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# not many takers for Yale, why?

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not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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07 Jul 2010, 09:06
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I have seen a couple of admits, dings as so on and i found that most of them dont even mention Yale SOM in their list of applied schools.

Why is that, i mean as a non american i am trying to understand?

Because i thought yale was on par with the top schools, i mean the brand name. Cornell is a different story because as far i learnt from reading several posts, cornell undergraduation is great but not so much for mba.

But 64% of the people either mention 1-5 along with a few 10-20 us ranked schools or 30-40 us ranked schools?
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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07 Jul 2010, 20:31
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Yale SOM is still a relatively new MBA program. Although Yale undergrad and Yale Law are both very well known, the School of Management is still fighting to defend its place in the top 15. It's an excellent school with a unique curriculum and it has established a solid reputation in non-profit and finance.

That covers the basics from my perspective (which is very limited), but we have quite a few Yale SOM students on this board that can probably share tons of great facts about the program.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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07 Jul 2010, 20:50
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I'd be curious to hear more too. I always (naively) wondered why the Yale brand didn't seem to rub off more on SOM, but I'm not very familiar with the school and its history. Its save the world nonprofit vibe (future Stanford competitor?) actually appeals a lot so I'm trying to learn more...
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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07 Jul 2010, 21:50
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I definitely won't take the fact few people mentions YSOM against Yale. It's still a great b-school; however, as mentioned, it doesn't carry the same prestige as its parent school.

I speculate some of the reasons not many people apply are:
1) It has a small program (>200 student/class)
2) It is a relatively new program, thus has not established the alumni/industry connections as other schools
3) It is well regarded in non-profit, but not a stand out in other fields

But there are also a lot going for YSOM. Nink posted some great reasons (stolen from Nink):

1) Small Class - 200 (expected to increase by 20/yr to about 300 in the next few years)

2) World-class Yale Brand and ability to access Yale, Yale SOM, Yale Law, and other Yale Grad school alums (I networked at Yale Club in NYC with Yale alums before the start of bschool and landed a pre-MBA internship with a well known VC firm)

3) New compelling CORE curriculum - Unique CORE classes such as 'Competitor' (strategy class) and 'Customer' (marketing class), among many others. Innovative integrated curriculum offers a cross-disciplinary approach to teaching and team work is especially stressed. Curriculum is very internationally oriented and Yale's own case department writes cases that are up to date and relevant to the current climate. The Integrated Curriculum continues to be refined and improved with each year, and students can expect to contribute to this process, as well.

4) The Integrated Leadership Perspective capstone is rewarding as students apply the tools and perspectives taught in the core. Joint-degree students with the schools of Forestry and Environmental Science, Public Health, Medicine, Drama, and Law are fully included in the program, providing unique perspectives and opportunities for learning. (Many worthy guest lecturers at every class)

5) Yale SOM is on a quarter system, with the first three quarters dominated by core courses including Economics, Statistics, Marketing, Strategy, Accounting, and Problem Framing. Once the core courses are over, the electives are really the best part of Yale SOM. For example, Tony Blair is teaching. Selected students will be able to take his weekly seminar on faith and globalization.

6) Students can take classes in the law school, international relations Ph.D. program, architecture school, etc. There is a firmly enforced grade non-disclosure policy (GND), and GPA is not calculated. Instead, students are given four possible grades: Distinction, Proficient, Pass, Fail. Distinctions are awarded to the top 10% of students in each class, and nearly everyone else earns a proficient. These grades are not listed on our transcripts (only the courses taken), though students are allowed to list distinctions on their resume.

7) International Travel Abroad requirement included in the first year curriculum - there's significant preparation for the trip, which is led by a faculty member w/ amazing contacts in that respective part of the world that you will be visiting.

8) Employment: Superb East Coast placement. Students are placed into blue chip MBA employers every year. (Small class size of 200 allows better preparation, and service to each student from the school) Year after year, students are headed to Goldman Sachs, Google, McKinsey, Credit Suisse, Boston Consulting Group, JP Morgan, Morgan Stanley, PepsiCo, Proctor & Gamble, Dow Chemicals, etc. (Even in this tough job market, alums and professors are joining in to assist current students to find a job. How great is that?)

Because there are so few students, alumni are not flooded with requests for favors and informational interviews, and they are generally quite willing to lend a hand when they can. On-campus recruiting is strong given the size of the school. Proximity to New York means that banking and finance recruiting is quite convenient, as students can make a quick train ride into the city at any time.

