BrainFog wrote:
Thank you so much for your reply bb. I do not have any support system anywhere in the U.S. My wife will accompany me but that's all the family I'll have in the States. I really wanted to choose Smith, largely because of the location, but the feedback about the school that I have received so far is not positive. Especially the careers office everyone say can improve a lot. In fact I asked them for some details a few days back myself and I'm yet to hear back and I asked more than one person. To give you an idea, the following is the feedback I got from three different students students
1) it is tough for an international student to get a job through "career services". That's because of several reasons, the location, talent pool and inability of business development/career services teams.
2) In general, it is true that placements for international students aren't great at Smith. You are mostly on your own to get an interview.
3) All the things you have heard about location, placement of international students, federal employees on campus, financial service firms not coming /sponsoring are sadly true! Off late, it has become increasingly difficult for international students at Smith to reach out to companies which do sponsor, maybe its because of our small batch size.
Furthermore, none of the first years have landed an internship so far. And among second year students only 25% have graduate offers so far, which also include 5% who converted their internship into graduate offers.
On the other hand 9/10 students had positive things to say about Tippie, especially its career office which they say goes an extra mile to place you. Yes it is lower ranked and a small program but placement numbers are really good. If I take investment banking and investment management out of the equation, does it become an attractive option? Finance is my preferable option but I'm not too rigid about it. Everyone I speak with say considering the current H1-B situation, I should be flexible with my career choices.
A part of me also says take a loan and go with the highest ranked option, which is Kelley but even if I get a very decent job I'll be paying back loans for 5 years post-MBA at least and that really scares me. I always wanted to go to a top well recognized school but finances held me back so I didn't even apply. I hope 10-20 years down the line I won't regret that I didn't apply to top schools or had a decent second tier offer but didn't go there.
I noticed you didn't mention Carlson at all. Is it because I don't have scholarship detail yet? Or you would rate it the lowest?
I did not mention Carlson due to the scholarship and it seems that was how it played out with only 30%.
As to the loan, you are looking to pay for a while longer than 5 years. Just to set your expectations about a loan, it usually longer for a few reasons:
1. It is a big amount - e.g. your 100K will grow to be around $110-115K by the time you graduate (you borrow each year in separate installments)
2. You have 6 months after graduation usually to start making payments and most don't really start early as they try to build up a safety cushion with their early salary/pay
3. Let's assume you land a $100K job and it goes up to 120K within 3 years or so. That's a lot of money... but not really as you will be paying 25-30% in taxes. That shaves off $25-30K right away. Then even if you have cheap rent, you have to buy new clothes for work, you have to usually buy a car, or fix the old one, and have a bunch of other expenses that have been differed during bschool.
4. Your spending also goes up because mentally you feel you make a ton of money; you go out; eat out, etc. Heaven forbid you get a girlfriend (assuming you are a guy).
5. It also is a fairly low interest rate so the temptation of people is always to put the money into the stock market where returns tend to be higher
6. Usually the first year after graduation, it is a very odd state where you feel like you are finally getting paid a lot of money but the money runs out quick. You are a finance person so you may have a much better handle on the finances than I did but paying the loan off takes time.
Anyway, interesting to know about Smith - it is good you are doing your research. The raw numbers from US News I am able to see are looking just fine but statistics has a way of doing that. However, I would caution you about over-positive reviews from Students. We just started a Business School Review section and most of them are super positive and that's because many people won't tell you about problems right away. Only those who are close to you and trust you (or are disgruntled) will spill the beans. Also, Tippie's program size is small and with only 50 graduating students, the career office (1 person probably) can find a few slots among alum network that need the most help. That's something I failed to consider in my analysis, and it is a strength of a program - the smaller you are the easier it is to engage people and folks stay in touch more so.
Of the Tippie review, the weakness a reviewer pointed out was: Career Opportunities provided by the school
https://gmatclub.com/reviews/business_school/tippie-38Same is with Smith:
https://gmatclub.com/reviews/business_school/smith-72P.S. International students usually have a harder time with employment due to many companies not hiring/dealing with H1B candidates. That is true regardless of whatever school you have gone. There are ways around it (by working for consulting companies, etc) but it is very true. As an international candidate, you will have one more hoop to jump compared to the US job seekers. Even Tuck people have an issue with it:
https://thedartmouth.com/2015/01/16/when ... certainty/ (this talks about undergrad mostly but still, that's Ivy League undergrad).
Ultimately the two schools are very similar. If Tippie career services are as good as they claim, then it is worth freezing your tail off in the cornfields of Iowa
I am attaching some stats for both schools
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