Find all School-related info fast with the new School-Specific MBA Forum

It is currently 30 Aug 2014, 14:55

Close

GMAT Club Daily Prep

Thank you for using the timer - this advanced tool can estimate your performance and suggest more practice questions. We have subscribed you to Daily Prep Questions via email.

Customized
for You

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History

Track
Your Progress

every week, we’ll send you an estimated GMAT score based on your performance

Practice
Pays

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History

Not interested in getting valuable practice questions and articles delivered to your email? No problem, unsubscribe here.

Events & Promotions

Events & Promotions in June
Open Detailed Calendar

Investment Banking Recruiting

  Question banks Downloads My Bookmarks Reviews Important topics  
Author Message
SVP
SVP
User avatar
Joined: 11 Mar 2008
Posts: 1634
Location: Southern California
Schools: Chicago (dinged), Tuck (November), Columbia (RD)
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 176 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 17 Jan 2009, 16:17
Great post and I agree with you 100%, djhouse81. +1. Historically (past several decades), GS and MS have been the most "prestigous", but the landscape has obviously changed and health of the business trumps brand name in today's environment.
_________________

Check out the new Career Forum
http://gmatclub.com/forum/133

SVP
SVP
User avatar
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 1560
Location: Ann Arbor
Schools: Ross '10
Followers: 12

Kudos [?]: 161 [0], given: 1

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 19 Jan 2009, 19:24
I honestly dont have the inside track on IB recruiting here at Ross, but a bird told me that although there were about 75 people pursuing IB jobs back in September, that number had dropped to 25 or 30 by the time the interviews came around in January. So, there seems to be a definite trend here, as far the drop in the number of people gunning for IB.
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 20 Jan 2009, 07:37
I will be 29 years old when I start the program at Booth. Therefore, I would be 31 years old when I start my post-MBA full-time position. Will I have any issues landing an internship or full-time associate position due to my age? I do have prior finance (structured finance deals, albeit from the accounting firm role: independently reproducing investment bank analytics) experience, if that helps them overlook my being 1-2 years older than some of my colleagues.
Director
Director
User avatar
Joined: 20 Feb 2008
Posts: 797
Location: Texas
Schools: Kellogg Class of 2011
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 145 [0], given: 9

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 20 Jan 2009, 08:31
MeddlingKid wrote:
I will be 29 years old when I start the program at Booth. Therefore, I would be 31 years old when I start my post-MBA full-time position. Will I have any issues landing an internship or full-time associate position due to my age? I do have prior finance (structured finance deals, albeit from the accounting firm role: independently reproducing investment bank analytics) experience, if that helps them overlook my being 1-2 years older than some of my colleagues.

I had been concerned with this as well Meddling, but from everything I've gathered, 31 is fine. 33-34 is a little more of a grey area, but I don't think we will have any trouble. Plus, I only look 25, so I'm good. :lol:
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 27 Feb 2008
Posts: 299
Schools: Kellogg Class of 2011
Followers: 3

Kudos [?]: 69 [0], given: 15

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 20 Jan 2009, 08:45
MeddlingKid wrote:
I will be 29 years old when I start the program at Booth. Therefore, I would be 31 years old when I start my post-MBA full-time position. Will I have any issues landing an internship or full-time associate position due to my age? I do have prior finance (structured finance deals, albeit from the accounting firm role: independently reproducing investment bank analytics) experience, if that helps them overlook my being 1-2 years older than some of my colleagues.


See pelihu's response in the following thread:

108-t62060
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 20 Jan 2009, 09:05
jb32 wrote:
MeddlingKid wrote:
I will be 29 years old when I start the program at Booth. Therefore, I would be 31 years old when I start my post-MBA full-time position. Will I have any issues landing an internship or full-time associate position due to my age? I do have prior finance (structured finance deals, albeit from the accounting firm role: independently reproducing investment bank analytics) experience, if that helps them overlook my being 1-2 years older than some of my colleagues.