Yale has a lot of prominent healthcare alumni in insurance, investing, hospitals, and healthcare IT. The Career Services leverages alumni in these fields quite well.

Yale is strong and connected in Asia where the brand name is especially prestigious. The best part of recruiting is that Yale's student body is supportive and people work together to obtain jobs rather than compete against each other.

9) Excellent commitment from international alums in supporting SOM, and active international student community. Recent hires in the career services office is allowing Yale SOM to dedicate in facilitating international opportunities for students.

10) Some courses are highly case-based, while others are more lecture-oriented. Several courses use Yale's "raw cases," which require significantly more effort to prepare, but also tend to lead to more in-depth classroom discussions. Elective classes are selected using a bidding process, but the small class size and large pool of faculty mean that usually no more than a handful of classes are oversubscribed.

11) The student body is extraordinarily collegial; without question, the friendliest, most well-adjusted group of business school students assembled anywhere.

12) Student clubs, particularly in consulting, finance, and non-profit fields, offer extensive support for students doing job searches. The consulting club offers one of the most in-depth case interview curricula available, and feedback from employers has been very positive.

13) One of the best part about Yale is that accessibility of its professors. It gives you the small school feeling in terms of care, interaction, and teaching. They are very accessible and help you with academics, career prospects, and leadership development.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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11 Jul 2010, 09:26
Thanks everybody, kudos.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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11 Jul 2010, 12:00
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With so many MBA-hopefuls looking to get into finance, a school known for non-profit isn't very appealing.

This allows finance students at Yale to really stand out due to a relative lack of competition.

Look at some of the Yale alum from this board -- they're in nearly every field imaginable

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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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12 Jul 2010, 06:50
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This is a pretty "controversial" topic actually. Different people are going to have wildly different opinions on this one. To cite the rankings, USN ranked Yale SOM at #11 in 2010, and BW ranked Yale SOM at #24 in 2008, so there's a wide range. I won't repeat what previous posters said, because they have already hit upon a lot of good points/info. My recommendation would be to visit the school if you can and talk to current students and alumni to get a better sense of your fit with the school. In terms of specialty reputation, I know that Yale SOM is known for non-profit. Good luck!
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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12 Jul 2010, 09:42
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I would argue that Cornell's MBA reputation (#18 - which I personally consider a few spots low) almost perfectly matches its undergrad reputation (ranked #15). In 2009, YSOM had 2790 applicants, which compares favorably to peers such as Cornell at 2276, and Darden at 2689 - so you should be seeing a similar number of people posting as applicants.

YSOM has only given out the MBA degree for approx. 10 years (they issued a MPPM for 20 years before that) and is currently in the middle of a major restructuring (new dean, new campus, new curriculum, and 30% larger student body starting in 2012). What these changes will do to its reputation, if anything, is open to speculation.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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12 Jul 2010, 10:41
Thinking more and more about Yale as a very good safety, but the required international trip/experience is feeling about weird for an international students coming to the US.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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12 Jul 2010, 17:45
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Expert's post
Hi,

Some candidates consider Yale to have a very "soft" feel - that is, hard core finance professionals tend to dislike the culture, but folks focused on social entrepreneurship love it. That is something to consider as you think about Yale.

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts of MBA Admit dot com
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Dr. Shel Watts, the Founder and CEO of MBA Admit,.com, is a graduate of Harvard and Oxford who has Harvard admissions experience. Clients can opt to work directly with Dr. Shel in the admissions process. At MBAAdmit.com, "Dr. Shel" provides--at nearly 50% lower pricing than many comparable competitors--excellent MBA essay editing services and comprehensive admissions consulting, including one-to-one strategizing, essay development, school selection, GMAT advice, interview preparation, and recommendation advice. http://www.mbaadmit.com

Last edited by ShellyLWatts on 12 Jul 2010, 18:10, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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12 Jul 2010, 17:53
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Hi,

Another thing - if you are not a U.S. citizen and you are also not intending to remain in the U.S. after your MBA studies, you might consider looking at Yale with somewhat different eyes than an American might. You must weigh the benefits of becoming a part of Yale's formidable overseas alumni network. Yale is among the best with their undergrad institution, medical school and law school, and Yale has a strong international presence and international name recognition. With a Yale MBA, you will become a part of that broader, powerful alumni network overseas. That might make it more valuable to you than attending a more regional MBA program that is ranked higher than Yale.

