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Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp

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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 29 Nov 2013, 19:11
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antiant wrote:
Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp increases in the population of snow geese, which breed in the Arctic and are displacing birds of less vigorous species. Although snow geese are a popular quarry for hunters in the southern regions where they winter, the hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent, according to official estimates. Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover.

Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?

(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese.
(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date.
(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.
(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons.
(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation.



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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 29 Nov 2013, 19:21
Bluelagoon wrote:
Karishma,
Lets say the hunting season is from Jan to June and for many years the hunters reach the 5% goal in april. How does this weaken the argument that If we drop the restriction altogether than it will help other species.

In D , it is stated that they have moved on to a different location so dropping the restriction will have no affect.



I agree with you; right answer must be D.

:-D
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 30 Nov 2013, 22:00
OA is B

It occurred to me that in (D), the region that we are talking about here is southern vs. Arctic, which might not effectively have anything to do to affect the conclusion.
However, with (B), since the hunting season is ending before the scheduled time, that means hunters are reaching the max 5% and there still has been been an increase in the geese population. Therefore, dropping the restriction will also do no good.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 05 Feb 2014, 05:44
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Conclusion:
Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover.

Reasoning:
Here's a causal reasoning in that dropping the hunting restriction would allow the other species [arctic birds] to recover. Thus, any other claim that disproves the relationship works. Look for: 1) alternative causes 2) no cause -> effect 3) cause -> no effect 4) reverse relationship 5) undermining data.

(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese. Opposite answer - Strengthen. If hunting limits were imposed + hunting has reduced population over five percent, then dropping the restriction would likely allow the other species to recover.

(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date. OK - This weakens the conclusion in that if the cause happened [dropping the restriction had occurred], then there would be no effect [species would not have recovered] (because there's already too many geese).

(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years. Opposite answer - Strengthen. If the number of snow geese taken by hunter has grown + a sharp increase in snow geese are displacing bird of less vigorous species, then dropping the restriction would allow the other species to recover. A lot of different nouns to keep track of makes this choice confusing.

(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons. Out of scope. Whether or not the snow geese had the grounds before the Arctic birds, the main claim still stands that dropping the hunting restriction would help.

(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation. Opposite answer - Strengthen. If the snow geese had no natural predation, then dropping the restriction would allow the other species to recover.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 05 Feb 2014, 05:48
reetskaur wrote:
OA is B

It occurred to me that in (D), the region that we are talking about here is southern vs. Arctic, which might not effectively have anything to do to affect the conclusion.
However, with (B), since the hunting season is ending before the scheduled time, that means hunters are reaching the max 5% and there still has been been an increase in the geese population. Therefore, dropping the restriction will also do no good.


Hi reetskaur,

Your reasoning for B above is backwards. The hunters have not reached their 5% max. Therefore, dropping the restriction would do no good.
I hope this helps.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 05 Feb 2014, 09:33
WE HAVE TO FIND AN ANSWER WHICH PROVES THAT THAT EVEN IF hunting season IS PERMITTED BEYOND THE reduction in the population of geese by five percent, the population would not be reduced to the extent that Arctic birds are not threatened anymore.....

what if the wintering grounds are not fixed and the birds surprise the hunters by changing to new locations for wintering.......

clear "D".....

(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons....CORRECT...



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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 10 Mar 2014, 02:56
I would say C.

C says that the increase in hunting has no effect to control the growth and it clearly undermines the argument that increase in hunting would cut down the population of geese which would in turn save other species.

As I have just started preparing, there is a good chance that I might be wrong. If that's the case, kindly explain why it cannot be C.

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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 10 Mar 2014, 22:48
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govindsowrirajan wrote:
I would say C.

C says that the increase in hunting has no effect to control the growth and it clearly undermines the argument that increase in hunting would cut down the population of geese which would in turn save other species.

As I have just started preparing, there is a good chance that I might be wrong. If that's the case, kindly explain why it cannot be C.

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Actually (C) is not correct.

It's a weaken question. The golden rule is to focus on the conclusion and try to weaken it.
What is the conclusion here? " Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover."

You have to try to weaken it i.e. give reasons why even after dropping this restriction, it is unlikely that other species will recover.

(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date

Option B tells you that the restriction doesn't really matter much. It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season closing down early. This means that the population of geese is enough so the restriction hasn't come into effect in the recent years. This implies that even if the restriction is removed, it is likely that there will be no change in the situation. This definitely weakens our conclusion that dropping the restriction will help other species to recover.

(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.

(C) doesn't tell us how dropping the restriction would impact the geese population. It just tells us what has happened in the past - the number of geese hunted has been increasing. If anything, it might strengthen our conclusion if the number of geese hunted is close to 5% of the population. When the population decreases by 5%, if the restriction is dropped, chances are that more geese will be hunted and other species will recover. We have to show how even after dropping the restriction, the other species may not recover.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 10 Mar 2014, 23:02
VeritasPrepKarishma wrote:
govindsowrirajan wrote:
I would say C.

