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Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers

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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 17 Mar 2014, 21:51
maheshsrini wrote:
Can you please clarify my question on the below sentence. What does the protecting and regulating modify?.

For the Stegosauraus, a dinosaur, the seventeen bony plates embedded in its back were necessary elements for survival, regulating its temperature throughout its bus-sized body and protecting it from much larger carnivores.


Can we change or rewrite the above sentence in the below way? Pls explain and correct me if I am wrong. Also explain what is the difference between these two sentences. And If the answer choices contain both of these options which one we need to choose..?

For the Stegosauraus, a dinosaur, the seventeen bony plates embedded in its back were necessary elements for survival, to regulate its temperature throughout its bus-sized body and to protect it from much larger carnivores
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 29 Mar 2014, 19:28
egmat wrote:
Singular “that” cannot refer to plural “life-forms”.


Hi,

that in "E) Scientists have gathered evidence that suggests a much earlier emergence of complex life-forms than that" refers to "emergence of complex life-forms" & not just "life-forms" & that should be correct.
"emergence of complex life-forms" is a noun phrase, so, "that" can refer to it => Evidence suggests a much earlier emergence of life-forms than the emergence (of life-forms) they had previously thought.

No? Could you please explain why or why not? I'm not able to get my head around it. Please help.
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 30 Mar 2014, 02:14
The level 1 for SC in egmat does states that verb-ed modifies the closest noun and there is no exception to it and all examples are given for nouns, however in explanation it states verb-ed modifies noun clause also , this creates confusion, this should be correct or should not be stated as rule with "nouns and without anu"
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 30 Mar 2014, 02:15
The level 1 for SC in egmat does states that verb-ed modifies the closest noun and there is no exception to it and all examples are given for nouns, however in explanation it states verb-ed modifies noun clause also , this creates confusion, this should be correct or should not be stated as rule with "nouns and without exception"
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 03 Apr 2014, 16:15
sonalj17 wrote:
The level 1 for SC in egmat does states that verb-ed modifies the closest noun and there is no exception to it and all examples are given for nouns, however in explanation it states verb-ed modifies noun clause also , this creates confusion, this should be correct or should not be stated as rule with "nouns and without exception"


Hi,
Thanks for replying.
The sentence is grammatically correct but is wordy & awkward & that is as big a problem as a grammatical error itself.
For more details, please read: digging-in-sediments-in-northern-china-evidence-has-been-136456-20.html#p1351352
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 16 May 2014, 13:22
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hhakud wrote:
For the Stegosauraus, a dinosaur, the seventeen bony plates embedded in its back were necessary elements for survival, regulating its temperature throughout its bus-sized body and protecting it from much larger carnivores.

Can we change or rewrite the above sentence in the below way? Pls explain and correct me if I am wrong. Also explain what is the difference between these two sentences. And If the answer choices contain both of these options which one we need to choose..?

For the Stegosauraus, a dinosaur, the seventeen bony plates embedded in its back were necessary elements for survival, to regulate its temperature throughout its bus-sized body and to protect it from much larger carnivores



Hi hhakud,

Sorry for getting back to the thread so late.

Well, if you remove the comma before "to regulate", there will absolutely be no problem with the sentence at all.

But yes, there is a difference in the meaning of both the sentence.

Use of "comma + regulating and protecting" presents the HOW aspect of the preceding action. They provide additional information as to how the bony plates were necessary elements for survival.

Use of "to regulate and protect" presents the purpose or the reason why the bony plates were necessary for survival.

Now, if you get both the answer choices in the same question, then take a hint from the original sentence. If the original sentence uses comma + verb-ing then go by the choice with that modifier. If the original sentence has "to verb", then make the choice accordingly.

Original sentence presents ample of basis to understand the intended meaning of the sentence whether it wants to convey how the action is done or it wants to talk about the purpose.

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 16 May 2014, 13:46
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divineacclivity wrote:
egmat wrote:
Singular “that” cannot refer to plural “life-forms”.


Hi,

that in "E) Scientists have gathered evidence that suggests a much earlier emergence of complex life-forms than that" refers to "emergence of complex life-forms" & not just "life-forms" & that should be correct.
"emergence of complex life-forms" is a noun phrase, so, "that" can refer to it => Evidence suggests a much earlier emergence of life-forms than the emergence (of life-forms) they had previously thought.

No? Could you please explain why or why not? I'm not able to get my head around it. Please help.



Hi divineacclivity,

Sorry for replying late.

The reason "that" cannot just refer to "emergence of complex lifeforms" because this phrase is preceded by adjective "a much earlier emergence of complex lifeforms". This entire phrase is a noun phrase. We just cannot cut out he adjective before it to suit our preference per the sentence. This is the reason why use of "that" in Choice D and E leads to incorrect comparison.

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 16 May 2014, 13:59
Expert's post
sonalj17 wrote:
The level 1 for SC in egmat does states that verb-ed modifies the closest noun and there is no exception to it and all examples are given for nouns, however in explanation it states verb-ed modifies noun clause also , this creates confusion, this should be correct or should not be stated as rule with "nouns and without exception"



Hi Sonal,

I guess, we need a little correction here. There is nothing called "noun clause". Clauses are only of two types - Independent and dependent clauses. What you meant to say here is noun phrases.

