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Our understanding was that she would continue to cover the

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Our understanding was that she would continue to cover the [#permalink] New post 15 Nov 2010, 14:56
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Our understanding was that she would continue to cover the costs of school enrollment and room and board for the children, which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.


A. which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
C. of which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
D. both of which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
E. both of which she agreed to pay with the rest of the family verbally.




Please provide your thought process for a better discussion.
[Reveal] Spoiler: OA

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Last edited by scheol79 on 16 Nov 2010, 21:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 15 Nov 2010, 19:52
I don't want to give away the answer to this question until people have had a chance to take a look at it, but I'd like to lead the discussion down a path:

We always want to start off with the most straight-forward grammatical split on SC. If you've been following along in the various discussions about modifiers, you should be able to very quickly cross off a few answers for a clear reason. Any takers? (Hint: noun modifiers!)
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Last edited by BKimball on 16 Nov 2010, 14:51, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 01:27
IMO D.
A and B uses 'which' just after children, which i feel is not correct.
out of C,D and E.
D seems grammatically correct.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 01:36
A. which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
Incorrect: Incorrect use of Which. Which refers to immediate noun it "Touches".
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
Incorrect: Same as A.
C. of which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
Incorrect: The use of "Of which" is not justified. It is used better in situations such as " Some of which"..
D. both of which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
Correct: Here verbally is correctly modifying "agreed".
E. both of which she agreed to pay with the rest of the family verbally.
Incorrect: The misplacement of Verbally obscures the meaning.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 02:10
scheol79 wrote:
Our understanding was that she would continue to cover the costs of school enrollment and room and board for the children, which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.


A. which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
C. of which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
D. both of which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
E. both of which she agreed to pay with the rest of the family verbally.




Please provide your thought process for a better discussion.



I'd also go with D. 'which' is ambiguous in A and B. 'of which' is grammatically incorrect in C. 'verbally' at the end of the sentence in E distorts meaning.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 03:28
BKimball wrote:
I don't want to give away the answer to this question until people have had a chance to take a look at it, but I'd like to lead the discussion down a path:

We always want to start off with the most straight-forward grammatical split on SC. If you've been following along in the various discussions about modifiers, you should be able to very quickly cross off A and B for a clear reason. Any takers? (Hint: noun modifiers!)



BKimball:

What do u mean by:

We always want to start off with the most straight-forward grammatical split on SC.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 13:21
A. which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family - which here is incorrect as it does not touch a noun.
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay -which here is incorrect as it does not touch a noun.
C. of which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay - I don't know how to eliminate this, but "of which" does not seem to be correct.
D. both of which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family - correct answer. logical construction
E. both of which she agreed to pay with the rest of the family verbally - the last part states she paid verbally.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 14:18
OA is not D according to OE. I will post OA after more discussion.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 15:03
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Alright! We've got some great discussion going here! Glad we took the bait! :-)

Here's the thing about noun modifiers. As much as we say that a noun modifier must touch the noun it is modifying, there is an exception to this rule. For example:

"The work of art, which is hanging on the wall, was painted by Picasso." --> Here, "which is hanging on the wall" correctly modifies the "work."

How is that possible?

The phrase "of art" is a prepositional phrase that also modifies the "work." Prepositional phrases can stand between nouns and their modifiers.

Other examples:

"The team of twelve, which had come in first place last year, sulked at the defeat."
"The time of day, which can be discerned using a sun dial, is based on the rotation of the Earth."

If we go back to the example above, we see that "of school enrollment and room and board for the children" is all modifying the "costs" and thus the ",which..." modifier is acceptable.

I know scheol knows the answer, and it looks like praveenism is onto something. How can we then rule out other answers?

@ puneetpratik: By "start off with the most straight-forward grammatical split" I mean that if there are modifier issues, pronoun issues, concision issues, and subject-verb issues in a given SC problem, you should start off with the one that is the most clear. For most people, that would be subject-verb agreement. We each need to know where we feel most comfortable.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 17:51
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay. IMO, here, she agreed with her family. Wrong.

C. of which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay. “OF” is incorrect, and again, she agrees with the family. Wrong

D. both of which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family. I think “which” should cover the word “costs”, not each individually.