C says that the increase in hunting has no effect to control the growth and it clearly undermines the argument that increase in hunting would cut down the population of geese which would in turn save other species.

As I have just started preparing, there is a good chance that I might be wrong. If that's the case, kindly explain why it cannot be C.

Cheers,
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Actually (C) is not correct.

It's a weaken question. The golden rule is to focus on the conclusion and try to weaken it.
What is the conclusion here? " Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover."

You have to try to weaken it i.e. give reasons why even after dropping this restriction, it is unlikely that other species will recover.

(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date

Option B tells you that the restriction doesn't really matter much. It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season closing down early. This means that the population of geese is enough so the restriction hasn't come into effect in the recent years. This implies that even if the restriction is removed, it is likely that there will be no change in the situation. This definitely weakens our conclusion that dropping the restriction will help other species to recover.

(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.

(C) doesn't tell us how dropping the restriction would impact the geese population. It just tells us what has happened in the past - the number of geese hunted has been increasing. If anything, it might strengthen our conclusion if the number of geese hunted is close to 5% of the population. When the population decreases by 5%, if the restriction is dropped, chances are that more geese will be hunted and other species will recover. We have to show how even after dropping the restriction, the other species may not recover.


Ah. I see it now. Need to get working to avoid such blunders. Thanks a lot for the explanation. :)

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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 31 May 2014, 19:08
Ugh! I just took this question in my GMATPrep practice exam session and eliminated B, because of irrelevance. Even after I read B again, it sounds so convoluted and seems to be intentionally written (mainly because of the "being") such that most can not understand it. I can vouch that the OA is B though.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 19 Oct 2014, 15:49
VeritasPrepKarishma wrote:
vdadwal wrote:
Karishma,
Lets say the hunting season is from Jan to June and for many years the hunters reach the 5% goal in april. How does this weaken the argument that If we drop the restriction altogether than it will help other species.

In D , it is stated that they have moved on to a different location so dropping the restriction will have no affect.


Option B tells you that the restriction has not come into effect since many years. "It has been many years since ..." means the restriction came into effect many years ago and since then, it has NOT come into effect. So if the hunting season is from Jan to June, it has been closing in June only. This means that even if hunters hunt for the entire hunting season, they still do not reach the 5% limit. So removing the restriction will have no effect.


I think this explanation is quite clear, I misunderstood the "it has been many years since…“ . The correct understanding is that it happened before,but never since then. So in the recent several years, the hunting season has not been closed earlier, which means the hunters do not reach the 5% for years.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 12 May 2015, 21:34
Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp increases in the population of snow geese, which breed in the Arctic and are displacing birds of less vigorous species. Although snow geese are a popular quarry for hunters in the southern regions where they winter, the hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent, according to official estimates. Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover.

Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?

Conclusion : Dropping the restriction will increase the population of species of arctic birds which are predated by geese.

(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese -> Irrelevant

(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date ->
This option says that there are so many geese that every year, the hunting season ends (with the 5% restriction) earlier than scheduled date.
So the population productivity is more and cannot be decreased drastically by dropping the restriction -> Correct


(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years -> Supports the conclusion

(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons
The premise doesn't say that hunters cannot go to "recolonized wintering grounds" so doesn't impact the argument

(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation -> Irrelevant
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 18 Aug 2015, 01:39
VeritasPrepKarishma wrote:
AnChu wrote:
VeritasPrepKarishma wrote:
It's a weaken question. The golden rule is to focus on the conclusion and try to weaken it.
What is the conclusion here? " Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover."

You have to try to weaken it i.e. give reasons why even after dropping this restriction, it is unlikely that other species will recover.

(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date

Option B tells you that the restriction doesn't really matter much. It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season closing down early. This means that the population of geese is enough so the restriction hasn't come into effect in the recent years. This implies that even if the restriction is removed, it is likely that there will be no change in the situation. This definitely weakens our conclusion that dropping the restriction will help other species to recover.

Hi Karishma,

The restriction does really matter if the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date because the hunters have already reduced the population by five percent before the scheduled date. So dropping the restriction would help the other pecies recover, for example, increase the reduction to 10%.


Snow geese breed in Arctic and fly south for winter. They are proliferating which is bad for other birds. Southern hunters reduce the number of geese when they fly south. There is a restriction in place that if the population of the geese that came reduces by 5%, hunting will stop. So if 100 birds flew south and 5 were hunted, hunting will stop. If 1000 birds flew south and 50 were hunted, hunting will be stopped. The argument says that we should drop this restriction to help other birds flourish (conclusion). Then hunters will hunt many more birds and reduce their numbers. Then the other Arctic birds will flourish.

