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INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate!

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INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 18 Dec 2012, 19:30
Hi Guys, I have been offered admission for both Yale SOM and INSEAD.

Wanted to get some thoughts. I am coming from an engineering background and work experience. Post MBA, I am a bit torn between investment management and strategy consulting, so a 2YR MBA is preferable in that sense. Geographic locations are not a restriction, I am open to the possibilities.

Would appreciate any advise.

Thanks!
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 18 Dec 2012, 20:40
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Given INSEAD’s extremely high placement rate into top management consulting companies (albeit, many are returning consultants), I think it would be an easier choice if you want to work in Europe.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 18 Dec 2012, 21:13
I would vote for Yale. You don't have a consulting background, hence an internship - and a full internship not the one for a couple of Weeks which is the only one you can manage if at INSEAD - will serve you good. Further, if you look carefully at INSEAD's consulting success, the numbers are not represented accurately. A good percentage of those getting 'placed' at McKinsey, Bain and BCG are actually employees who are returning to their employer. So don't get swayed or overawed by INSEAD's success in that area as the real placed number will be 40 odd percent lower. Which still is a good result.

Yale is a terrific brand to have on your resume and it will definitely get you a foot in the door while applying for internships.

All the best.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 01:13
INSEAD is better for consulting overall, but a lot of the MBB placements are those who are being sponsored by their companies. Because it's a one-year program, it's simply not ideal for career switchers such as yourself. However, if you're interested in working in Europe it's a huge name brand.

Yale SOM is a mixed bag as well. The overall university name brand is obviously fantastic, but SOM is a young program and still weak in terms of reputation, prestige, recruiting, and alumni network. Ultimately, those are the stuff you are paying for when you get an MBA.

To be honest, this is a tough call. I would make sure to visit Yale if you haven't done so already, and talk extensively to current students who are doing consulting. MBB becomes VERY hard to get outside of the M7 due to limited interview slots at the other schools. Investment management is even worse; it's one of the most competitive industries to get into coming out of b-school. And to be honest, if you're not at a M7 program, it's just not gonna happen for you. If you are open to doing consulting at any respectable firm, do Yale. For IM though, you may want to wait another year and re-apply to the M7 because that's pretty much your only hope of getting it.

Last edited by Shawshank on 19 Dec 2012, 01:42, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 01:38
congratulations on the awesome admits. Both are huge brand names.

If it were between MC and IB it would have been much easier to decide. (choices should have been INSEAD and Yale respectively)

I researched a bit on Yale's MC placements: they are not top notch. Simply put, MBB does not hire in huge numbers (in fact very few) - if that is your goal. But, obviously Yale has pretty good finance placements (proximity to NY).

str1der is right, in that a lot of people join back their old firms (from INSEAD) and hence the numbers are skewed. But, these org. do have a very strong footprint at INSEAD and hire well.

I'd say INSEAD (despite the fact you won't get to intern). I'm not a ranking ho but the difference between the two is huge to be overlooked completely.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 03:22
I think it really depends on where you would like to work. I have no clue on how it works in the rest of the world, but for top tier consulting in Europe, it is INSEAD by far.

I have worked at an M/B/B in Europe and we used to recruit a lot from INSEAD at MBA level. Also, if you were an analyst at my firm and wanted your MBA sponsored by the company, you could only apply to a select number of schools (based mainly on brand name). Yale was not in the list whereas INSEAD was.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 04:09
Thanks guys!

My thought process currently reflects many of the opinions already expressed here. I did visit Yale SOM and I thought it was fantastic, I really do think its a program on the rise with Dean Snyder and the new building coming up next year, and other exciting changes.

I also recognize that currently there is a HUGE gap between INSEAD and Yale in terms of prestige and consulting placements. It's just a bit tougher given my background and having to make the career switch.

What's the route to get into IM - other than just going to an M7? Does anyone have any idea of INSEAD's placement for IM, especially for career switchers - I would assume this would be difficult

Maybe I will flip a coin? :)
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 06:14
Hey thebschoollife,

Congrats on the admits!
I'm on the exact same boat as you.
Would you like to trade emails and compare notes? =)
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 08:43
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thebschoollife wrote:
Hi Guys, I have been offered admission for both Yale SOM and INSEAD.

Wanted to get some thoughts. I am coming from an engineering background and work experience. Post MBA, I am a bit torn between investment management and strategy consulting, so a 2YR MBA is preferable in that sense. Geographic locations are not a restriction, I am open to the possibilities.

Would appreciate any advise.

Thanks!


