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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
Hi, GMATNinja!

I agree with all the other options being incorrect and E being the best of them.

However, in E, there are few services and little available water,

Isn't using there are and available water redundant?

You mentioned in one of your explanations that there indicates that something exists. So wouldn't that make using available a redundancy error?

Please clarify this logic. Thanks in advance!
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
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dingodudesir wrote:
Hi, GMATNinja!

I agree with all the other options being incorrect and E being the best of them.

However, in E, there are few services and little available water,

Isn't using there are and available water redundant?

You mentioned in one of your explanations that there indicates that something exists. So wouldn't that make using available a redundancy error?

Please clarify this logic. Thanks in advance!

"Redundancy" can be a bit squishy and subjective, so you really want to focus on other factors (grammar errors and major meaning issues) first. Because all of the other choices have these higher value problems, you don't need to worry about redundancy in (E) -- even if it was slightly redundant, we would let it slide.

However, I'm not convinced that (E) is redundant in the first place. The word "available" adds some information: in these areas, there is little water that can actually be accessed/used. Maybe there is more water deep under the surface, or maybe there is a bunch of water trapped within the plants in the region. The author of the sentence doesn't care about this unavailable water, so it's reasonable to specify that he/she is talking about available water.

I hope that helps!
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
GMATNinja

You write that it "seems" like 'little' is referring to both water and services. So does that mean that when there is a 'or' and the noun preceding the 'or' is modified by say 'little', then the noun following the 'or' may or may not be modified by 'little'? If that is the case then how can we judge whether 'little' is referring to both or not?

Thank you.
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
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Jue wrote:
GMATNinja

You write that it "seems" like 'little' is referring to both water and services. So does that mean that when there is a 'or' and the noun preceding the 'or' is modified by say 'little', then the noun following the 'or' may or may not be modified by 'little'? If that is the case then how can we judge whether 'little' is referring to both or not?

Thank you.

We used the word "seems" simply because placing the modifier ("little") before BOTH nouns causes the reader to think that the modifier should be applied to both.

For example:

    "Tim does not have the skills needed to survive in areas with little food or water."

Because the modifier ("little") comes before both nouns and, given the context, logically modifies each one, the reader naturally thinks to apply the modifier to each one. Is it possible that the author only wanted to modify food and not water? Maybe. But that would be very unclear writing, since the modifier seems to go with both nouns.

Are there cases in which the context suggests that the modifier should only go with the first noun? Sure. For example:

    "Would you rather be pelted with tiny grains of salt or bowling balls?"

Here it's pretty obvious that the modifier ("tiny") should only be applied to the grains of salt, not to the bowling balls. If the author truly wanted to give you a choice between tiny grains of salt and tiny bowling balls, it would have been better to repeat the modifier: "...tiny grains of salt or tiny bowling balls." Repeating the word "tiny" tells the reader to apply the modifier to both nouns, even though bowling balls are usually not in fact tiny when compared to grains of salt.

Of course, we can avoid this mess altogether by simply writing the modifier AFTER the "or." For example:

    "Would you rather be pelted with bowling balls or tiny grains of salt?"

In this case, there is no question that the modifier ("tiny") does not apply to "bowling balls".

And of course there are no black and white grammar rules to fall back on here. Would the following be okay on the GMAT?

    "Once Tim graduates from medical school, he hopes to work with little babies or teenagers."

From the context, it seems pretty obvious that the modifier ("little") only goes with babies and not with teenagers. But a reader still might instinctively apply the modifier to both nouns, at least at first glance. Does that make this one wrong? Probably not. But it's definitely clearer to instead write "... work with teenagers or little babies."

So again, when we see something like "little [noun 1] or [noun 2]," the tendency is to apply "little" to both nouns -- and that's all we meant when we wrote that "little" seems to modify both water and services.

I hope that clears things up!
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Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
GMATNinja

Thank you for these explanations,

May I know, below versions would have been correct?

1. where there is little water or few services available
Here "is" refers to nearest subject "little water"

2. where there are little available water and few services
Here even "are" is used because there are two subjects "little available water" and "few services"
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
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Venkat999 wrote:
GMATNinja

Thank you for these explanations,

May I know, below versions would have been correct?

1. where there is little water or few services available
Here "is" refers to nearest subject "little water"

2. where there are little available water and few services
Here even "are" is used because there are two subjects "little available water" and "few services"

I think you can make an argument that neither one is technically wrong. When we use "or" it's the noun closest to the verb that determines whether the verb is singular or plural; when we use "and" to connect two elements in a compound subject, the verb is typically plural. In that sense, the examples don't violate a rule.

That said, both sentences seem a little fishy to me, because they're confusing. In the first sentence, is the writer conveying that there might be a lack of water or there might be few services, but not both? Or is she saying that both are problems?