We need to weaken it and say that dropping the restriction will not help other Arctic birds flourish. Even if this restriction of 'not hunting after 5%' is dropped and hunters are allowed to hunt as much as they want, the population of geese will still not reduce.

(B) says that the it has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date. This means that for many years, the 5% limit has not been reached. So southern hunters anyway hunt less than 50 birds when 1000 birds fly down south. So whether you have the restriction or not, the number of geese hunted is the same. Usually hunters hunt less than 50 birds. So even if you drop the restriction and tell them that they can hunt as much as they want, it will not help since they don't want to hunt much. They usually hunt only a little bit. So the geese population will not reduce by dropping this restriction.


Great explanation Karisshma.

Actually, I think many of guys here (including me initially) misunderstand the meaning that choice B conveys:
(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date

We all agree that the hunting season is closed because: The 5% limit is reached before scheduled date OR The scheduled date comes.
At first, I thought the meaning of choice B is that the hunting season has been closed earlier than the scheduled date for many years.
However, the correct meaning of choice B is that for many years, the above case has not been happening.. For example, let's say 2010 was the last year that the hunting season was closed earlier than scheduled date. So for 5 years, from 2010 to 2015, the hunting season has been closed at the scheduled date and the hunting down rate was below or equal to 5% at the closing date.

Then, choice B actually weakens the argument. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 08 Oct 2015, 04:11
fluke wrote:
antiant wrote:
Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp increases in the population of snow geese, which breed in the Arctic and are displacing birds of less vigorous species. Although snow geese are a popular quarry for hunters in the southern regions where they winter, the hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent, according to official estimates. Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover.

Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?

(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese.
(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date.
(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.
(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons.
(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation.


Good question.

"B" tells us that the hunters are not able to hunt even 5% of the snow geese population before the hunting season. Thus, lowering the restriction, or in other words, increasing the percent decrease to any value greater than 5 won't help at all.

Scenario:
100000- Snow geese available
Hunting restriction says: Can't hunt more than 5% of 100000 i.e. 5000 in the hunting season.
Fact: Hunters are not able to reach 5000 target by the close of the hunting season.

Argument: Increase the maximum number of geese that could be hunted to a value greater than 5%, say 10%. Even if the law allows the hunter to hunt 10,000 geese, it wouldn't do any good. If the hunters are not able to reach 5000 hunting target, they will definitely not reach 10,000 target. Thus, "B" undermines the argument/suggestion.

Ans: "B"



But in that case, aint we ignoring the line "The hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent," which I guess implies that hunting season is active only until 5% birds are killed. And since the hunters kill 5% birds earlier than the estimated end of season ("hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date"), is'nt option B indirectly strengthening the argument for removal of these restrictions ?
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 08 Oct 2015, 22:02
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hvb750 wrote:
fluke wrote:
antiant wrote:
Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp increases in the population of snow geese, which breed in the Arctic and are displacing birds of less vigorous species. Although snow geese are a popular quarry for hunters in the southern regions where they winter, the hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent, according to official estimates. Clearly, dropping this restriction would allow the other species to recover.

Which of the following, if true, most seriously undermines the argument?

(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese.
(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date.
(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.
(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons.
(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation.


Good question.

"B" tells us that the hunters are not able to hunt even 5% of the snow geese population before the hunting season. Thus, lowering the restriction, or in other words, increasing the percent decrease to any value greater than 5 won't help at all.

Scenario:
100000- Snow geese available
Hunting restriction says: Can't hunt more than 5% of 100000 i.e. 5000 in the hunting season.
Fact: Hunters are not able to reach 5000 target by the close of the hunting season.

Argument: Increase the maximum number of geese that could be hunted to a value greater than 5%, say 10%. Even if the law allows the hunter to hunt 10,000 geese, it wouldn't do any good. If the hunters are not able to reach 5000 hunting target, they will definitely not reach 10,000 target. Thus, "B" undermines the argument/suggestion.

Ans: "B"



But in that case, aint we ignoring the line "The hunting season ends if and when hunting has reduced the population by five percent," which I guess implies that hunting season is active only until 5% birds are killed. And since the hunters kill 5% birds earlier than the estimated end of season ("hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date"), is'nt option B indirectly strengthening the argument for removal of these restrictions ?


Say the hunting season is from 1st Dec to 28th Feb. It closes early if population decreases by 5%.

