fledged subordinate clause. The word "with" is a preposition. A preposition has simply a noun as its object --- yes, the noun can have a modifier, but the GMAT frowns on the construction:
[preposition][noun][participial phrase]
This is simply trying to cram too much action into a prepositional phrase --- prepositions were not designed for that. If you want to describe full-fledged [noun]+[verb] action, then you need to put that in a subordinate clause, not a prepositional phrase. That's why (D) & (E) are wrong.

Thus, (C) is the only answer free of grammatical mistake. We don't need to consider meaning at all. Focus more on grammar, less on meaning. If you simply focus on the logical consistency of sentences, that most of the "meaning" you will need right there.

BTW, "simultaneousness" is not a word. The noun form of "simultaneous" is "simultaneity."

Does all this make sense?
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
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IanSolo wrote:
Hi, I have a question about the approach. I'm not a native english and my biggest problem in SC is understand the meaning of the sentence (in particular with long sentence with three or more clause). I have already read MGMAT but as carcass as already said it doesn't cover the meaning of the sentence.
What book explain the meaning in a clear way? How I can improve my ability to understand the meaning? online course such as e-gmat can help me in this way?
Thank you!!

Dear Ian,
The folks at MGMAT are awfully bright, and they don't focus on "meaning" in SC precisely because it's not a big deal. You could totally ignore the issue and still do fine on the GMAT SC. Most of the problems with "meaning" have to do with illogical ways of constructing sentences --- for example, in comparisons, you have to compare like to like. A typically mistake construction would be something like:
"Unlike the major cities of Europe, the United States has several cities that ..."
Notice, this sentence, as it now stands, compares "cities" to a country ---- that's illogical, and clearly not what the writer is trying to do. Logically, we need to compare either cities to cities, or regions to regions. Either of the following could be acceptable
cities to cities: "Unlike the major cities of Europe, most cities in the US have ...."
region to region: "Unlike Europe, where most of the major cities are X, the US has many cities that ..."
I'm sure MGMAT talks about that in comparisons, but understandably doesn't bother throwing around the unnecessary word "meaning" when discussing it.

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
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We have done a very comprehensive analysis on meaning and meaning change. In fact, we identified this shift in 2010 with the release of OG 12. Consequently, we added over 50 questions (out of 550) in the e-GMAT SC course that test this concept. Below is a list of strategies that GMAT uses to change/distort meaning.



We have written a 50 page article that outlines these strategies.

5-strategies-that-gmat-uses-to-distort-meaning-124296.html

There are over 10 exercise questions linked to this article that you may try.

Also try the corresponding concepts in the e-GMAT free trial. Click below to register

https://www.e-gmat.com/secure/register_gc.php

Regards,

Rajat Sadana
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Re: Meaning - Approach and methodology [#permalink]
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