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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the

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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the [#permalink] New post 29 May 2004, 04:23
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.

(A) that flourished at the same time as the civilizations
(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
(C) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were


Please explain your answers. Thank you in advance.
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Re: Need help me on this one. Doubts!! [#permalink] New post 05 Jun 2010, 23:59
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Hi Guys-- besides the much-discussed comparison, did you catch the idiom they're testing you on? See explanations below.

Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the
Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an
ancient civilization that flourished at the same time
as the civilizations
in the Nile Delta and the river
valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.
(A) that flourished at the same time as the
civilizations
(B) that had flourished at the same time as had
the civilizations
(C) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were

A. The comparison uses the idiom same X.... as Y. X is 'an ancient civilization', and Y is a 'the civilizations'-- a logical comparison. And what about tenses? How do we know that the past simple (flourished) is needed? The time modifier for the verb is "at the same time"; now, 'at' indicates a specific point in the past.

Note on ellipses in comparisons: As long as the verb of comparison is in the same tense for both items of comparison, you do not need to repeat the verb (you can but don't need to).

Ex. I ate dinner at the same time as my brother ('did'-- optional).
Ex. I eat as much as my brother ate ('ate'-- not optional) when he was on the football team.


B. The only error in B is the past perfect, "had flourished", for there is no indication that the flourishing had taken place before some other point in the past.

C. NOTE: THERE IS NOT 'AS'! Once you start with the word 'same' you must complete the idiom with 'as'. Second, every time you run into the words 'that'/'those' (or any pronoun for that matter) you must ask yourself 'that'/'those' what? Here, 'those' indicates 'those civilizations,' BUT THE WORD 'CIVILIZATIONS' (plural) IS NOT IN THE SENTENCE. So there is no referent for the pronoun.

D. Same as C

E. Same as C


Hope this helped!

-Sarai

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Re: Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the [#permalink] New post 29 Aug 2013, 05:27
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gmatter0913 wrote:
I have the same doubt regarding this question.

The OA is A, but I am not convinced.

(A) that flourished at the same time as the civilizations

It has to be:

(A) that flourished at the same time as did the civilizations

or Am I missing any grammar rule??

Please comment


if this was the option then also it is not wrong:
(A) that flourished at the same time as did the civilizations

we can omit the verbs when the following condition are met:
1)we should have parallel construction involving verbs
2)verbs of both (or all if more than 2 structures are parallel) are exactly the same (in the same tense including)
3)omitting verb doesn't create ambiguity.

if above condition satisfy then we can omit the verb in ALL BUT the first.

coming to this question:
we have 2 parallel structure:
the site of an ancient civilization flourished
at the same time as
the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys flourished.
or
DID the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys


Now we can see all three condition are meeting.
so we can omit verb from 2nd parallel structure.
hope this much is clear.

similar simple example:
francis ran faster than xavier ran.
francis ran faster than xavier..
francis ran faster than did xavier.
francis ran faster than xavier did.


all the above 4 sentences are correct only thing is that 2 nd sentence is best

take another example when after removing verb sentence becomes ambiguous
the tycoon supported Jones
more than
anyone else supported jones.

first 2 conditions are satisfied ...lets remove the verb and check for ambiguity thing.

the tycoon supported Jones more than anyone else in the industry.

now here it is ambiguous.
how?
there can be 2 meanings.
1)the tycoon supported jones more than the tycoon supported anyone else
2)the tycoon supported jones more than anyone else supported jones.

now under these cases you are not going to OMIT the verbs.

hope it helps
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 [#permalink] New post 02 Feb 2005, 05:30
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A !

because first action "threaten" is present tense and second action took place before the first action and therefore past tense "flourished" is needed. moreover the comparision between the civilizations is right
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 [#permalink] New post 15 Mar 2005, 09:31
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization (that flourished at the same time as the civilizations) in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.

(A) that flourished at the same time as the civilizations
- 'that' introduces an essential modifier for the 'civilization' preceding the phrase. the use of past tense would make the mohenjo civilization exists in the same time as the civilizations in the nile and tigris/euphrates had

(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
- 'past perfect' suggests the Mohenjo civilization died out before the civilizations in the Nilte delta and river valleys of tigris and euphrates

(C) that flourished at the same time those had
- 'those does not have a clear referent'

(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
- 'those' does not have a referent

(E) flourishing at the same time as those were
- 'those' does not have a referent

A it is.
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Re: SC- Mohenjodaro [#permalink] New post 15 Jul 2008, 12:42
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Found these notes somewhere and kind of liked them so thought to share them

Attachment:
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tell me if they are useful
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Re: Mohenjo-Daro civilization [#permalink] New post 27 Mar 2009, 06:32
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should be A

If we want to use verb+ing , i think sentence has to change something like this:

Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan,the site of an ancient civilization, flourishing at the same time as the civilazations in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.
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Re: Mohenjo-Daro civilization [#permalink] New post 11 Apr 2010, 10:51
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Hey All,

Good work getting to the bottom of this one. However, I thought I'd give my two cents to answer a question that seems to remain here. Namely, why is A correct when it doesn't contain the verb "did", which would make things less parallel. The answer has to do with meaning.