(B) It has been many years since that limit has reached
means for many years that limit has NOT been reached (I think you misunderstood option (B))
So option (B) is telling you that the rule has NO impact since the 5% limit anyway is not reached.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 15 Oct 2015, 12:19
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Answer B
The population is Snow geese is large enough that reduction of population by 5 % has not occured in many years before the end of the hunting season.
So ,even if the restriction is lifted , it is highly unlikely to change the situation .
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 01 Nov 2015, 05:39
It should be A. A is the only statement which points out pulling out the restrictions 'may' backfire.
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 01 Nov 2015, 21:32
Work up

goose kills birds.
humans kill (up to 5% "estimated" limit of goose)
Conclusion: remove 5% limit, so more goose are hunted and thus less birds hunted

What would undermine is something that says even if we remove the limit the goose population won't be affected.



(A) Hunting limits for snow geese were imposed many years ago in response to a sharp decline in the population of snow geese.
just FYI, doesn't affect anything. we are looking for something that says goose population won't be affected, this actually hints at goose population would sharply decline
(B) It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date.
says geese are hunted in winter, for example say winter ends in March. and people will hunt geese till they kill 5% of the population. This statement says it's been years since they were able to kill off 5% of the geese before hunting season or estimated "scheduled" date. so even if they lift the 5% hunting limit, it won't have an affect because they aren't ever able to reach the 5%
(C) The number of snow geese taken by hunters each year has grown every year for several years.
if anything this supports not weakens the statement. this says more geese are being hunted every year. but doesn't talk about what percent of geese, for example 800 geese killed last year out of 900 vs. 900 killed this year vs 2000 available geese.
(D) As their population has increased, snow geese have recolonized wintering grounds that they had not used for several seasons.
has nothing to do with hunting. who cares if the geese are at old wintering grounds or new ones. doesn't matter if they are being hunted in your back yard, or on the other side of the town
(E) In the snow goose’s winter habitats, the goose faces no significant natural predation.
talks about "natural predation" i.e. some other animal eating the goose. doesn't talk about hunting



This is kind of like your mom saying you can only eat 5% of your Halloween candy in 1 day. And you saying I wish my mom didn't have this 5% dumb rule than you'd be able to eat a lot more candy! and statement (b) is basically saying you aren't even able to eat 5% of your candy in a day, so that would weaken the argument (lifting the 5% limit)
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 02 Nov 2015, 14:19
I spent like 6 minutes on working it out. struggled very bad between B and E.

B indicates killing won't help in general, so at this point, it weakens the argument, which assumes killing will help:

it said: every year a constant rate of killing happens whereas the population still sharply increases. if killing is relevant, the the increase should be in check
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Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp [#permalink]

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New post 22 Mar 2016, 04:40
Hi Experts / chetan2u / daagh / mikemcgarry / aditya8062,

Please help me with this question.

Lets discuss the question stem first in a layman language-

In a particular area there are species 1. Arctic birds and 2. snow geese. Snow geese eat arctic birds. In that area there are hunters who kill snow geese, but hunters can't kill if they have already killed 5% of geese population eg- if there are 100 geese and hunters have already killed 5% of 100 ( 5 geese) and now the population is 95, so they can't kill remaining 95 geese.
But now question arises if hunters can't kill remaining 95 geese than these 95 geese will going to kill Arctic birds and so the population of arctic bird will going to decreases. Therefore, if we lift the ban and allow hunters to to go ahead and kill remaining 95 geese then they can't feed on Arctic birds and hence the population of Arctic birds will going to increase.

Conclusion--Bold part
Now we need to weaken the conclusion means we need to find something which shows that after killing remaining 95 geese the population of Arctic birds will NOT increase............What could be the reason...? :roll:

1) if hunter kill geese which feed on species Z. So the population of species Z will increase as geese will be killed...What if species Z feed on Arctic birds-- This will weaken.

Now lets look at options-

B.It has been many years since the restriction led to the hunting season for snow geese being closed earlier than the scheduled date.

It says that that hunting season has been closed EARLIER THAN SCHEDULED DATE.
How is this weakening..?

The scenario discussed by 1 of GMAT aspirant is--

_____________________________________________________________________________________________

100000- Snow geese available
Hunting restriction says: Can't hunt more than 5% of 100000 i.e. 5000 in the hunting season.
Fact: Hunters are not able to reach 5000 target by the close of the hunting season.

Argument: Increase the maximum number of geese that could be hunted to a value greater than 5%, say 10%. Even if the law allows the hunter to hunt 10,000 geese, it wouldn't do any good. If the hunters are not able to reach 5000 hunting target, they will definitely not reach 10,000 target. Thus, "B" undermines the argument/suggestion.

_____________________________________________________________________________________________

Its only mentioned that the hunting season closed many years before the scheduled date.
Nowhere is mention that the hunters were not able to kill 5000 geese... we can also say that might be hunters have already killed 5000 before the closure of scheduled date..


Please assist, how does B weakens conclusion.
_________________

Thanks and Regards,
Prakhar

Re: Some species of Arctic birds are threatened by recent sharp   [#permalink] 22 Mar 2016, 04:40

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