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According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of

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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 28 Feb 2014, 08:49
Help!

Are we 100% sure that the correct answer is

E: "as those charging"?

I selected E while taking GMATPrep3 from Exam Pack 1, and my software is saying that I was incorrect. It says that the correct answer is D, "as charge." Is this a glitch???

EDIT: OA is in fact D. I found this link helpful:

http://gmatclub.com/forum/according-to-a-1996-survey-by-the-national-association-of-69882.html
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 29 Mar 2014, 04:48
According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College an University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over $16,000.
A) than those that charge
B) than are charging
C) than to charge
D) as charge
E) as those charging

this is wrong question. pls, look at gmatprep question "women over age of 30..."

According to public health officials, in 1998 Massachusetts became the first state in which more babies were born to women over the age of thirty //than// under it.

1. than
2. than born
3. than they were
4. than they had been
5. than had been born


the rule of ellipsis is simple.
- the cut off part must be present somewhere
- the remaining part must be parallel to a phrase so that the meaning is clear or the remaining part is not parallel with some thing but the meaning is already clear. in case, both choice is clear in meaning, the choice which is parallel to some phrase is prefered and chosen.

I find out above rule.
appy the above rule. both D and E is wrong. (see the above gmatprep question )

there is no "charge over" so we can not use "charge under" or "charging under". so the remaining part is not parallel with any phrase and the remaining part itself is not clear in meaning. wong.

I am a student just willing to beat gmat. I wish experts, member comment on my above idea so that we can master ellipsis. this point is tough and need carefull consideration. pls, speak up. a student like me never want to say a question is wrong.

am I correct?
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 09 Apr 2014, 08:14
egmat wrote:
Vinay911, not sure if you are still looking for a response on this question. But here it is anyway (I am royally late in responding to this one :( )
As many posters have commented, we have to establish the correct equation here. Simplistically here is the equation we are looking for:

Since your doubt pertains to choices D and E, I will only focus on those. The difference between these two choices is in terms of what is there in the blank below. Choice D has nothing in this blank and choice E has "those that". Now you may question that choice E actually states "those charging". Remember that "those charging" is equivalent of "those that charge".

For example : cow that grazes all day long = cow grazing all day long

Ok now lets look at both constructions in terms of the equation:

Per choice D - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as ____ charge over $16000
Per choice E - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as those that charge over $16000

Now what are the entities being compared - colleges that charge < $8000 & colleges that charge > 16000
Choice E clearly states that comparison.

Whereas if you look choice D, it is missing the "COLLEGE" part of the comparison. It only states the "charge" part.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions regarding this.

Regards,
Payal

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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 05 Dec 2014, 18:54
I chose E as well, and was surprised to know that the correct answer is D :arh

Can some instructor please help with this one? Choice E completes the sentence logically, while the only thing going for Option D is that it maintains parallel structure gracefully!
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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A survey compares entities/actions within a specific time frame. Here, the intent is to compare how much certain institutions (currently) charge versus how much some other institutions (currently) charge. In other words, the survey is comparing two "dynamic" entities -- based on how much they charge today:
1. X institutions (currently) charge over $16K.
2. More than 3X institutions (currently) charge under $8K. (Set C of institutions)

Choice E converts St. 1 about institutions that currently charge over $16K (a dynamic set) into a statement about institutions that have charged over $16K over the course of history ("institutions charging over $16K"). These institutions (Set A) may or may not be charging over $16K today. Additionally, other institutions that traditionally did not charge over $16K (Set B) may have hiked their fees and could be charging over $16K today.

The survey compares Set C to "Set A + Set B" but the wording of Choice E makes it compare Set C (a dynamic set) to only Set A (a static set).

By including the verb, "charge" (versus the adjective, "charging"), Choice D makes it clear that the survey correctly compares institutions that currently charge under $8K to those that currently charge over $16K.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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A survey compares entities/actions within a specific time frame. Here, the intent is to compare how much certain institutions (currently) charge versus how much some other institutions (currently) charge. In other words, the survey is comparing two "dynamic" entities -- based on how much they charge today:
1. X institutions (currently) charge over $16K.
2. More than 3X institutions (currently) charge under $8K. (Set C of institutions)

Choice E converts St. 1 about institutions that currently charge over $16K (a dynamic set) into a statement about institutions that have charged over $16K over the course of history ("institutions charging over $16K"). These institutions (Set A) may or may not be charging over $16K today. Additionally, other institutions that traditionally did not charge over $16K (Set B) may have hiked their fees and could be charging over $16K today.