The issue is that you are between two completely different career paths. Because of that I would NOT suggest Insead. It is very intense and you would need to know from Day 1 what you want to get out the programme. Now, given that the only other option is Yale, if you want to get the most out this programme your career path should be investment management in the US. There! I figured out your school and career path :)
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 09:50
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thebschoollife wrote:
Thanks guys!

My thought process currently reflects many of the opinions already expressed here. I did visit Yale SOM and I thought it was fantastic, I really do think its a program on the rise with Dean Snyder and the new building coming up next year, and other exciting changes.

I also recognize that currently there is a HUGE gap between INSEAD and Yale in terms of prestige and consulting placements. It's just a bit tougher given my background and having to make the career switch.

What's the route to get into IM - other than just going to an M7? Does anyone have any idea of INSEAD's placement for IM, especially for career switchers - I would assume this would be difficult

Maybe I will flip a coin? :)


As a career changer, I'd highly recommend a 2 year program. Additionally, from my research, there really isn't anywhere that you can't go with Yale SOM. The recruiting numbers are actually quite strong relative to the program size, and with a large percentage of the class focusing on the social sector, you aren't competing with nearly as many candidates for those spots. Across most of the top sectors you find this to be true, speaking with Yale SOM students. Obviously, I've applied and been admitted to Yale SOM, so take the things I say knowing both that I've done my research and that I'm likely a bit biased.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 10:54
Ducksworth wrote:
The issue is that you are between two completely different career paths. Because of that I would NOT suggest Insead. It is very intense and you would need to know from Day 1 what you want to get out the programme. Now, given that the only other option is Yale, if you want to get the most out this programme your career path should be investment management in the US. There! I figured out your school and career path :)



nailed it! lol..
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 13:05
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thebschoollife wrote:
Thanks guys!

My thought process currently reflects many of the opinions already expressed here. I did visit Yale SOM and I thought it was fantastic, I really do think its a program on the rise with Dean Snyder and the new building coming up next year, and other exciting changes.

I also recognize that currently there is a HUGE gap between INSEAD and Yale in terms of prestige and consulting placements. It's just a bit tougher given my background and having to make the career switch.

What's the route to get into IM - other than just going to an M7? Does anyone have any idea of INSEAD's placement for IM, especially for career switchers - I would assume this would be difficult

Maybe I will flip a coin? :)



I'm glad you liked Yale. The overall yale university community is vibrant and energetic, the campus is beautiful, and new haven isn't that bad.

However, I think it's a bit risky to go there because of the new building, Dean Snyder, or the "upcoming" reputational surge. First of all, Yale has been supposedly on the rise for the past decade but is still a top 15 school at best. The problem goes far beyond what Dean Snyder can do, as awesome as he is. Yale SOM is one of the youngest b-schools out there, it has a small alumni base, and it's still not that respected amongst top recruiters. Aside from non-profit/public sector and some NYC IB jobs, I don't think it's a great bet. Based on your previous post, I actually think you should do INSEAD. I know last night I was equivocating, but after thinking about it with a clear head, it's INSEAD.

As for IM, it's very tough. If you don't have previous experience in IM, hedge funds, private equity, banking, or equity research, then you need M7 and preferably M7+at least CFA level I to have a shot. So yeah, sorry, but if you can't get M7 just focus on consulting. After consulting, however, especially if it's MBB, you can switch over to IM or even some hedge funds due to your pedigree and industry knowledge. So play the long game. Go to INSEAD, have a blast in France, get that MBB job in Europe, and then your resume will be incredible.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 13:25
I am in the same boat and was admitted at both schools. I also will apply to Wharton in R2 but have already to decide and to transfer the deposit for one of them really soon. I have worked for the last 3 years as an Analyst / Associate at BB IB and am looking now to get out of this industry.

In my opinion, Yale SOM has a great brand name, at least for the average Joe! I know, it is not the average Joe who is evaluating you. But I think that having a little bit of prestige is still amazing.

Insead is a great consulting school and the overall better MBA brand name.

I think that concerning recruiting ou can get anywhere from both schools, although breaking into MBB will be more difficult from Yale.

I am really desperate guys, which school I should choose!!!
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 15:56
I would take SOM if I wanted to (a) work in the US after school or (b) were planning to switch careers.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 19 Dec 2012, 16:06
In regards to working in Europe or Asia (Singapore, Dubai, etc), I know that INSEAD has great job placements - but how easy is it for Americans?

i.e. if you are non-European, etc - are the visa hurdles and such to jump through, making you less attractive to employers?
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 20 Dec 2012, 07:41
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thebschoollife wrote:
In regards to working in Europe or Asia (Singapore, Dubai, etc), I know that INSEAD has great job placements - but how easy is it for Americans?

i.e. if you are non-European, etc - are the visa hurdles and such to jump through, making you less attractive to employers?