I had been concerned with this as well Meddling, but from everything I've gathered, 31 is fine. 33-34 is a little more of a grey area, but I don't think we will have any trouble. Plus, I only look 25, so I'm good. :lol:


Dude, I wish I looked 25. Most people think I look about 20-21.
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 09:01
I have been reading some older threads on IB recruiting, and have a question for those of you who are currently going through the process. When the banks request your GMAT score, do they ask for the Q-V split as well? I'm not concerned about my overall score, but they may be concerned that my split was heavily weighted on the Verbal side. I worked in a fairly analytic group before MBA, and studied finance in college (albeit not at a 'feeder' school). I am shooting for the top BB banks. Will my GMAT split make it difficult for me to land an internship and/or FT position with the GS, MS and JPMs of the sector, or will they overlook it due to the rigor of the Booth curriculum?
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 496
Followers: 7

Kudos [?]: 69 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 12:16
MeddlingKid wrote:
I have been reading some older threads on IB recruiting, and have a question for those of you who are currently going through the process. When the banks request your GMAT score, do they ask for the Q-V split as well? I'm not concerned about my overall score, but they may be concerned that my split was heavily weighted on the Verbal side. I worked in a fairly analytic group before MBA, and studied finance in college (albeit not at a 'feeder' school). I am shooting for the top BB banks. Will my GMAT split make it difficult for me to land an internship and/or FT position with the GS, MS and JPMs of the sector, or will they overlook it due to the rigor of the Booth curriculum?


Not at all. You'll put your GMAT score and precentile on your resume, and once they see 700+ you're good to go. Depending on the bank, the job application might ask your SAT breakdown, but I was never asked my GMAT breakdown. With a 740, the top banks will check the GMAT score box and move on. Depending on your background, don't be surprised if McKinsey contacts you to encourage you to apply. At CBS, they went through the resume book and seemed to be attracted to unique backgrounds with high GMAT scores.

Your next question will be about your SAT score, right? A lot of banks ask for it on your application. It does not play a role as much as your GMAT score, but if you had a kickass SAT score it makes your more attractive...on paper. It IS NOT A DEAL BREAKER OR MAKER! Just think about these three examples: low SAT/low GMAT, low SAT/high GMAT, high SAT/high GMAT. The low/low will have more to prove in other areas, the low/high really has nothing to worry about, and the high/high is going to really impress the top banks. But there are so many other factors that go into recruiting that any of these score combinations is only going to get you so far. Pelihu's Guide to IB Recruiting really goes into those more important details.
7 KUDOS received
MBA Admissions Consulting
avatar
Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 2420
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Followers: 72

Kudos [?]: 526 [7] , given: 0

Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 15:20
7
This post received
KUDOS
To understand what bankers are *really* looking for, you have to understand the actual job itself and the group culture.

Four hallmarks of banking culture:

a) It's like a fraternity - it's a macho culture. They see themselves as reformed nerds-turned-alpha males (including the women). Note I said "they see themselves as..." and not "they are..." As such, they want people who they feel fit that image of the alpha dog, even if they aren't saying that out loud.

b) It's a sales culture. It's not a place for intellectual discourse. The dynamics are more similar to a locker room than a science lab (and the humor as well - see below). It's about applying your smarts to being #1. Money isn't just something you buy things with - it's a way of keeping score. Banks get ranked. You get ranked vs. other bankers. There is a pecking order of MDs even within the firms themselves.

c) There is a gallows humor that permeates virtually every office and bank. It's a cynical, jaded dry sense of humor. They may not be consciously looking for this in interviews, but they are in a way sensing if you are "one of them".

d) It's a way of life, not a job. You spend so much time in the office with the same people. They want to know that you're the kind of person who is reliable but just as important - someone who they won't strangle at 3am because you're an annoying dweeb. People's personalities tend to change the later you are in the office - and oftentimes the *real* person comes out when they're dead tired after 10pm and trying to get work done.

If you've ever done a fraternity rush, been in the military, or competed in a lot of team sports, you'll be in familiar territory for IB recruiting (except that they aren't asking you to drink vomit, but that instead you're being asked to do a Taylor Series expansion on the Black Scholes model - it's not necessarily if you get it 100% right, but whether you can get through it in one piece without sh*tting your pants). As a 1st year, you're the "rookie" so you're expected to shut up and do what's given to you and to speak only when spoken to sort of thing so no 'trying to act like an MD' by interjecting your ideas in a client meeting unless being asked to (and it's not uncommon for 2nd and 3rd year analysts to have more power than a 1st year associate with no IB experience). In fact, the analyst-associate dynamic is somewhat analogous to enlisted-officers in the military (in situations where a 1st year associate is staffed with an experienced analyst, the analyst is really driving the ship).

