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# OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!)

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09 Aug 2007, 22:48
it's all in your attitude trahul! My test scores were in the 680-720 range a week or two before the test, and my confidence was low. I thought I didn't practice enough, and wanted to do more CATs, more OG, more challenges. But good thing good people like you, praet, lanter1, and others told me to back off and just relax and do fewer problems. My hit rate on the hard OG questions improved, as did my confidence.

On test day, just relax, think of it as a game you play, and you should do great! I have confidence in you!
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09 Aug 2007, 23:05
thanks much kryzak
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10 Aug 2007, 09:37
i am very impressed.
thank you for the debriefing!
i am very frustrated right now since i am making no progress. i've taken two exams (GMATprep + MGMAT) and both scores were atrociously low.
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13 Aug 2007, 22:41
kryzak wrote:
Alright, just had some friends over for poker, and ended up 2nd place (went all in with KKs and he flipped over AAs! Talk about bad luck! Not that I"m complaining after my GMAT today! )

I'm so excited that I'll try to post my debrief here tonight. If I leave out anything, please ask and I'll try to answer.

First of all, I want to thank EVERYONE here at GMATClub! All your good wishes, congrats, support, and advice! This group has been so kind to me the past week when I was a nevous wreck, enduring all my repetitive questions about "should I study more? should I do the math challenges? etc...". Without all y'all, I would not have gotten the score today. This one's for all of you out there! =)

With that said, here's my entire study history. I want to put out a WARNING about following my process, as I'm the type of guy that doesn't like to study much for tests and usually work better under pressure and panic. It's how I always took my midterms and finals in college, study the night before. Don't worry though, I'll be working on my essays a lot earlier (I usually write them 10pm the night before they're due, and still get an A, haha =P) this time, since B-school means so much more to me.

Anyway, here it goes:

Books I used:
OG11 (bible!)
OG Verbal Review
Princeton Review Crack the GMAT 2007 (only read the strategies and tips)
Manhattan SC (saved my life!)
Veritas class notes (from a good buddy of mine) for Quant

My GMAT Practice Test Scores:

Test Name Date Score S% Quant Q% Verbal V%
GMAT Prep 7/12/07 770 99 50 95 44 97
Manhattan 7/15/07 720 96 47 81 41 93
Princeton 7/22/07 670 87 50 95 33 68
Manhattan 7/22/07 680 88 47 81 36 80
PowerPrep 7/24/07 710 93 50 95 35 75
PowerPrep 7/27/07 750 98 49 89 44 97
GMATPrep 7/29/07 710 93 49 89 38 84
GMAT! 8/3/07 760 99 51 99 41 93

I started pretty much on July 4th, with the OG11 Diagnostic test. Two weeks before July 4th, I started reading the PR Crack the GMAT strategies and learn what GMAT is all about. But it was only on July 4th that I sat down and took the diagnostic test. It took me a week to finish all 5 sections (a few friends were visiting, so I never had a chance to really do all the questions in one sitting) I got above average (at the border of Excellent) for PS, DS, SC (at the lower end) and Excellent for RC and CR. On 7/12, I finally got the chance to sit down and take GMATPrep1. I had to do the Quant section the night of 7/11, and finish the verbal on 7/12. As you can see, I got 770, and was quite surprised. I was thinking, "no sweat at all!"

But, I didn't take it lightly, and since I missed 6 out of 8 of my Verbal on SC, I ordered Manhattan SC as everyone suggested. Over the next 2 weeks, I worked on that book, every exercise, and every OG question in OG11. My hit rate ranged from 60-80%, and roughly 75-80% in the end for hard questions (the hard 1/3 of the book). Meanwhile, I started doing the hard 1/3 of PS/DS and CR/RC. I was getting 80-90% on them, occassionally dipping down to 70% in 10-20 question sets. Then I decided to take the Manhattan GMAT CAT, and scored a 720. The math was so hard it freaked me out, and my verbal dropped too. Therefore I started forcusing mostly on verbal from 7/15 until 7/22, and then I took the PR CAT. That devestated me. 670 was a far cry from 770, and my verbal dropped to 33?! Anyway, that was when I had my flood of "panic" posts on GMAT Club regarding how accurate PR CATs were. I made the mistake of taking the MGMAT CAT2 *right after* PR CAT, and by the middle of the Verbal section, my brain was dead and I couldn't understand even the simplest of RC passages. That is definitely something I recommend AGAINST doing!

