Find all School-related info fast with the new School-Specific MBA Forum

It is currently 18 Sep 2014, 20:06

Close

GMAT Club Daily Prep

Thank you for using the timer - this advanced tool can estimate your performance and suggest more practice questions. We have subscribed you to Daily Prep Questions via email.

Customized
for You

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History

Track
Your Progress

every week, we’ll send you an estimated GMAT score based on your performance

Practice
Pays

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History

Not interested in getting valuable practice questions and articles delivered to your email? No problem, unsubscribe here.

Events & Promotions

Events & Promotions in June
Open Detailed Calendar

Need all experts on this one

  Question banks Downloads My Bookmarks Reviews Important topics  
Author Message
VP
VP
avatar
Joined: 28 Mar 2006
Posts: 1389
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 18 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 13 Aug 2007, 14:12
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?
Director
Director
avatar
Joined: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 931
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 23 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 13 Aug 2007, 15:09
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?


No no...I am saying B is the right answer.

In B, cost is plural because we are talking about effects....
If we had talked about "Drug and Alcohol abuse" (Singular) then we would have used "costs" (plural).

- Brajesh
VP
VP
avatar
Joined: 28 Mar 2006
Posts: 1389
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 18 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 13 Aug 2007, 20:20
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?


No no...I am saying B is the right answer.

In B, cost is plural because we are talking about effects....
If we had talked about "Drug and Alcohol abuse" (Singular) then we would have used "costs" (plural).

- Brajesh


OK let me reiterate my question.
Option B is as follows
significantly compounding the effects of drug and alcohol abuse, which already cost business

which is a relative pronoun which should modify only the noun that is preceding it. Correct?

abuse is a noun here so how can you say that which refers to effects which is a noun but far off from the relative pronoun?

I agree that the meaning gets distorted if the effects is not referred to by the rel. pronoun. But I think we cannot take it as a hard and fast rule that which refers to the noun that precedes it. :)

This Concept is teasing me :-D
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
User avatar
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 463
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 5 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 13 Aug 2007, 20:43
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?


No no...I am saying B is the right answer.

In B, cost is plural because we are talking about effects....
If we had talked about "Drug and Alcohol abuse" (Singular) then we would have used "costs" (plural).

- Brajesh


OK let me reiterate my question.
Option B is as follows
significantly compounding the effects of drug and alcohol abuse, which already cost business

which is a relative pronoun which should modify only the noun that is preceding it. Correct?

abuse is a noun here so how can you say that which refers to effects which is a noun but far off from the relative pronoun?

I agree that the meaning gets distorted if the effects is not referred to by the rel. pronoun. But I think we cannot take it as a hard and fast rule that which refers to the noun that precedes it. :)

This Concept is teasing me :-D


The one thing I've noticed time and again is to use this rule to shorten the sentences before figuring out what the "which" refers to.

Always... I repeat... Always ignore the "of" part of the sentence first.

credits: MGMAT SC.

Once you do that, it will suddenly look simple.
VP
VP
avatar
Joined: 28 Mar 2006
Posts: 1389
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 18 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 14 Aug 2007, 03:44
ioiio wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?


No no...I am saying B is the right answer.

In B, cost is plural because we are talking about effects....
If we had talked about "Drug and Alcohol abuse" (Singular) then we would have used "costs" (plural).

- Brajesh


OK let me reiterate my question.
Option B is as follows
significantly compounding the effects of drug and alcohol abuse, which already cost business

which is a relative pronoun which should modify only the noun that is preceding it. Correct?

abuse is a noun here so how can you say that which refers to effects which is a noun but far off from the relative pronoun?

I agree that the meaning gets distorted if the effects is not referred to by the rel. pronoun. But I think we cannot take it as a hard and fast rule that which refers to the noun that precedes it. :)

This Concept is teasing me :-D


The one thing I've noticed time and again is to use this rule to shorten the sentences before figuring out what the "which" refers to.

Always... I repeat... Always ignore the "of" part of the sentence first.

credits: MGMAT SC.

Once you do that, it will suddenly look simple.


and thats where I am going to :-D
Director
Director
avatar
Joined: 17 Sep 2005
Posts: 931
Followers: 2

Kudos [?]: 23 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 14 Aug 2007, 04:47
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
trivikram wrote:
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.

So you just have to look at the noun.

In your questions, B and E are the correct choices.

In SC1, "which" is modifying "effects" (a plural noun) that is followed by plural verb "cost".

