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According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of

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According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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06 Sep 2008, 15:47
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According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over$16,000.

A) than those that charge
B) than are charging
C) than to charge
D) as charge
E) as those charging
[Reveal] Spoiler: OA

Last edited by arorag on 06 Sep 2008, 17:32, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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22 Sep 2013, 00:59
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arorag wrote:
According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under $8,000 a year than those that charge over$16,000.

A) than those that charge
B) than are charging
C) than to charge
D) as charge
E) as those charging

gmatter0913 wrote:
I got this question in the GMAT Exam Pack 1. The OA is D. I chose E for obvious reasons. Explanations please?
They are using wordiness to make this tricky. Let's simplify this sentence as much as we can:

Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year than those that charge over$16,000.

Let's plug in our answer options:

(A) Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year than those that charge over$16,000.
Nope. If we use "than", we need to have another noun
(B) Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year than are charging over$16,000.
Ditto
(C) Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year than to charge over$16,000.
Ditto
(D) Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year as charge over$16,000.
(E) Three times as many institutions charge under $8,000 a year as those charging over$16,000.

The sentence pattern is:
<quantity> as many <subject> <verb phrase> as <verb phrase>.
As many voters voted for Bush as voted for Gore.
This is clearly better than the sentence:
As many voters voted for Bush as those voting for Gore.

This one is tricky because the "three times" at the start is somehow inherently confusing. Let's use a different word w/a similar meaning:
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Last edited by lukep on 27 Sep 2013, 23:00, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink]

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24 Sep 2012, 18:44
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Vinay911, not sure if you are still looking for a response on this question. But here it is anyway (I am royally late in responding to this one )
As many posters have commented, we have to establish the correct equation here. Simplistically here is the equation we are looking for:

Since your doubt pertains to choices D and E, I will only focus on those. The difference between these two choices is in terms of what is there in the blank below. Choice D has nothing in this blank and choice E has "those that". Now you may question that choice E actually states "those charging". Remember that "those charging" is equivalent of "those that charge".

For example : cow that grazes all day long = cow grazing all day long

Ok now lets look at both constructions in terms of the equation:

Per choice D - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as ____ charge over $16000 Per choice E - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as those that charge over$16000

Now what are the entities being compared - colleges that charge < $8000 & colleges that charge > 16000 Choice E clearly states that comparison. Whereas if you look choice D, it is missing the "COLLEGE" part of the comparison. It only states the "charge" part. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions regarding this. Regards, Payal _________________ | '4 out of Top 5' Instructors on gmatclub | 70 point improvement guarantee | www.e-gmat.com Verbal Forum Moderator Joined: 16 Jun 2012 Posts: 1132 Location: United States Followers: 278 Kudos [?]: 3105 [10] , given: 123 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 22 Sep 2013, 11:06 10 This post received KUDOS 8 This post was BOOKMARKED Basically, we have two different comparison structures here. (1) Twice as X as Y ==> X and Y must be parallel (2) X as [....] as Y ==> X and Y must be parallel. Let see your examples: Twice as many Americans buy pizza as Indians who buy salad. <-- is this correct? Correct. We're comparing the number of Americans vs. that of Indians. It doesn't matter what they do, we just compare the number of people. Twice as many Americans buy chocolate as those who buy pizza. <--- is this correct? Correct. "those" refers to a "new copy" of Americans. Thus, the sentence compares the number of American to by chocolate with that of Americans who buy pizza. Twice as many Americans buy chocolate as those that buy pizza <--- is this correct? Wrong. Absolutely wrong at first sight. "that" never modifies people ==> only "who" can do. Americans are twice as likely to buy pizza as Indians. (or) (Here "do" is in ellipsis) <--- is this correct? Correct. The structure is: Americans ...as [........] as Indians... ==> The parallel structure is maintained. Americans are twice as likely to buy chocolate as pizza. <--- is this correct? Wrong. The structure is: Americans..as [...] as pizza. The correct structure is: Americans are twice as likely to do buy chocolate as (Americans who are likely) to buy pizza Hope it helps. _________________ Please +1 KUDO if my post helps. Thank you. "Designing cars consumes you; it has a hold on your spirit which is incredibly powerful. It's not something you can do part time, you have do it with all your heart and soul or you're going to get it wrong." Chris Bangle - Former BMW Chief of Design. Senior Manager Joined: 07 Sep 2010 Posts: 329 Followers: 9 Kudos [?]: 767 [5] , given: 136 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 02 Oct 2013, 00:20 5 This post received KUDOS gmatter0913 wrote: I got this question in the GMAT Exam Pack 1. The OA is D. I chose E for obvious reasons. Explanations please? There is no such obvious reasons for picking E, though I also picked choice E. But on reviewing, I found that I had made a blunder. Quote: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of College and University Business Officers, more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under$8,000 a year than those that charge over $16,000. A) than those that charge B) than are charging C) than to charge D) as charge E) as those charging E ) just made us fool, by making us think that subjects are being compared appropriately. However, it is not. As, charging is participle.. , and you can safely ignore the modifier and see if it makes sense. It doesn't D) on the other hand, D is classic answer, here subject is in ellipsis more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under$8,000 a year as(independent institutions of higher education) charge over $16,000. The sentence trying to compare the Number of education institutes with certain characteristic Here, is the example that may help you- In Indian Marriages, More people drink than (people) eat. Here, we are comparing that number of people who drink is more than the number of people who eat. -> this is the structure of the correct answer choice. Here is the incorrect one In Indian marriages, as many people drink beer as people drinking wine. -> Replace drink with charge - Here the sentence can be written as - In Indian marriages, as many people drink beer as people drinking wine. - this is non sensical. Makes sense..? let me know if you have any doubt. In summary, E is wrong for the simple reason that Verb is not present. Regards Himanshu _________________ +1 Kudos me, Help me unlocking GMAT Club Tests e-GMAT Representative Joined: 02 Nov 2011 Posts: 2022 Followers: 2211 Kudos [?]: 7738 [4] , given: 291 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 01 Oct 2012, 08:52 4 This post received KUDOS Expert's post 2 This post was BOOKMARKED imhimanshu wrote: Hi Payal, Isnt the option D a classic case of ellipsis. i.e Colleges is understood by default. Please share your reasoning Thanks Himanshu egmat wrote: Per choice D - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as ____ charge over$16000
Per choice E - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as those that charge over $16000 Now what are the entities being compared - colleges that charge <$8000 & colleges that charge > 16000