The survey compares Set C to "Set A + Set B" but the wording of Choice E makes it compare Set C (a dynamic set) to only Set A (a static set).

By including the verb, "charge" (versus the adjective, "charging"), Choice D makes it clear that the survey correctly compares institutions that currently charge under $8K to those that currently charge over $16K.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and [#permalink]

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New post 01 Aug 2015, 09:09
Here the institutions that charge under $8000 are in comparison with those institutions that charge over $1000. The phrase more than three times is a diversion from the core of the topic. The idiom should be ‘as much as’ .Let us dump A B and C, for missing the 'as much as' structure.
Between D and E: The elements that are being compared should be clearly stated rather than leaving to imagination. 'As charge' may be mistaken to modify the noun phrase 'tuition and fees of under $8000 a year'. In order to avoid these pit falls, the word 'those' should be necessarily mentioned to make it clear that it is these two types of institutions that are under comparison. That is the reason that D is a doubtful contender.

So E is better; here ‘charging’ is a present participle modifier that describes those institutions.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and [#permalink]

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New post 01 Aug 2015, 23:14
daagh wrote:
Here the institutions that charge under $8000 are in comparison with those institutions that charge over $1000. The phrase more than three times is a diversion from the core of the topic. The idiom should be ‘as much as’ .Let us dump A B and C, for missing the 'as much as' structure.
Between D and E: The elements that are being compared should be clearly stated rather than leaving to imagination. 'As charge' may be mistaken to modify the noun phrase 'tuition and fees of under $8000 a year'. In order to avoid these pit falls, the word 'those' should be necessarily mentioned to make it clear that it is these two types of institutions that are under comparison. That is the reason that D is a doubtful contender.

So E is better; here ‘charging’ is a present participle modifier that describes those institutions.


Even i chose E when i attempted this question and thats why i posted it here. My reasoning was same as yours.
But as the other person here said that "charging" is not parallel to "institutions charge" it may be correct but "as those that charge" should be the correct parallel form in D i think. Please correct me if im wrong.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and [#permalink]

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New post 06 Aug 2015, 09:31
Request explanation for the correct answer
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and [#permalink]

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New post 06 Aug 2015, 09:42
even i selected E as the correct answer but the official answer is D. I posted this question because i want a discussion on this question because i feel that instead of "as charge" in D it should "as those that charge".

Also now as i've read explanations of this question in different threads, i feel E is incorrect since it uses -ING modifier which is not parallel to "charge" in first clause.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 25 Aug 2015, 03:37
Experts,

Please help here!!

I also marked E as per standard logic but GMAT Prep Says its D.

Kindly provide the reason behind it.

Thanks!!
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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D has to be the right answer.

Simplest point to notice is parallelism. For brevity let's make it simpler, E says: 3X as many colleges charge under 8k as [colleges] charging 16k. - as many X as Y construction where X = Subject+Verb and Y = Noun+Noun Modifier. Certainly not parallel.

D says: 3X as many colleges charge under 8k as [colleges] charge 16k - correct, maintains ||ism properly.

The main confusion that prevails in many previous discussions is: whether number of colleges are compared or the way they charge? This is certainly a confusion in this lengthy sentence but think about a similarly constructed straightforward sentence:

Along the jogging track, 3 times as many people walk swiftly as walk slowly.

- makes perfect sense without any confusion, I guess. Note that the object of comparison is the way they walk and not the number of people.
In fact, look closely in the matter, relative number of people does not matter at all. How? remove the phrase 3 times and see: Along the jogging track, as many people walk swiftly as walk slowly - still makes perfect sense.
The way the original sentence is written, it is clear that the action of charging is compared and thus, D is the correct answer.

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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 14 Dec 2015, 16:50
I got this question on an official GMAT Prep Exam and chose E too.
The official answer is D though.

What about this comparable sentence:
On this port, more than three times as many boats are sailing boats as are motor yachts.

I think that last sentence is better than this one:
On this port, more that three times as many boats are sailing boats as those that are motor yachts.