In SC2, "which" is modifying "collateral" ( again a noun)
Moreover, in SC2, there should be S-V agreement
"Declining values" should go with "are".

- Brajesh


Brajesh: for Q1

which should qualify the noun preceeding it correct?

then why isnt it effects and not abuse here ?

is it 'cos of of?


Well, "Drug and Alcohol abuse" is singular so we need singular verb "costs".

- Brajesh


So are you saying that it is C ?


No no...I am saying B is the right answer.

In B, cost is plural because we are talking about effects....
If we had talked about "Drug and Alcohol abuse" (Singular) then we would have used "costs" (plural).

- Brajesh


OK let me reiterate my question.
Option B is as follows
significantly compounding the effects of drug and alcohol abuse, which already cost business

which is a relative pronoun which should modify only the noun that is preceding it. Correct?

abuse is a noun here so how can you say that which refers to effects which is a noun but far off from the relative pronoun?

I agree that the meaning gets distorted if the effects is not referred to by the rel. pronoun. But I think we cannot take it as a hard and fast rule that which refers to the noun that precedes it. :)

This Concept is teasing me :-D


Yes, this is not a hard and fast rule....
I have seen many examples where "which" does not refer to the noun close to it but refer to one little far away.

I will send you few examples if I encounter any going forward.

- Brajesh

- Brajesh
Director
Director
avatar
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 746
Followers: 1

Kudos [?]: 15 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 14 Aug 2007, 11:13
Yes, this is not a hard and fast rule....
I have seen many examples where "which" does not refer to the noun close to it but refer to one little far away.

I will send you few examples if I encounter any going forward.

- Brajesh

- Brajesh


In almost all of the instances (say like 99%) which will refer to the noun preceeds it but I have seen few instances where this is not going to be the case and the question here is one of those few exceptions.
CEO
CEO
User avatar
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 2770
Location: New York City
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 232 [0], given: 4

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 07:18
i think we need further elaboration... here are a few questions..

678. Television programs developed in conjunction with the marketing of toys, which was once prohibited by federal regulations, are thriving in the free market conditions permitted by the current Federal Communications Commission.
(A) Television programs developed in conjunction with the marketing of toys, which was once prohibited by federal regulations, are
(B) Television programs developed in conjunction with the marketing of toys, a practice that federal regulations once prohibited, is
(C) Developing television programs in conjunction with the marketing of toys, as once prohibited by federal regulations, is
(D) Federal regulations once prohibited developing television programs in conjunction with the marketing of toys, but they are
(E) Federal regulations once prohibited developing television programs in conjunction with the marketing of toys, but such programs are



734. The domesticated camel, which some scholars date around the twelfth century B.C., was the key to the development of the spice trade in the ancient world.
(A) The domesticated camel, which some scholars date
(B) The domesticated camel, which some scholars having thought to occur
(C) Domesticating the camel, dated by some scholars at
(D) The domestication of the camel, thought by some scholars to have occurred
(E) The camel’s domestication, dated by some scholars to have been
CEO
CEO
User avatar
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 2770
Location: New York City
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 232 [0], given: 4

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 07:23
b14kumar wrote:
Well, you have valid doubts.

Remeber, the relative pronoun “which” should be used to refer to a noun and not an idea or an action presented in an entire clause.


I agree with this. Which cannot modify a whole phrase....

As the price of gasoline rises, which makes substituting alcohol distilled from cereal grain attractive, the prices of bread and livestock feed are sure to increase.

BUT i am not sure how it applies to B because the effects (of X&Y) where effects/x/y are all nouns.
CEO
CEO
User avatar
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 2770
Location: New York City
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 232 [0], given: 4

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 07:35
827. The science of economics, which for four decades was dominated by Keynesians, who at first stressed the government’s role in stimulating the economy, but who were ultimately led away from solutions based on government intervention.
(A) economics, which for four decades was
(B) economics that was to be
(C) economics, one which has, for four decades, been
(D) economics is one that for four decades has been
(E) economics, for four decades, is one that was
Director
Director
avatar
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 746
Followers: 1

Kudos [?]: 15 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 08:04
678:
I was thinking C and E.
Elliminated A because ‘which’ is working on ‘toys’. It was the action or the practice which was prohibited not the toys.
B needed ‘are’. I found D weird.
I believe C changes the meaning. E is crisp and clean.

734:

(A practice/phenomenon/action) was the key to the development of the spice trade in the ancient world.

We need ‘domestication’ as that clearly describes the phenomenon/idea.