Alright, then I found PowerPrep, and then began my 3 last successive tests, with more OG11 problems in between. As you can see, my scores were hovering around 710 (the 750 on PowerPrep2 was a fluke, because many verbal questions were the same as OG11), and my heart sunk. I began to believe that 710 is my true ability, and the 770 I got on GMATPrep1 was a distant dream. After a fewdays, I was able to convince myself that anything over 700+ is good, and I shouldn't worry so much about it (thanks to all you GMATClubbers again!), and my mood improved.

I followed GMATClubbers' recommendations of
- Not taking any more full CATS a week before the test (I stopped the Sunday before my test)
- Do a full CAT with AWA (my 7/29 GMATPrep2)
- Do not do any problems the day before, and get lots of sleep and exercise

So Monday, Tuesday, and Wenesday before the test (7/30-8/1), I finished the entire OG11 SC, hard 1/3 of CR and RC, 1/2 of Verbal Review's SC (the hard section), hard 1/3 of PS and DS for Quant. I also skimmed through Veritas workbooks on Arithmetic, Geometry, Algebra, Probability/Combinations, and the most useful of them all, their "Number Properties Extra Handout". I highly recommend this one if you have it or if a friend of yours took a Veritas class. It's a small 20+ page pamphlet that helps you with some of the toughest math questions about number properties.

On Thursday (8/2), I didn't do much. I reviewed all my mistakes in all sections, and re-read the Manhattan SC book. I also read the PR and OG11 AWA section just to see how I should write my AWAs. Other than that, I had dinner with a friend and watched the Simpson's Movie (wasn't as funny as I hoped).

On Friday, 8/3, I took 2 sleeping pills and slept till 11am. Woke up, did 6-8 questions for each section, the medium-hard sections. re-read the PR/OG11 AWA instructions again, re-read Manhattan SC, and then went for a light jog for 20 minutes. Left for the testing center 45 min in advance (I only live 10-15 min away), and thank goodness I did, because the traffic on the 101 was horrible! Good thing I plopped in some Mozart CD and that calmed me down and kept me from being frustrated. I always listened to some Mozart before a test in college, so I did it this time too. It definitely helps keep you calm.

I made it still 20+ minutes ahead of time, and the nice Russian lady that was there last week when I visited Pearson Vue (oh yeah, I checked it out a week in advance to get used to the drive and the area, highly recommended!) was there again, and she checked me in. Chatted with a girl who was also taking the GMAT, and we worried about our chances and how random our practice scores were.

Went in to take the test. The earplugs are AMAZING! I felt the world shut out and at some points I thougth I could hear myself think... or maybe I was just going crazy... haha! Anyway, i was very relaxed, and the Analysis of an Argument went well. I kinda stumbled on Analysis of an Issue (usually easier for me) because my three supporting reasons were kinda overlapping, and I felt that I repeated myself in my 3 separate paragraphs. I think my AWA will probably be a 5 on the Argument and a 4 on the Issue.. Let's see how accurate I am.

Took the full 10 minute break. Did the cold water splashing face thing some GMATClubber recommended. Stretched, did some calisthenics (is that what they're called?) and ate a granola bar.

Went in for the Quant. All the questions were SO EASY I began to worry. I had so much time near the end (roughly 4 minutes per problem) that I was doing each question twice just to double check and see if I forgot something. I finished with 5 minutes left and took my 2nd break. did the water, stretch, exercise, food thing again, and went in for my verbal.

Verbal was tough. I don't know why, but I usually have 5 minutes left in the end, and this time I barely finished. Some of the RC and CR I couldn't decide between two or THREE answers, and all the SC I learned from Manhattan SC just didn't apply to any of the questions for some reason! I kept on breathing in deeply and telling myself not to panic. I know I can do this. And finally, IT WAS OVER!

Most people say that the survey part is the most cruel because it makes you wait before you see your score, but I needed the time to let my adrenaline rush calm down, and actually enjoyed the survey. Finally, when I clicked "show the score", the computer took what seemed like hours to come up with the screen.