That's why banking interviews can feel a little juvenile at times or like a human cockfight, with the kinds of seemingly random questions they ask, as if they were grilling you.

They're not looking for the absolute smartest or the most knowledgeable finance dudes/gals (they will retrain you anyhow in "their way" of doing models). They are basically prodding and poking you to see if you're the right FIT. Any banker will tell you that the job hardly requires genius - just a reasonable level of everyday intelligence will do. From a technical standpoint, what you need to do in the job as a junior banker is simple:

a) you're willing to make it a life, not just a job (i.e. you'll suck it up if you get asked on Friday night to cancel your plans to do a pitch book). In other words, you're willing to stay in the office at all hours even if you have nothing to do. To be clear, they're not expecting you to enjoy it (and if you say you love doing pitch books for 80-100 hours a week, they will laugh in your face and call bullsh*t), but they're expecting you to suck it up.

b) you're thorough and detail oriented. This means a willingness to always double-check your work to minimize any errors - your Excel links are referencing the right cells, your document formatting is consistent, you keep the deal docs organized, and you are making sure the analysts are doing the same.

The rest is all about personality and presentation (how you present yourself in terms of your clothing, physicality, etc.).
_________________

Alex Chu
alex@mbaapply.com
http://www.mbaapply.com
Follow me on Facebook


Last edited by AlexMBAApply on 24 Jan 2009, 15:27, edited 1 time in total.
1 KUDOS received
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [1] , given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 15:26
1
This post received
KUDOS
djhouse81 wrote:
MeddlingKid wrote:
I have been reading some older threads on IB recruiting, and have a question for those of you who are currently going through the process. When the banks request your GMAT score, do they ask for the Q-V split as well? I'm not concerned about my overall score, but they may be concerned that my split was heavily weighted on the Verbal side. I worked in a fairly analytic group before MBA, and studied finance in college (albeit not at a 'feeder' school). I am shooting for the top BB banks. Will my GMAT split make it difficult for me to land an internship and/or FT position with the GS, MS and JPMs of the sector, or will they overlook it due to the rigor of the Booth curriculum?


Not at all. You'll put your GMAT score and precentile on your resume, and once they see 700+ you're good to go. Depending on the bank, the job application might ask your SAT breakdown, but I was never asked my GMAT breakdown. With a 740, the top banks will check the GMAT score box and move on. Depending on your background, don't be surprised if McKinsey contacts you to encourage you to apply. At CBS, they went through the resume book and seemed to be attracted to unique backgrounds with high GMAT scores.

Your next question will be about your SAT score, right? A lot of banks ask for it on your application. It does not play a role as much as your GMAT score, but if you had a kickass SAT score it makes your more attractive...on paper. It IS NOT A DEAL BREAKER OR MAKER! Just think about these three examples: low SAT/low GMAT, low SAT/high GMAT, high SAT/high GMAT. The low/low will have more to prove in other areas, the low/high really has nothing to worry about, and the high/high is going to really impress the top banks. But there are so many other factors that go into recruiting that any of these score combinations is only going to get you so far. Pelihu's Guide to IB Recruiting really goes into those more important details.


Thanks, DJ. Unfortunately, my SAT score is nothing to write home about. If I could use my ACT score instead, I certainly would. But even that score, although better, may be lower than many would-be bankers I will be competing with. Unfortunately, I wasn't under the impression that I needed to study or prepare for the SAT, so I took it cold. Hopefully they don't assume I can't handle the rigors of finance work based on lack of preparation on a standardized test 12 years ago.

Last edited by MeddlingKid on 24 Jan 2009, 15:39, edited 1 time in total.
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 15:30
AlexMBAApply wrote:
To understand what bankers are *really* looking for, you have to understand the actual job itself and the group culture.

Four hallmarks of banking culture:

a) It's like a fraternity - it's a macho culture. They see themselves as reformed nerds-turned-alpha males (including the women). Note I said "they see themselves as..." and not "they are..." As such, they want people who they feel fit that image of the alpha dog, even if they aren't saying that out loud.

b) It's a sales culture. It's not a place for intellectual discourse. The dynamics are more similar to a locker room than a science lab (and the humor as well - see below). It's about applying your smarts to being #1. Money isn't just something you buy things with - it's a way of keeping score. Banks get ranked. You get ranked vs. other bankers. There is a pecking order of MDs even within the firms themselves.

c) There is a gallows humor that permeates virtually every office and bank. It's a cynical, jaded dry sense of humor. They may not be consciously looking for this in interviews, but they are in a way sensing if you are "one of them".

d) It's a way of life, not a job. You spend so much time in the office with the same people. They want to know that you're the kind of person who is reliable but just as important - someone who they won't strangle at 3am because you're an annoying dweeb. People's personalities tend to change the later you are in the office - and oftentimes the *real* person comes out when they're dead tired after 10pm and trying to get work done.