Left with D and E. In GMAT D form, in my experience, is always preferred rather than use of possessive.
D.
CEO
CEO
User avatar
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 2770
Location: New York City
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 232 [0], given: 4

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 08:32
Here's an interesting one:

School integration plans have contributed to
(significant increases in housing integration), which, in turn, reduces
any future need for busing.

Which modifies the object of the preposition.
Director
Director
User avatar
Joined: 12 Jul 2007
Posts: 867
Followers: 12

Kudos [?]: 199 [0], given: 0

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 16 Aug 2007, 09:05
B and E for the original questions.

bmwhype2, can you post the entire question that came from?
VP
VP
avatar
Joined: 15 Jul 2004
Posts: 1474
Schools: Wharton (R2 - submitted); HBS (R2 - submitted); IIMA (admitted for 1 year PGPX)
Followers: 15

Kudos [?]: 98 [0], given: 13

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 18 Aug 2007, 08:16
bmwhype2 wrote:
Here's an interesting one:

School integration plans have contributed to
(significant increases in housing integration), which, in turn, reduces
any future need for busing.

Which modifies the object of the preposition.


This explanation is reason enough for staying away from generalizations as pointed out by IOIIO. The fact that it doesn't help matters is a different thing.

Prepositional phrases are adjectival in nature; they can be eliminated when deciding SV agreements. In all other cases (such as when deciding noun pronoun agreements etc) we must not blindly remove them. As in BMW's example here - which is pointing to the object of the preposition

I am actually quite upset with MGMAT's SC study material. They have blatantly used the OG and Verbal guide - such heavy reliance on verbal guide is totally not warranted.

It's a complete waste of money.
CEO
CEO
User avatar
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 2770
Location: New York City
Followers: 8

Kudos [?]: 232 [0], given: 4

GMAT Tests User
 [#permalink] New post 22 Aug 2007, 13:59
1. Get me the box of chocolates, which are creme filled.
which refers to chocolates.

2. Executives and federal officials say that the use of crack and cocaine is growing rapidly among workers, significantly compounding the effects of drug and alcohol abuse, which already cost business more than $100 billion a year.
which refers to "effects" ==> effects (of X&Y) ...cost business

so, i guess the rule of thumb is to first assume which refers to the closest noun (object of the preposition), make sure the context agrees, and if it doesnt, it refers to the noun instead of the object of the preposition.

anyone disagree?
Manager
Manager
avatar
Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 227
Followers: 4

Kudos [?]: 7 [0], given: 38

GMAT Tests User
Re: Need all experts on this one [#permalink] New post 06 Oct 2011, 03:37
Worth reading.
_________________

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
MGMAT 6 650 (51,31) on 31/8/11
MGMAT 1 670 (48,33) on 04/9/11
MGMAT 2 670 (47,34) on 07/9/11
MGMAT 3 680 (47,35) on 18/9/11
GMAT Prep1 680 ( 50, 31) on 10/11/11

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
CR notes
http://gmatclub.com/forum/massive-collection-of-verbal-questions-sc-rc-and-cr-106195.html#p832142
http://gmatclub.com/forum/1001-ds-questions-file-106193.html#p832133
http://gmatclub.com/forum/gmat-prep-critical-reasoning-collection-106783.html
http://gmatclub.com/forum/how-to-get-6-0-awa-my-guide-64327.html
http://gmatclub.com/forum/how-to-get-6-0-awa-my-guide-64327.html?hilit=chineseburned

Re: Need all experts on this one   [#permalink] 06 Oct 2011, 03:37
    Similar topics Author Replies Last post
Similar
Topics:
Need Experts advice on that and which. fluke 0 12 Jun 2011, 00:18
Experts publish their posts in the topic Calling All GMAT Experts markbrown525 2 04 Apr 2011, 23:18
750 level, need expert wacky1984 9 05 Nov 2010, 14:04
Need advice from experts sang5650 1 17 Jun 2010, 19:14
Need Expert Opinion frizbee 4 18 Jul 2008, 11:54
Display posts from previous: Sort by

Need all experts on this one

  Question banks Downloads My Bookmarks Reviews Important topics  

Go to page   Previous    1   2   [ 36 posts ] 



GMAT Club MBA Forum Home| About| Privacy Policy| Terms and Conditions| GMAT Club Rules| Contact| Sitemap

Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group and phpBB SEO

Kindly note that the GMAT® test is a registered trademark of the Graduate Management Admission Council®, and this site has neither been reviewed nor endorsed by GMAC®.