When we say that verb-ed modifiers can modify preceding noun entity, that entity can be just a single noun word or it can be a noun phrase. In that case, the modifier modifies the head of the noun phrase. I know my eplanation would be sounding confusing to you right now. Read the following article, and you will know what I am talking about:

noun-modifiers-can-modify-slightly-far-away-noun-135868.html?hilit=Far%20away%20nouns

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 08 Jun 2014, 08:18
Thanks for your reply Shraddha.

that in option D refers to "a much earlier emergence of complex life-forms" rather than just "emergence of life forms" - that's what you mean right.
(D) scientists have gathered evidence that suggests a much earlier emergence of complex life-forms than that which was

egmat wrote:
divineacclivity wrote:
egmat wrote:
Singular “that” cannot refer to plural “life-forms”.


Hi,

that in "E) Scientists have gathered evidence that suggests a much earlier emergence of complex life-forms than that" refers to "emergence of complex life-forms" & not just "life-forms" & that should be correct.
"emergence of complex life-forms" is a noun phrase, so, "that" can refer to it => Evidence suggests a much earlier emergence of life-forms than the emergence (of life-forms) they had previously thought.

No? Could you please explain why or why not? I'm not able to get my head around it. Please help.



Hi divineacclivity,

Sorry for replying late.

The reason "that" cannot just refer to "emergence of complex lifeforms" because this phrase is preceded by adjective "a much earlier emergence of complex lifeforms". This entire phrase is a noun phrase. We just cannot cut out he adjective before it to suit our preference per the sentence. This is the reason why use of "that" in Choice D and E leads to incorrect comparison.

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 17 Apr 2015, 14:48
egmat wrote:
sonalj17 wrote:
The level 1 for SC in egmat does states that verb-ed modifies the closest noun and there is no exception to it and all examples are given for nouns, however in explanation it states verb-ed modifies noun clause also , this creates confusion, this should be correct or should not be stated as rule with "nouns and without exception"



Hi Sonal,

I guess, we need a little correction here. There is nothing called "noun clause". Clauses are only of two types - Independent and dependent clauses. What you meant to say here is noun phrases.

When we say that verb-ed modifiers can modify preceding noun entity, that entity can be just a single noun word or it can be a noun phrase. In that case, the modifier modifies the head of the noun phrase. I know my eplanation would be sounding confusing to you right now. Read the following article, and you will know what I am talking about:

noun-modifiers-can-modify-slightly-far-away-noun-135868.html?hilit=Far%20away%20nouns

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.

Hi E-Gmat,

what about the below mentioned OG13 question. "Connected" comes after 600 rooms each, and should modify the rooms in this case. I am aware that noun modifiers can modify sligthly far away nouns. "Of up to 600 rooms" modifies the structures, and conneccted is one more modifier for structures...?

The Anasazi settlements at Chaco Canyon were built on a spectacular scale with more than 75 carefully engineered structures, of up to 600 rooms each, were connected by a complex regional system of roads.
A. with more than 75 carefully engineered structures, of up to 600 rooms each, were
B. with more than 75 carefully engineered structures, of up to 600 rooms each,
C. of more than 75 carefully engineered structures of up to 600 rooms, each that had been
D. of more than 75 carefully engineered structures of up to 600 rooms and with each
E. of more than 75 carefully engineered structures of up to 600 rooms each had been

Below are the exeptions to the touch rule:

1. A “mission-critical” modifier falls between. This modifier is often an Of-phrase that defines the noun. The less important modifier refers to the noun plus the first modifier.

- He had a way OF DODGING OPPONENTS that impressed the scouts
dodging opponents defines the noun way; that impressed the scouts modifies the entire
noun phrase a way of dodging opponents

2. A very short predicate falls between, shifting a very long modifier back.
- Right: A new CEO has been hired who will transform the company bv decentralizing authority to various division heads while increasing their accountability through the use of public scorecards.

3. A short non-essential phrase intervenes and is set off by commas.
- Right: Our system of Presidential elections favors states, such as Delaware, that by population are over-represented in the Electoral College ( That modifies -> States)

4. The modifier is part of a series of parallel modifiers, one of which touches the noun

- In heraldry, the term "tincture" refers to a color emblazoned on a coat of arms and labeled with a special French word. (here, 2 Modifiers are placed fort he noun Color , it’s ok)

5. Normally a relative clause should touch the noun that it modifies, but we are generally allowed to place an appositive between a relative clause and the modified noun.

- Mary buys cookies made with SugarFree, an artificial sweetener, which tastes as sweet as the corn syrup that her brother loves but where there are fewer calories than in an equivalent amount of corn syrup.
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Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers [#permalink] New post 23 Apr 2015, 18:43
HI Shraddha... Could you please throw light on the question mentioned below :

Although William Pereira first gained national recognition for his movie set designs, including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generationsremember him as the architect of the Transamerica Tower, the Malibu campus of Pepperdine University, and the city of Irvine.
(A) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(B) like that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations will
(C) like those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
(D)including that for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will
(E) including those for the 1942 film "Reap the Wild Wind," future generations
will

Here the confusion is in reaching the conclusion that "including" is modifying recognition or set designs?
Your reply is highly solicited..
Thanks
Re: Verb-ed modifiers Vs. Verb-ing modifiers   [#permalink] 23 Apr 2015, 18:43

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