Regards,
Payal

Himanshu and IndianExpress,

Let's assume that Choice D is fine with college actually omitted through ellipsis. Now let us bring back this word "college" and read the sentence:
More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as colleges charge over $16000. Now let us do sentence structure analysis here: 1: More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as 2: colleges charge over$16000.

Now given this sentence, what is the comparison. IMO, the comparison is no longer clear. Are we comparing the number of colleges or are we comparing the action of charging the fees. Per the intended comparison, we need to compare the colleges, more specifically the number of colleges. One side of comparison is the number of colleges with certain characteristic. The other side of comparison is the number of colleges with certain other characteristic. Now to make the above sentence correct we need to add "that" between colleges and charge as follows:

2. More than 3X institutions (currently) charge under $8K. (Set C of institutions) Choice E converts St. 1 about institutions that currently charge over$16K (a dynamic set) into a statement about institutions that have charged over $16K over the course of history ("institutions charging over$16K"). These institutions (Set A) may or may not be charging over $16K today. Additionally, other institutions that traditionally did not charge over$16K (Set B) may have hiked their fees and could be charging over $16K today. The survey compares Set C to "Set A + Set B" but the wording of Choice E makes it compare Set C (a dynamic set) to only Set A (a static set). By including the verb, "charge" (versus the adjective, "charging"), Choice D makes it clear that the survey correctly compares institutions that currently charge under$8K to those that currently charge over $16K. _________________ --Prasad EnterMBA GMAT Club Verbal Expert Status: GMAT and GRE tutor Joined: 13 Aug 2009 Posts: 464 Location: United States GMAT 1: 780 Q51 V46 GMAT 2: 800 Q51 V51 GRE 1: 340 Q170 V170 Followers: 137 Kudos [?]: 328 [1] , given: 181 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 18 Apr 2017, 12:15 1 This post received KUDOS Expert's post Top Contributor 1 This post was BOOKMARKED The answer is definitely (D) here. The biggest issue in this question is the (very cleverly disguised) idiom "as many... as". We use the phrase "as many... as" pretty frequently in normal language: • Chuck eats three times as many burritos as Mike. --> no problem, right? • Chuck eats more than three times as many burritos as Mike. --> still no problem, right? Both of these are acceptable, it's just that they're saying slightly different things. But you wouldn't say either of these: • Chuck eats three times as many burritos than Mike. • Chuck eats more than three times as many burritos than Mike. You could say "as many... as" or "more than" -- but "as many... than" is simply wrong. The error in (A), (B), and (C) is exactly the same as in these last two examples. It's just that the construction is more complicated, so it's harder to spot the error. For example, here's answer choice (C): Quote: more than three times as many independent institutions of higher education charge tuition and fees of under$8,000 a year than charge over $16,000 There are a ton of words separating "as many" from "than" -- and that makes it really, really hard to see the mistake. And yes, this is a nasty little trick that you're likely to see in other GMAT SC questions. Anyway, that leaves us with (D) and (E). As several people have mentioned, there's a parallelism issue in (E), but to be fair, it's really subtle. Here are (D) and (E) again, with a few words stripped out to make it easier to see what's happening: (D) "... three times as many institutions charge tuition and fees of under$8,000 a year as charge over $16,000." (E) "... three times as many institutions charge tuition and fees of under$8,000 a year as those charging over $16,000." The parallelism is much, much clearer in (D): "three times as many institutions do X as do Y." In (E), we're basically saying "three times as many institutions do X as institutions doing Y." But to be fair: man, this question is tough, and I can introduce you to a whole bunch of people who missed this on their practice tests... and still scored in the mid-700s on the real thing just a few weeks later. _________________ www.gmatninja.com + blog Join us for the verbal experts' live chat every Wednesday, 8 am PST/8:30 pm IST! Details available here. Need an expert reply? Hit the request verbal experts' reply button -- and then please be specific about your question for us. Feel