jb32 wrote:
trader1 wrote:
I mostly agree with you. But, you have to admit that the odds are already stacked against these kids. Possible, yes; probable, not so much.
Your perspective sounds awfully US-centric.
I know it does, it's called American Exceptionalism and its the difference between America and all of the other countries in the world. Americans (and this ties in well with JAllen) believe that they are a people who chose. When famine, oppression, warfare, religious persecution, tyranny, or stagnation threatened their former countries, unlike those who remained behind, Americans chose to not be the passive victims of history, they chose to get on a boat or a plane, they chose to seek a new life in a new land. Whether that is exceptional, in terms of difference, or exceptional, in other ways, is a matter for history and the reader to determine. However, it makes America different. America, unlike any other great empire in history, was created for the benefit of all people everywhere. The Roman, British, Nazi, Greek, and Persian Empires were all composed of one race or citizenship. America is different, it was formed as a melting pot of thousands of different cultures. America was built on the ideals of freedom and liberty regardless of culture, citizenship or ethnicity. No other country, before or since can claim they have done this and it does indeed make America different.
trader1 wrote:
I'm not sure what experiences you have had outside of the USA, but I have had quite a bit, and I've been living overseas now for over 5 years. As an American and former active duty service-member, I really can't stand it when Americans claim to be so much better than others and/or that the conditions for success are the best in America and worse elsewhere. In my opinion, this is such a closed-minded point of view to maintain.
While I wouldn't go up to the nearest German, French, or Indian citizen in their country and brag about the greatness of America, as far as I'm concerned America IS the greatest country in the world to live in. I've traveled all to Asia, Europe, and Africa and I would never trade places with someone in one of those countries. Call it arrogance, confidence, or whatever, but I think if you truly love your country then you love everything about it, flaws included, and you would defend it against anyone that says otherwise. If someone would like to argue that their country gives the average person more opportunities than America, I would be happy to listen.
trader1 wrote:
It may very well be true that America offers the best political and economic system than the rest of the world (although I think this is quite subjective), but I would be careful in communicating that point of view to your international colleagues at b-school and in the global workplace.
The fact he's sitting next to me in class makes my point for me. If the US wasn't the best place to go for Bschool, he certainly wouldn't be here.
Wow, that's a pretty hard-core point of view!
The American history is exceptional because of the points that you mention. Just a (small) comment though: the other empires you mention were by definition also composed by a melting-pot (a Gaul was pretty different from a Phoenician), but I think you want to say that these empires were built by the same race. However, I think you'll agree that the history is... the history, and we are here more interested in what the countries and continents have become and what their respective perspectives are.
I am convinced that there is a lot to learn from the American model. However, countries (I'm referring here to the so-called developed ones) have advantages and disadvantages; depending on what your life objectives are, some countries might suit you better than other ones. For example, how much do you value your free time? If you don't value it much, the the US is a great place for you. If you value it a lot, then France might be a great option. You want to work hard and make a lot of money? Go to the UK or the US. But then don't complain that you have to pay a fortune for healthcare (US) or wait 3 weeks before you can see a doctor (UK). Also, what does "opportunities" mean? This can mean very different things for people. There are numerous examples like that. Loving your country is great, but failing to recognise its disadvantages and the advantages of other places is short-sighted.
It is hard to be objective though when we talk about such sensitive issues as these, but I think you'll gain a lot by simply listening to the international students who will bring their perspective to the table (as long as they remain objective, which again is hard).
A couple of other things: first of all, traveling in a country (again, talking about the so-called developed countries) is different from living in a country; traveling does not allow you to say that that country is a great / terrible place to live in. We've all been tourists, and we all know that visiting a couple of monuments does not give you enough information to make a judgement on the quality of life in that place.
Also, I join trander1's point of view: people who think that their country is the best and everything is worse by definition and without any argumentation (this applies to anybody, not just the US citizens; some Frenchmen are also a great example of arrogant idiots) are a pain in the arse - the "we have the greatest democracy in the world" example comes to mind.