To demystify the “M7” a bit. For IM, you need to have work experience and a strong network to get a job there, at least at a reputable firm. A school’s brand alone WILL NOT get you there, or at least, it will be VERY difficult, even if you go to HBS. For MC, M/B/B recruit actively at the ~ top 14ish schools. The placement will be stronger at offices closer to the school.

Much of the higher placement is due to people returning to the same industry/firm. Overall, it is MUCH easier to career switch into consulting than into IM.

I read somewhere that UK has a policy to expedite high potential talent's visa process. Graduate from INSEAD is listed as one of the school that is in the high potential pool. Not sure about EU as a whole. However, as someone mentioned, top MC and IM do not recruit heavily from YSOM, so landing at a good firm is low there as well (from an outsider’s perspective). Although INSEAD has many returning consultants, which skew their placement numbers, I am sure they place a good numbers of non-consultants into consulting. 26% of incoming class had MC experience, and 39% work in MC post-MBA. You also have to discount people who do not go back. MC firms get feedback from sponsored students on their classmates. Having classmates to pull for your is ALWAYS a good thing, especially if you are competing again other schools (IE, IESE, IMD, LBS, etc.).
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 21 Dec 2012, 09:27
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I did not go to one recruiting event, case competition or talk to a single person at MBB. I dropped my resume and have people contacting me and an interview at Bain 1/14. Calm down. I have interviews at 7 BB IB firms. A lot of misinformation about Yale being put out here. We may have less spots, but we have less people going after them as well.
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 26 Dec 2012, 13:38
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Thought my personal experience as a 1st year SOM student might be helpful.

What are we really talking about here? People seem to be questioning whether or not Yale SOM has the capacity, resources and prestige to get your foot in the door at a top consulting firm - right? So basically, what access do you get to MBB and what are the prospects of landing a 1st round interview - the rest is up to you.

First, MBB actively recruits on campus.

Second, our consulting club is top-notch and serious. It's currently led by 2nd years who did summer internships at MBB - and they truly go above and beyond for members. They take attendance, provide workshops and the classroom is generally filled to capacity - with a lot of people standing.

And as for being able to land that 1st interview - there are about ~35 of us 1st years interviewing with McKinsey next month (I can't speak to the others firms because I only applied to M). Remember, our class is only 250 students - with a larger % focused on non-traditional MBA jobs than typical b-schools.

I'm not posting to prove that Yale SOM is better than INSEAD or any other school, because it's not.

I'm posting because if you want to get into consulting, attending Yale SOM definitely won't preclude you from being able to reach that goal.

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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 26 Dec 2012, 17:59
PD2012 wrote:
Thought my personal experience as a 1st year SOM student might be helpful.

What are we really talking about here? People seem to be questioning whether or not Yale SOM has the capacity, resources and prestige to get your foot in the door at a top consulting firm - right? So basically, what access do you get to MBB and what are the prospects of landing a 1st round interview - the rest is up to you.

First, MBB actively recruits on campus.

Second, our consulting club is top-notch and serious. It's currently led by 2nd years who did summer internships at MBB - and they truly go above and beyond for members. They take attendance, provide workshops and the classroom is generally filled to capacity - with a lot of people standing.

And as for being able to land that 1st interview - there are about ~35 of us 1st years interviewing with McKinsey next month (I can't speak to the others firms because I only applied to M). Remember, our class is only 250 students - with a larger % focused on non-traditional MBA jobs than typical b-schools.

I'm not posting to prove that Yale SOM is better than INSEAD or any other school, because it's not.

I'm posting because if you want to get into consulting, attending Yale SOM definitely won't preclude you from being able to reach that goal.

-B



Any idea how Yale does in trading, investment management, hedge funds?
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Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate! [#permalink] New post 26 Dec 2012, 18:38
Great question!

Unfortunately, aside from classmates telling me about their interviews, I have 0 experience on that front.

Even though Super Week is right around the corner, hopefully another SOM'er (like MAJMMM) that's on that track can chime in to help.

-B

Shawshank wrote:

Any idea how Yale does in trading, investment management, hedge funds?
Re: INSEAD vs Yale SOM: Decide my fate!   [#permalink] 26 Dec 2012, 18:38
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