You should also bear in mind whether you intend to work for a big multinational company, or to pursue entrepreneurship, because if you are going to try to work for a top multinational company, you need to weigh well how they view various MBA programs and to what extent they recruit at your chosen MBA school.

Good luck in the admissions process!

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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15 Jul 2010, 03:41
YourDreamTheater wrote:
With so many MBA-hopefuls looking to get into finance, a school known for non-profit isn't very appealing.

This allows finance students at Yale to really stand out due to a relative lack of competition.

Look at some of the Yale alum from this board -- they're in nearly every field imaginable

Posted from my mobile device

So you mean to say that Yale is not a very good choice for Finance coupled with international applicant. I get that you said the opposite but its a revelation for me as i thought Yale was a better choice than 5-20 range of BSchools like Duke, or Haas(seems too uptight), I know NYU is great but felt keeping other options open would be logical.

Cornell seems good but again some suggest that its not for Finance.

Looks like Finance is only at the top 5, what a disparity?

Quote:
Hi,

Some candidates consider Yale to have a very "soft" feel - that is, hard core finance professionals tend to dislike the culture, but folks focused on social entrepreneurship love it. That is something to consider as you think about Yale.

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts of MBA Admit dot com
Hi,

Some candidates consider Yale to have a very "soft" feel - that is, hard core finance professionals tend to dislike the culture, but folks focused on social entrepreneurship love it. That is something to consider as you think about Yale.

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts of MBA Admit dot com

I am not sure, what soft feel means, your right that yale is internationally recognized but for people, who are unaware and cannot afford too many wrong options, such people would want to tread carefully with investing in a degree.

Thanks,kudos.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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15 Jul 2010, 05:07
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BlueRobin wrote:
So you mean to say that Yale is not a very good choice for Finance coupled with international applicant. I get that you said the opposite but its a revelation for me as i thought Yale was a better choice than 5-20 range of BSchools like Duke, or Haas(seems too uptight), I know NYU is great but felt keeping other options open would be logical.

Cornell seems good but again some suggest that its not for Finance.

Looks like Finance is only at the top 5, what a disparity?

Traditionally, top finance schools are Wharton, Booth, CBS, and Stern, although you can't go wrong with H/S, either. Personally, I'm not too familiar with Yale SOM's reputation in finance.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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15 Jul 2010, 07:56
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BlueRobin wrote:
YourDreamTheater wrote:
With so many MBA-hopefuls looking to get into finance, a school known for non-profit isn't very appealing.

This allows finance students at Yale to really stand out due to a relative lack of competition.

Look at some of the Yale alum from this board -- they're in nearly every field imaginable

Posted from my mobile device

So you mean to say that Yale is not a very good choice for Finance coupled with international applicant. I get that you said the opposite but its a revelation for me as i thought Yale was a better choice than 5-20 range of BSchools like Duke, or Haas(seems too uptight), I know NYU is great but felt keeping other options open would be logical.

Cornell seems good but again some suggest that its not for Finance.

Looks like Finance is only at the top 5, what a disparity?

Quote:
Hi,

Some candidates consider Yale to have a very "soft" feel - that is, hard core finance professionals tend to dislike the culture, but folks focused on social entrepreneurship love it. That is something to consider as you think about Yale.

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts of MBA Admit dot com
Hi,

Some candidates consider Yale to have a very "soft" feel - that is, hard core finance professionals tend to dislike the culture, but folks focused on social entrepreneurship love it. That is something to consider as you think about Yale.

Best wishes,
Dr. Shelly L. Watts of MBA Admit dot com

I am not sure, what soft feel means, your right that yale is internationally recognized but for people, who are unaware and cannot afford too many wrong options, such people would want to tread carefully with investing in a degree.

Thanks,kudos.

Hi guys,

Just to clarify: Yale SOM is very strong in investment banking. It sends between a third and a half of its class to Wall Street.

Cornell is also stronger in finance than it is consulting and general management, I believe. It is one of the few schools outside Wharton-Booth-CBS-Stern that puts kids on S&T floors.

I would consider Yale but two things put me off: I think I'd get rejected and I'm not a fan of the location.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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15 Jul 2010, 10:11
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YSOM is a fabulous school. I wouldn't think twice about attending SOM
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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16 Jul 2010, 22:48
Great opinions,this is the reason why i prefer Forums than Private Messaging, you message and wait and wait. Kudos.