free to mention GMATNinja and GMATNinjaTwo in your post. Rules for posting in verbal forum | How to use search function (before posting questions!) GMAT Club's ultimate verbal study plan, 2017 edition Manager Status: SLOGGING : My son says,This time Papa u will have to make it : Innocence is BLISS Joined: 16 Jan 2012 Posts: 208 Location: India WE: Sales (Energy and Utilities) Followers: 4 Kudos [?]: 57 [0], given: 30 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 26 Aug 2012, 22:52 mohan514 wrote: is those here referring to independent institutions ... please explain.. i selected d as i overlooked those in the option Hi, Do we have any other Referrent of THOSE other than INSTITUTIONS = what can THOSE refer back to other than institutions = Guess That's the onliest logical antecedent of THOSE in the stimulus. Lets substitute THOSE = INSTITUTIONS in our equation and see if it still holds : More than three time AS many INSTITUTIONS charge 8000$...................... AS INSTITUTIONS charging 16000$( Seems Logical, Equation still holds ) ie institutions charging 16000 = x , institutions charging 8000 = 3x Manager Joined: 10 Jul 2011 Posts: 113 GMAT 1: 700 Q50 V34 GMAT 2: 710 Q50 V35 Followers: 3 Kudos [?]: 21 [0], given: 10 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 01 Oct 2012, 10:47 Thanks for the amazing explanation Payal. Your explanations are always superb. I think I am pretty clear on both the concepts now. Just to re-iterate, ellepsis can only be used if there is absolutely no ambiguity regarding the meaning. I think this is the only rule around ellepsis. Let me know if I am not understanding this correctly. In the sentence in question, choice D actually makes the sentence a little confusing, hence ellepsis cannot be used. Regarding the verb-ing modifiers, I am actually familiar with the concept that they take the verb tense of the main clause. In fact, verb-ing modifiers are pretty common and I myself might have used them multiple times in the past. I was somehow not able to apply the concept at the right place, probably need to practice a little more. In both the sentences that you have mentioned in your post, the verb-ing modifier (shining) does actually take the respective verb tense (looked and looks respectively). Thanks again!!!! IndianExpress Director Status: Gonna rock this time!!! Joined: 22 Jul 2012 Posts: 533 Location: India GMAT 1: 640 Q43 V34 GMAT 2: 630 Q47 V29 WE: Information Technology (Computer Software) Followers: 3 Kudos [?]: 66 [0], given: 562 Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of [#permalink] Show Tags 19 Jan 2013, 20:55 egmat wrote: Vinay911, not sure if you are still looking for a response on this question. But here it is anyway (I am royally late in responding to this one ) As many posters have commented, we have to establish the correct equation here. Simplistically here is the equation we are looking for: Since your doubt pertains to choices D and E, I will only focus on those. The difference between these two choices is in terms of what is there in the blank below. Choice D has nothing in this blank and choice E has "those that". Now you may question that choice E actually states "those charging". Remember that "those charging" is equivalent of "those that charge". For example : cow that grazes all day long = cow grazing all day long Ok now lets look at both constructions in terms of the equation: Per choice D - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as ____ charge over$16000
Per choice E - More than 3x as many colleges charge certain fees as those that charge over $16000 Now what are the entities being compared - colleges that charge <$8000 & colleges that charge > 16000
Choice E clearly states that comparison.

Whereas if you look choice D, it is missing the "COLLEGE" part of the comparison. It only states the "charge" part.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions regarding this.

Regards,
Payal

Hi Payal,
Amazing explanation.. I, however, have a doubt here.

Had we had 'as those that charge' as another option, would this have been a better choice?
Its true that we are supposed to choose the best of the 5 answer choices. I am just trying to understand whether parallelism is absolutely needed as in this case, the parallelism is not with respect to structure but with respect to the meaning..

Please let us know which one would be preferred: parallelism with structure or parallelism with meaning.
Regards,
Sach
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Re: According to a 1996 survey by the National Association of   [#permalink] 19 Jan 2013, 20:55

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