The reason we insert a verb in sentences sometimes is to remove ambiguity. If there's no ambiguity, we don't need to change it. For example:

I work out at the same time as my mom.

There's no need to say: "I work out at the same time as my mom does". There's no confusion. The meaning doesn't change with or without the word "does".

Hope that helps!

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Need help me on this one. Doubts!! [#permalink] New post 03 Jun 2010, 11:24
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the
Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an
ancient civilization that flourished at the same time
as the civilizations
in the Nile Delta and the river
valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.
(A) that flourished at the same time as the
civilizations
(8) that had flourished at the same time as had
the civilizations
(e) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were

Please support your answers with explanations!!

Thanks
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Re: Need help me on this one. Doubts!! [#permalink] New post 05 Jun 2010, 11:09
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mrik wrote:
izaidi wrote:
(A) that flourished at the same time as the civilizations
correct

(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
past perfect must be paired with past tense

(C) that flourished at the same time those had
those does not have an antecedent

(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
prefer a verb to an adjective, those does not have an antecedent

(E) flourishing at the same time as those were
prefer a verb to an adjective, those does not have an antecedent

Can you please explain your reasoning that "past perfect must be paired with past tense". I am not familiar with it.



Past Perfect Tense = had + [past participle]

The Past Perfect is used to clarify the sequence of two events that occur in the past: the earlier past, and the later past. Use the Past Perfect for the earlier past and the Simple Past for the later past. However the later past can also be a time event.

Ex: I did not have any money because I had lost my wallet.
Ex: By 1950, I had broken my heart twice.

* I advise you to learn about the Perfect and Progressive tenses.
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Re: Need help me on this one. Doubts!! [#permalink] New post 13 Jun 2010, 00:34
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(For more on the subjunctive, check out the Small Details lesson at gmaxonline!)
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the [#permalink] New post 13 Apr 2013, 03:41
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys of Tigris and Euphrates.

a. that flourished at the same time as the civilizations
b. that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
c. that flourished at the same time those had
d. flourishing at the same time as those did
e. flourishing at the same time as those were

Just one query for option d,e- is it wrong to use present participle (flourishing) for something in happened in past or we can go ahead use that
whether D will be correct if i say:

flourishing at the same time as the civilizations

Waiting for your valuable replies
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 [#permalink] New post 29 May 2004, 17:43
This is talking about verb inversion + the verb ellipsed.

that flourished at the same time as did ( Inverted verb before the noun and also ellipsed) the civilizations.

Inverted verb comes before the noun. Sentence like these carry high marks.
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Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the [#permalink] New post 01 Feb 2005, 23:34
Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Koro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.
(A)
(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
(C) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were
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 [#permalink] New post 02 Feb 2005, 01:20
Between (B) and (D). Go for (B) since I don't know what "those" in (D) refers to. Little suspect about the use of past perfect in (B) though.
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Re: SC: salt deposits [#permalink] New post 02 Feb 2005, 04:55
HongHu wrote:
Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Koro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.
(A)
(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
(C) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were


b/w A and B, I go with A.
(B) past perfect tense is needless.
(C)(D)(E) those has no referent
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 [#permalink] New post 05 Feb 2005, 11:14
(B)...probably doesn't need past perfect but other choices don't sound even this good.
(A)...Time compared with Civilization ..I guess
(C)..."as" missing...and "did" should have been better than "had" may be
(D) and (E)..-ings..don't know why we need that.

(B)
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salt deposits [#permalink] New post 16 Feb 2005, 07:13
Salt deposits and moisture threaten to destroy the Mohenjo-Daro excavation in Pakistan, the site of an ancient civilization (that flourished at the same time as the civilizations) in the Nile delta and the river valleys of the Tigris and Euphrates.

(A) that flourished at the same time as the civilizations
(B) that had flourished at the same time as had the civilizations
(C) that flourished at the same time those had
(D) flourishing at the same time as those did
(E) flourishing at the same time as those were
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 [#permalink] New post 16 Feb 2005, 08:13
it is A)

because it uses the right tense (past tense; because it happened before the first action => "threaten") and it compares civilizations to civilizations
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 [#permalink] New post 16 Feb 2005, 09:22
if we go by ellipsis
IMO it should be like this--

the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations had flourished in the nile delta and the river valleys of-----.

am i right, or should it be

the site of an ancient civilization that flourished at the same time as the civilizations flourished in the nile delta and the river valleys of-----

please comment
  [#permalink] 16 Feb 2005, 09:22
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