Therefore the structure would be: More than X times as many [OBJECTS] are [CHARACTERISTIC] as are [OTHER CHARACTERISTIC]

Maybe this could calrify why D is a better option?
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 21 May 2016, 04:28
Nick90 wrote:
Divyadisha wrote:
skg wrote:
According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College an University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over $16,000.

A) than those that charge
B) than are charging
C) than to charge
D) as charge
E) as those charging


As X as Y is the correct idiom; hence, only D and E are left.

The comparison says more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition fee of under 8000 as institutions that charge 16000

In option E 'Charging' is not parallel to Charge , and hence is a wrong option.

D is the right answer


but as per egmat explanation "charging" meand "that charge" ...... so logically E is also correct .

please correct me , If i am wrong here .


I am copying the my own previous post here in case you missed it. If you are differ with this post, I would be happy to discuss further on arriving at a meaningful explanation.

"A simpler construction might help understand the complex question better:
Three times as many students like football as like basketball.

The correct comparison marker is as.... as. The combination as... than is wrong (than must go with a comparative adjective, not with as)

Therefore A,B and C can be eliminated.

The compared elements are:

3X institutions charge low fees (< $8000) and X institutions charge high fees (>$16,000). Two verbs charge and charge are being compared.

In option E,the parallelism is lost because charge and charging are compared.

Therefore D is correct."[/quote]

In option E, one element is a verb (charge) and other a participle (charging).
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2016, 22:43
rohitbansal1507 wrote:
I'm not convinced with your explanation. As I've studied in eGMAT we can definitely use "ing" form as a verb as well. In option "E" charging has been used as verb and not participle. This is the definition of participle:

a word formed from a verb (e.g. going, gone, being, been ) and used as an adjective (e.g. working woman, burnt toast ) or a noun (e.g. good breeding ). In English participles are also used to make compound verb forms (e.g. is going, has been )

"Charging" in E doesn't satisfy any of the two usages of participle. Its a verb and can be parallel to another verb.

Hi Rohit, as you have rightly mentioned, the -ing form of the verb can pretty much have only the following two usages:
i) As an adjective or
ii) As noun

Since these -ing forms can only be used as adjectives or nouns, how can they be parallel with verbs (for the simple reason that they are different parts of speech!).

Let alone -ing forms not being parallel to verbs; even within the -ing forms, the -ing forms used as adjectives are not parallel to -ing forms used as nouns. This is the reason, our book Sentence Correction Nirvana consistently uses different terminology (participles and gerunds) to refer to the adjective form and noun form of these -ing forms respectively.

Quote:
Also, how do you justify D as correct option? Doesn't it miss the "college" part

In English grammar, this is called ellipsis, wherein certain words are assumed. Just to draw an analogy, following would be correct:

By teenage, ten times as many children study as remain illiterate.

Again, children is implied in the second half.

By the way, in the sentence under consideration, I would go so much to the extent that even charge is not really required (though option D does use it from a clarity perspective). So, following would have been fine as well (though I admit that I have not given it too much thought; would like to invite comments):

....more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year as over $16,000
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2016, 23:07
EducationAisle wrote:
rohitbansal1507 wrote:
I'm not convinced with your explanation. As I've studied in eGMAT we can definitely use "ing" form as a verb as well. In option "E" charging has been used as verb and not participle. This is the definition of participle:

a word formed from a verb (e.g. going, gone, being, been ) and used as an adjective (e.g. working woman, burnt toast ) or a noun (e.g. good breeding ). In English participles are also used to make compound verb forms (e.g. is going, has been )

"Charging" in E doesn't satisfy any of the two usages of participle. Its a verb and can be parallel to another verb.

Hi Rohit, as you have rightly mentioned, the -ing form of the verb can pretty much have only the following two usages:
i) As an adjective or
ii) As noun

Since these -ing forms can only be used as adjectives or nouns, how can they be parallel with verbs (for the simple reason that they are different parts of speech!).

Let alone -ing forms not being parallel to verbs; even within the -ing forms, the -ing forms used as adjectives are not parallel to -ing forms used as nouns. This is the reason, our book Sentence Correction Nirvana consistently uses different terminology (participles and gerunds) to refer to the adjective form and noun form of these -ing forms respectively.