If you've ever done a fraternity rush, been in the military, or competed in a lot of team sports, you'll be in familiar territory for IB recruiting (except that they aren't asking you to drink vomit, but that instead you're being asked to do a Taylor Series expansion on the Black Scholes model - it's not necessarily if you get it 100% right, but whether you can get through it in one piece without sh*tting your pants). As a 1st year, you're the "rookie" so you're expected to shut up and do what's given to you and to speak only when spoken to sort of thing so no 'trying to act like an MD' by interjecting your ideas in a client meeting unless being asked to (and it's not uncommon for 2nd and 3rd year analysts to have more power than a 1st year associate with no IB experience). In fact, the analyst-associate dynamic is somewhat analogous to enlisted-officers in the military (in situations where a 1st year associate is staffed with an experienced analyst, the analyst is really driving the ship).

That's why banking interviews can feel a little juvenile at times or like a human cockfight, with the kinds of seemingly random questions they ask, as if they were grilling you.

They're not looking for the absolute smartest or the most knowledgeable finance dudes/gals (they will retrain you anyhow in "their way" of doing models). They are basically prodding and poking you to see if you're the right FIT. Any banker will tell you that the job hardly requires genius - just a reasonable level of everyday intelligence will do. From a technical standpoint, what you need to do in the job as a junior banker is simple:

a) you're willing to make it a life, not just a job (i.e. you'll suck it up if you get asked on Friday night to cancel your plans to do a pitch book). In other words, you're willing to stay in the office at all hours even if you have nothing to do. To be clear, they're not expecting you to enjoy it (and if you say you love doing pitch books for 80-100 hours a week, they will laugh in your face and call bullsh*t), but they're expecting you to suck it up.

b) you're thorough and detail oriented. This means a willingness to always double-check your work to minimize any errors - your Excel links are referencing the right cells, your document formatting is consistent, you keep the deal docs organized, and you are making sure the analysts are doing the same.

The rest is all about personality and presentation (how you present yourself in terms of your clothing, physicality, etc.).


Thank you for your insight into the banking culture, Alex!
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 496
Followers: 7

Kudos [?]: 69 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 16:07
MeddlingKid wrote:
Thanks, DJ. Unfortunately, my SAT score is nothing to write home about. If I could use my ACT score instead, I certainly would. But even that score, although better, may be lower than many would-be bankers I will be competing with. Unfortunately, I wasn't under the impression that I needed to study or prepare for the SAT, so I took it cold. Hopefully they don't assume I can't handle the rigors of finance work based on lack of preparation on a standardized test 12 years ago.


Don't worry about the SAT, seriously. With your GMAT score it is without a doubt 100% a non-issue. You're going to Booth and you have a stellar GMAT score. Just rock the recruiting process and try to get solid grades in all of your classes...ESPECIALLY corp fin and accounting.
SVP
SVP
User avatar
Joined: 11 Mar 2008
Posts: 1634
Location: Southern California
Schools: Chicago (dinged), Tuck (November), Columbia (RD)
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 176 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 16:26
Great post, Alex. +1.
_________________

Check out the new Career Forum
http://gmatclub.com/forum/133

Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 16:50
djhouse81 wrote:
MeddlingKid wrote:
Thanks, DJ. Unfortunately, my SAT score is nothing to write home about. If I could use my ACT score instead, I certainly would. But even that score, although better, may be lower than many would-be bankers I will be competing with. Unfortunately, I wasn't under the impression that I needed to study or prepare for the SAT, so I took it cold. Hopefully they don't assume I can't handle the rigors of finance work based on lack of preparation on a standardized test 12 years ago.


Don't worry about the SAT, seriously. With your GMAT score it is without a doubt 100% a non-issue. You're going to Booth and you have a stellar GMAT score. Just rock the recruiting process and try to get solid grades in all of your classes...ESPECIALLY corp fin and accounting.