Quote:

This is great.
It gives a great perspective. To think one pays 100K above and ends up without a clue, what is going on in this world?

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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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17 Jul 2010, 00:44
osbornecox wrote:
Yale SOM is very strong in investment banking. It sends between a third and a half of its class to Wall Stree

Actually, Yale sent 20% of its 2009 class into the IB industry. However, Yale doesn't reveal how many have actually gone to an IB function (corpfin, M&A, etc.). It is definitely less than 20%. Judging by other school's numbers, i.e. ratio of IB function to IB industry numbers, I would estimate that Yale sends between 8% and 15% to real IBD jobs - on par with most other top 8-15 schools.
For the class of 2010, YSOM sent only 9% of its graduates into IB (industry) internships, meaning that people going into real IB jobs (function) will most probably be in the 5-8% range.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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17 Jul 2010, 01:20
osbornecox wrote:
Yale SOM is very strong in investment banking. It sends between a third and a half of its class to Wall Stree

Actually, Yale sent 20% of its 2009 class into the IB industry. However, Yale doesn't reveal how many have actually gone to an IB function (corpfin, M&A, etc.). It is definitely less than 20%. Judging by other school's numbers, i.e. ratio of IB function to IB industry numbers, I would estimate that Yale sends between 8% and 15% to real IBD jobs - on par with most other top 8-15 schools.
For the class of 2010, YSOM sent only 9% of its graduates into IB (industry) internships, meaning that people going into real IB jobs (function) will most probably be in the 5-8% range.

Are you saying that between half and a quarter of MBA hires at IBs are doing stuff like Treasury, Ops, PWM, etc? I would imagine Yale's pure-play IBD and PWM-type numbers are strong.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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17 Jul 2010, 07:31
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osbornecox wrote:
Are you saying that between half and a quarter of MBA hires at IBs are doing stuff like Treasury, Ops, PWM, etc? I would imagine Yale's pure-play IBD and PWM-type numbers are strong.

I would say that judging by the other school's figures pure IB is about 50-75% of all people going into the industry.
For example, Cornell 2008: 21% industry vs. 12% function; Darden 2009: 17% industry and 8% function; Columbia 2009: 28% in IB industry vs. 13% in IB function; NYU 2009: 32% industry vs. 15% function. The other quarter/half of the people going into the IB industry can be doing various jobs: internal finance, equity research, S&T, PWM just to name a few. Take a look at what other functions are listed in Columbia's report under Financial Services - http://www.columbia.edu/cu/business/career/employmentreport/2009/2009.Columbia.Business.School-Employment%20Report.pdf
Even in 2005, when the crisis was not there, Columbia sent 18.2% in corpfin/M&A functions vs. 28.5% going to the industry in total.
I don't see why Yale's figures should be much different from the above trend, but it really baffles me why they don't report a detailed function breakdown like the other schools and do a very general breakdown - they surely have detailed figures.
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Re: not many takers for Yale, why? [#permalink]

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17 Jul 2010, 07:37
osbornecox wrote:
Are you saying that between half and a quarter of MBA hires at IBs are doing stuff like Treasury, Ops, PWM, etc? I would imagine Yale's pure-play IBD and PWM-type numbers are strong.

I would say that judging by the other school's figures pure IB is about 50-75% of all people going into the industry.
For example, Cornell 2008: 21% industry vs. 12% function; Darden 2009: 17% industry and 8% function; Columbia 2009: 28% in IB industry vs. 13% in IB function; NYU 2009: 32% industry vs. 15% function. The other quarter/half of the people going into the IB industry can be doing various jobs: internal finance, equity research, S&T, PWM just to name a few. Take a look at what other functions are listed in Columbia's report under Financial Services - http://www.columbia.edu/cu/business/career/employmentreport/2009/2009.Columbia.Business.School-Employment%20Report.pdf
Even in 2005, when the crisis was not there, Columbia sent 18.2% in corpfin/M&A functions vs. 28.5% going to the industry in total.
I don't see why Yale's figures should be much different from the above trend, but it really baffles me why they don't report a detailed function breakdown like the other schools and do a very general breakdown - they surely have detailed figures.

It's surprising, too, considering that they offer the most detailed GMAT breakdown distributions (they show subscores).

When I distinguish between functions, the fundamental distinction in my mind is "front office vs cost center".
Re: not many takers for Yale, why?   [#permalink] 17 Jul 2010, 07:37

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