***760*** HOLY CRAP!!! I couldn't beleive my eyes! It was a wonderful moment and I had to really restrain myself from screaming outloud. I stared at the score for a few minutes before I raised my hand to be let out. The ladies were really nice and the Russian lady printed me my score and told me good luck on the application.

I gathered my stuff, went in my car, and screamed for a few minutes at the top of my lungs to release all the nervous energy I had. I was so psyched about it! Whether it's the exercise, the relaxation, the sleep, the studying, or the Mozart, I DID IT! And that's all that mattered.

Anyway, rushed home for a nice poker night with the guys, and almost won the tournament. It was a good night all in all.

So my final tips and takeaways:

- Do your last GMATPrep at least 5 days before the test

- Do all the OG problems you can do, they're the most reflective of the test and will prepare you very well

- OG Verbal Review is great for extra problems if you need help on Verbal. I don't know how the Math Review is.

- Manhattan SC ROCKS! Get it if you have SC problems.

- My CR and RC were always good (since SATs and GREs), so I didn't study for them at all, other than do the OG questions. I would recommend you do as many RC and CR questions as you can, and notice how the answers are explained if you got them wrong. That's the best advice I can give for those sections. Sorry I couldn't say more.

- Quant was very easy for me, and it was all about learning all the "types" of questions they had. Everything else is just a variation. This you can get by doing all the hard questions in the OG, and reading some good math overview book like the PR Math Review, the OG Math Review, and the Veritas Math Review. If you get Number Properties down, you can answer some of the toughest questions!

- I would recommend the GMAT Challenges or Manhattan GMAT CAT math sections if you need mroe math practice, but DO NOT let those deflate your confidence. It's just to teach you how to do questions faster and smarter, so the OG will be super easy if you go back to them. I didn't do the GMAT Challenges, but I've seen a few problems and they are definitely tough but worth it if you have time.

- ALWAYS take the GMATPrep1 first after you familiarize yourself with the GMAT format. This will tell you how much time you need to spend studying. I was reading all the posts about people spending 3 months non-stop studying, and was worried that my less than 1 month of haphazard studying wasn't enough. But GMATPrep1 helped me gauge where I was and where I wanted to be. I definitely WOULDN'T recommend my method for everyone, but if that's how you work, then give it a try.

- All in all, I spent 3-4 hours a night for 3 nights before the test doing OG problems. I spent two Sundays roughly 6-8 hours doing CATs and OG problems, and probably 1-2 hours a night from 7/12 to 7/29 on weeknights doing Manhattan SC and other OG stuff.

I think I covered everything, and if you read this far, I commend you for not falling asleep! If you have any questions, please feel free to ask and I'll try my best to answer. Now I will spend more time in the B-school App section, as the journey has just begun (unfortunately). PM me if you need me to respond and I haven't in a while. Sometimes I don't get the notifications.

Thank you all again at GMATClub! You guys have been wonderful to me! Woohoo!

You have no idea how inspirational that post was. When I started 3 weeks back, I wanted to write GMAT in march, after a week, pushed it to early november, then to mid october. Now, I am thinking late september to meet the spring 2008 PT deadline.

All along, one thing that has worried me the most are the posts that boast of several months of studying. In some cases, even years. Late September would mean only 2 months of haphazard preparation.

I also spend about 1-3 hrs on weeknights, 6-7 hours on weekends for this. Even though my verbal skills are no where near yours(clearly evident from our posts), I hope this extra month helps me to bridge this gap at least partially.

All the best for your essays!!!
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14 Aug 2007, 00:18
I have added your story among the legendary ones of GMATClub members

Good Luck for the next steps ! :D
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14 Aug 2007, 04:26
Thank you ioiio, glad my debrief can help! Good luck with your test!

Thanks Fig! I'm honored to be placed amongst the great GMATClub stories!
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14 Aug 2007, 09:30
i need the veritas handout
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14 Aug 2007, 15:29
check if Veritas sells it separately.
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15 Aug 2007, 20:22
Since this thread is stickied (thanks Fig!), I will post a few PM responses I've given after my test, just for completeness sake, and hopefully it'll help some others out there. If you have questions about what the original question was, let me know, I can look it up. The answers should be pretty obvious though.