E. both of which she agreed to pay with the rest of the family verbally. Same as D.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 20:44
BKimball wrote:
Alright! We've got some great discussion going here! Glad we took the bait! :-)

Here's the thing about noun modifiers. As much as we say that a noun modifier must touch the noun it is modifying, there is an exception to this rule. For example:

"The work of art, which is hanging on the wall, was painted by Picasso." --> Here, "which is hanging on the wall" correctly modifies the "work."

How is that possible?

The phrase "of art" is a prepositional phrase that also modifies the "work." Prepositional phrases can stand between nouns and their modifiers.

Other examples:

"The team of twelve, which had come in first place last year, sulked at the defeat."
"The time of day, which can be discerned using a sun dial, is based on the rotation of the Earth."

If we go back to the example above, we see that "of school enrollment and room and board for the children" is all modifying the "costs" and thus the ",which..." modifier is acceptable.

I know scheol knows the answer, and it looks like praveenism is onto something. How can we then rule out other answers?

@ puneetpratik: By "start off with the most straight-forward grammatical split" I mean that if there are modifier issues, pronoun issues, concision issues, and subject-verb issues in a given SC problem, you should start off with the one that is the most clear. For most people, that would be subject-verb agreement. We each need to know where we feel most comfortable.


In that case, I'd pick A. But I'm not sure i'd correctly answer similar questions in the future! :(
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 20:45
Thanks Brett.

scheol79, can we have the OA please?
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 21:24
This is a tough one.

OA is B.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 21:41
Wow. I got it wrong on the second chance as well! Can you please tell me why B is better than A?
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 22:49
Werewolf wrote:
Wow. I got it wrong on the second chance as well! Can you please tell me why B is better than A?



A and B have slightly different meanings.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 16 Nov 2010, 22:57
scheol79 wrote:
Werewolf wrote:
Wow. I got it wrong on the second chance as well! Can you please tell me why B is better than A?



A and B have slightly different meanings.


Does A imply that the family will also be paying?
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 17 Nov 2010, 02:19
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Great Question, I simply sticked out A and B because of "Which" as a knee jerk reaction. Will keep this thing in mind :) Thanks @ Brett !!!

About difference between option A and B, I believe it goes as follows :
A. which she verbally agreed to pay with the rest of the family.
B. which she agreed verbally with the rest of the family to pay.
In Option A, it appears as if she were paying not by money but by "rest of family" !!
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 17 Nov 2010, 02:54
This sentence requires the correct placement of the adverb verbally, indicating the way in which the agreement was made, and the correct use of phrases indicating with whom (the rest of the family) the agreement was made.

A. The phrase with the rest of the family is misplaced, making it sound as if the subject of the sentence and the rest of the family were planning to pay the fees together.
B. The adverb verbally comes immediately after the verb agreed, indicating their correlation, and the placement of the phrase with the rest of the family makes it clear that the agreement was between the two parties.
C. The word of is unnecessary and confusing.
D. The phrase with the rest of the family is misplaced, making it sound as if the subject of the sentence and the family were planning to pay the fees together; also the word both is unnecessary and confusing.
E. Verbally is misplaced, making it sound as if the promised payments will be made by speaking.
The correct answer is B.

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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 17 Nov 2010, 20:23
I would eliminate B just for the reason that it changes the meaning of the original sentence. If A is grammatically correct, IMO we should look no further.

scheol79 wrote:
This sentence requires the correct placement of the adverb verbally, indicating the way in which the agreement was made, and the correct use of phrases indicating with whom (the rest of the family) the agreement was made.

A. The phrase with the rest of the family is misplaced, making it sound as if the subject of the sentence and the rest of the family were planning to pay the fees together.
B. The adverb verbally comes immediately after the verb agreed, indicating their correlation, and the placement of the phrase with the rest of the family makes it clear that the agreement was between the two parties.
C. The word of is unnecessary and confusing.
D. The phrase with the rest of the family is misplaced, making it sound as if the subject of the sentence and the family were planning to pay the fees together; also the word both is unnecessary and confusing.
E. Verbally is misplaced, making it sound as if the promised payments will be made by speaking.
The correct answer is B.
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Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test. [#permalink] New post 25 Nov 2010, 16:52
I am still a little confused. Is the correct answer A or B ?
Re: Costs of school enrollment. GMAT Club Test.   [#permalink] 25 Nov 2010, 16:52
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