Will do! Thanks again, dj.
Current Student
avatar
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 183
Location: United States
Schools: Haas '15 (M)
GMAT 1: 750 Q50 V40
Followers: 3

Kudos [?]: 27 [0], given: 3

Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 21:21
With regards to Ibanking recruiting, what's considered a good SAT score? Anything above 1400?
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 24 Jan 2009, 23:51
djhouse81 wrote:
MeddlingKid wrote:
Thanks, DJ. Unfortunately, my SAT score is nothing to write home about. If I could use my ACT score instead, I certainly would. But even that score, although better, may be lower than many would-be bankers I will be competing with. Unfortunately, I wasn't under the impression that I needed to study or prepare for the SAT, so I took it cold. Hopefully they don't assume I can't handle the rigors of finance work based on lack of preparation on a standardized test 12 years ago.


Don't worry about the SAT, seriously. With your GMAT score it is without a doubt 100% a non-issue. You're going to Booth and you have a stellar GMAT score. Just rock the recruiting process and try to get solid grades in all of your classes...ESPECIALLY corp fin and accounting.

DJ, since I have to put something down in my pre-collegiate standardized test slot, will the banks allow me to use my ACT score in place of an SAT score?
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 496
Followers: 7

Kudos [?]: 69 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 21:38
swbluedevil wrote:
With regards to Ibanking recruiting, what's considered a good SAT score? Anything above 1400?


Not sure. To be honest, I've seen one SAT score on a resume and it's a 1600. You'll be asked for it on the IB application and that's it.
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 496
Followers: 7

Kudos [?]: 69 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 21:41
MeddlingKid wrote:
DJ, since I have to put something down in my pre-collegiate standardized test slot, will the banks allow me to use my ACT score in place of an SAT score?


You'll have the opportunity to put numerous scores down. SAT, ACT, LSAT, GRE, and, of course, GMAT.
Current Student
User avatar
Joined: 01 Apr 2008
Posts: 356
Schools: Chicago Booth '11
Followers: 5

Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 25 Jan 2009, 22:53
djhouse81 wrote:
MeddlingKid wrote:
DJ, since I have to put something down in my pre-collegiate standardized test slot, will the banks allow me to use my ACT score in place of an SAT score?


You'll have the opportunity to put numerous scores down. SAT, ACT, LSAT, GRE, and, of course, GMAT.

Think they'll mind if I, uh, leave the SAT field blank? :-D
2 KUDOS received
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 496
Followers: 7

Kudos [?]: 69 [2] , given: 0

GMAT Tests User
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting [#permalink] New post 26 Jan 2009, 05:44
2
This post received
KUDOS
MeddlingKid wrote:

You'll have the opportunity to put numerous scores down. SAT, ACT, LSAT, GRE, and, of course, GMAT.

Think they'll mind if I, uh, leave the SAT field blank? :-D[/quote]

I-bankers don't miss much, so they'll probably notice that you left it blank and ask you why you left it off. Not to ding you, but just to throw you off your game. I would just put it in, and it will be a non-issue. Remember, most ibankers are MBA grads (this means that most are career switchers, very few leave ibanking to get an MBA just to get back into ibanking, and then some have foregone bschool altogether because they are moving up fine without it), so they might not have great SATs but a stellar GMAT. They are not about to ding you if you have the same credentials as them, if not better.
Re: Investment Banking Recruiting   [#permalink] 26 Jan 2009, 05:44
    Similar topics Author Replies Last post
Similar
Topics:
22 Investment Banking Recruiting - Q&A Moss 38 19 Jan 2012, 21:37
61 Investment Banking Recruiting lanter1 90 26 Dec 2008, 08:15
Investment Banking zamzim 4 09 Oct 2006, 03:40
Experts publish their posts in the topic Investment Banking Porscheboy16 6 28 Nov 2005, 11:51
Display posts from previous: Sort by

Investment Banking Recruiting

  Question banks Downloads My Bookmarks Reviews Important topics  

Go to page   Previous    1   2   3   4   5    Next  [ 91 posts ] 



GMAT Club MBA Forum Home| About| Privacy Policy| Terms and Conditions| GMAT Club Rules| Contact| Sitemap

Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group and phpBB SEO

Kindly note that the GMAT® test is a registered trademark of the Graduate Management Admission Council®, and this site has neither been reviewed nor endorsed by GMAC®.