Quote:
Also, how do you justify D as correct option? Doesn't it miss the "college" part

In English grammar, this is called ellipsis, wherein certain words are assumed. Just to draw an analogy, following would be correct:

By teenage, ten times as many children study as remain illiterate.

Again, children is implied in the second half.

By the way, in the sentence under consideration, I would go so much to the extent that even charge is not really required (though option D does use it from a clarity perspective). So, following would have been fine as well (though I admit that I have not given it too much thought; would like to invite comments):

....more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year as over $16,000



Alright...I'm clear with the reasoning now..But there is a slight technicality that I wanted to clear.
You're misquoting me when you say "ing" form of verb can only have two usages. I wrote this for participle.
Anyways, this is my understanding: "Verb-ing words can function as 1) a noun that denotes an action, 2) an adjective
or 3) as a verb when preceded by a helping verb."

eg. I am studying too much of SC.
Here "am studying" is a verb with "am" as a helping verb.

In this case I considered "those charging" as a verb in option E and that was my mistake. I thought of "those" as a helping verb which it is not.

So the crux of the discussion is, whenever we see "-ing" form of verb, first check if its working as a noun or as an adjective or as a verb with a helping verb..Than check if it follows with the rest of sentence.

Any comments on my understanding?
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College [#permalink]

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Tobybun wrote:
mayankbhatnagar wrote:
OA is E....it uses idiom as X as Y

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk


Yes, I got the idiomatic bit of it. However, what about charge || charging? I think option e is breaking parallelism


It is acceptable to omit repeated parts of the second element of two elements in parallel. Before the omission the sentence (simplified for easy understanding) is as follows:

More than three times as many institutions charge low fees as institutions charge high fees.

The blue font and green font portions are parallel elements.


It is allowed to omit the repeated part (institutions) from the second element ( green font). After omission the sentence becomes:
More than three times as many institutions charge low fees as instituionscharge high fees.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College [#permalink]

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Tobybun wrote:
According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University
Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher
education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over
$16,000

A. than those that charge
B. than are charging
C. than to charge
D. as charge
E. as those charging


This sentence has a LOT of fluff that gets in the way of locating the correct answer.

GIVEN: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over $16,000

IGNORE THE FLUFF: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University Business Officers, more than three times as many THINGS DO one thing ______________something else

For parallelism, the blank needs something like "as DO"

We get: Three times as many THINGS DO one thing as DO something else

Answer:
[Reveal] Spoiler:
D


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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 20 Aug 2016, 11:20
manhasnoname wrote:
sayantanc2k wrote:

A simpler construction might help understand the complex question better:
Three times as many students like football as like basketball.

The correct comparison marker is as.... as. The combination as... than is wrong (than must go with a comparative adjective, not with as)

Therefore A,B and C can be eliminated.

The compared elements are:

3X institutions charge low fees (< $8000) and X institutions charge high fees (>$16,000). Two verbs charge and charge are being compared.

In option E,the parallelism is lost because charge and charging are compared.

Therefore D is correct.


Sure, verb parallelism is achieved in (E). But, isn't it comparing institutions with charge as opposed to institutions with institutions?


I am not clear about your query. How verb parallelism is achieved in E? In E, a present participle modifier is made parallel to a verb. Could you clarify your query?

If you meant "D" rather "E" then my post above could help explain, why the parallelism is correct in D. Please note that the repeated "institutions" has been omitted from the second element of parallel structure.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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New post 01 Oct 2016, 01:18
1. First of all – we have 2 comparison markers, and should make sure they are both present fully:

[*] “More” (“More…+than”):
-- Should be accompanied by “than” – We have them both.
-- Notice that “More…than…” is used to show dissimilarity

[*] As X as Y
-- We need to make sure we have the 2nd “As” – that leaves us with choices D & E
-- Notice that this idiom is used to show similarity

So we have 2 comparisons used here – and this is a key to solving this question.

2. Now try to analyze:

[*] Case 1: the number of the companies is different + their action is the same
-- This makes sense since all companies at hand do the action of charging (they might charge a different sum, but do the same action).

[*]Case 2: the number of the companies is the same + their action is different.
--This does not makes sense. The companies do the same action, and the intended meaning is that you have different number of companies.

Comment: Notice no other case is possible.

Hence option D is the correct 1, since it focuses on comparing (with equality) of the action.
Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of   [#permalink] 01 Oct 2016, 01:18

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