Quote:
Hi there,

Yeah, everyone does it differently, thus explains all the different strategies. I never read the Kaplan and Arco books, so I don't know how much it helps, but I'm guessing they're somewhat similar to the Princeton Review books, which a lot of people recommend. I thought the PR book was good, but only really gave you high level strategy. The Veritas books were better, but that came with a friend's class work.

Manhattan SC was the only Manhattan I used, but I had a copy of their Fractions/Decimals/Percentages book, and that was well written too. The best part is they do questions off the OG11 and Verbal/Quant Review. That's what I liked about it.

As for CATs, I really don't think you should do Kaplan, from the bad reviews it got all across the board. PR was pretty bad too. Manhattan's verbal is pretty similar, and their math is very hard, but the scoring is roughly similar (add 2-4 pts to the math score they give you). I personally think other than PowerPrep and GMATPrep, the 6 MGMAT CATs are the best to prepare for the test. Just save GMATPrep2 for the final weekend before your test and do it with the AWA.

If you know anyone who took a Veritas class, ask them if they have all the math or verbal review books, ESPECIALLY the "Advanced Number Properties" pamphlet. Those are really good for foundation building.

Hope that helps!

Some info about if you are weak at math:

Quote:
Hrm... looks like you need to learn the advanced concepts using some good books. If you're taking the Veritas book, you should be getting their Quant set of books, especially "Advanced Number Properties". Do all the problems in there and UNDERSTAND the concept being taught. If you have problems factoring quadratic equations, then do a lot of those. If you have problems with geometry, learn all the geometry rules and practice them.

If you're only doing CATs to "practice", then you're not going to learn as much. I would highly suggest doing problem by problem on the OG, and methodically identify what concept is being tested on every question. Then if you get it wrong or only get half way, go to the Veritas book or even GMAT Club courses and learn the concept.

I think the only way is to do lots of problems NOT in a CAT situation, so you have time to digest the concept and get better at Geometry and Algebra. Give that a try and see how you do.

More on math and RC:

Quote:
Have you looked at why you miss math questions? Is it because you don't understand the concepts, or is it because you make stupid errors? If the former, you should read more math review books from Manhattan, Kaplan, and the likes, especially for subjects you aren't as familiar with. If it's mistakes, then you need to do more problems, and remember why you miss some of the questions. I kept on doing the practices, double and triple checked on the test to get Q51.

DS you really have to get used to all the types of questions, so doing questions is the best way. Understand the concept, and take your time in solving things. Don't just assume something off the top of your head and not double check or think about it a little.

Not much for RC. I've always done RC well, since the SATs. I would say read all the passages in the OG and the verbal review, do some Manhattan GMAT verbal stuff. Maybe get the Manhattan RC book. The more you read, the better you'll get. =)
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15 Aug 2007, 20:26
prospective mba wrote:
i am very impressed.
thank you for the debriefing!
i am very frustrated right now since i am making no progress. i've taken two exams (GMATprep + MGMAT) and both scores were atrociously low.

dont fret. taking only two practice exams is just a baby step. shoot for 7 or 8 (at least IMHO) keep on practicing.

and MGMAT Quant is *ridiculously* hard. Verbal seems OK... but Q is so hard as to be unrealistic i think. The people who can finish MGMAT Q with a 47+ in 75 minutes are Quant gods.
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15 Aug 2007, 20:34
yeah... I tried, but couldn't get above Q47 on MGMAT... so based on my other scores, I think you can just add 2-4 pts to your Q score from MGMAT and you can get your overall score (roughly 10 pts per point of Q, roughly).
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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17 Jul 2008, 20:22
congrats!!
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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19 Jul 2008, 06:14
Hey great score mate! All the best.
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2008, 12:04
what's with the necro posting
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2008, 20:23
woh... this came back from la-la land...
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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11 May 2009, 00:57

Please keep us posted of your application process. Good luck with everything!
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!) [#permalink]

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11 May 2009, 21:11
wow, I can't believe this thread is still around!
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Re: OH YEAH BABY!!! (760 Q51 V41 EDIT:AWA 6.0!)   [#permalink] 11 May 2009, 21:11

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