In the second sentence, it just seems awfully strange to put "little available water" first. When I see, "there are few services and little available water," I understand right away that the writer is expressing the idea that two things are lacking. But when I see, "there are little available water and few services," my brain short-circuits when I see the part in red, because it feels like a subject-verb disagreement.

That doesn't make it wrong, necessarily. I can reread it and figure out what's going on. It's still technically a compound subject requiring a plural verb. But it certainly seems as though there's a better way to express the idea.

So if I saw either of the above constructions, I might not eliminate them right away, but I'd certainly note how confusing they were.

I hope that helps a bit!
Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
GMATNinja wrote:
Two things jump out at me right away, as we discussed in this YouTube video on sentence correction priorities. First, there seems to be a subject-verb agreement thing going on: we have “exists” and “exist”, and then “there is” and “there are.” Looks like we’ll get some cheap eliminations from this stuff.

And then there’s the modifier “little.” It’s a funny one. If it’s used to modify a countable noun (“dogs” or “doughnuts”, for example), it refers to size: “little dogs” or “little doughnuts” are both small things. But if “little” modifies a non-countable noun (“wine” or “homework”), then it refers to quantity: so if you “drink very little wine” or “do very little homework”, we’re clearly talking about the amount of those things.

So with all of that in mind…

Quote:
(D) there is little water or services available

(D) has the same problem as (A): “little” seems to modify both “water” and “services”, and that causes a problem, because “little services” doesn’t make logical sense. See the explanation for (A) for more on this issue.

In case anybody is wondering: I think the subject-verb agreement is OK here. When the subject of a clause contains the word “or”, then the verb generally is conjugated using the nearest noun: so “services or water IS” would be correct, for example. And in this case, “there is little water…” seems fine.

But that modifier problem is a pretty big deal. (D) is out.

Well poop, I hope we like (E), since we’ve eliminated everything else.

Quote:
(E) there are few services and little available water

I know what some of you are thinking: (E) arguably sounds wordy and awkward, and it seems like the phrase “there are” is a waste of words. I agree with all of that. I feel like there HAS to be a better way to write this sentence.

But writing the BEST possible version of the sentence isn’t our job. Our job on SC is to find the four answer choices that contain grammar or meaning errors. All of the first four answer choices have definite errors with either subject-verb agreement or modifiers. (E) has none of those mistakes: “few services” and “little available water” both are modified correctly, and “services and water” is correctly preceded by a plural verb phrase, “there are.”

So we’re stuck with (E), whether we like it or not.

GMATNinja
Hello sir,
I can't figure out the difference between little water available and little available water.Can you explain for a bit, please?
Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
GMATNinja
Sir, can I have your attention, please?
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
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TheUltimateWinner wrote:
GMATNinja
Hello sir,
I can't figure out the difference between little water available and little available water.Can you explain for a bit, please?

That difference doesn't really matter here. The problem shared by (A), (B), and (D) is that "little" seems to modify "services" (as discussed in our original explanation).

You could probably argue that the word order in (E) makes the parallelism a bit more clear: "there are few [X] and little [Y]," where "Y" is "available water" -- as opposed to water in general, whether it's "available" or not.

Maybe putting "water" first would make the reader think we are talking about the size of the water (little water vs. big water)? Luckily, we have better reasons to eliminate (A) through (D), so clearly the GMAT doesn't want us worrying about that subtle difference.

TheUltimateWinner wrote:
GMATNinja
Sir, can I have your attention, please?

Just a friendly reminder: https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-it-cos ... l#p2732370. ;)
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Re: Downzoning, zoning that typically results in the reduction of housing [#permalink]
GMATNinja wrote:
Two things jump out at me right away, as we discussed in this YouTube video on sentence correction priorities. First, there seems to be a subject-verb agreement thing going on: we have “exists” and “exist”, and then “there is” and “there are.” Looks like we’ll get some cheap eliminations from this stuff.

And then there’s the modifier “little.” It’s a funny one. If it’s used to modify a countable noun (“dogs” or “doughnuts”, for example), it refers to size: “little dogs” or “little doughnuts” are both small things. But if “little” modifies a non-countable noun (“wine” or “homework”), then it refers to quantity: so if you “drink very little wine” or “do very little homework”, we’re clearly talking about the amount of those things.

So with all of that in mind…

Quote:
(A) little water or services exist

This sounds pretty good! But it’s wrong, anyway.

The subject-verb is OK. Since this is an expression with “or” in it, only the final noun is used to conjugate the verb, so “…services exist” is fine.

But the word “little” is a problem. “Little water” makes sense: since “water” is non-countable, the phrase is saying that there’s a small quantity of water. Trouble is, the adjective “little” seems to also modify “services,” and that doesn’t make sense: since “services” is countable, the phrase “little services” would suggest that we’re talking about size (i.e., physically very small services). And that doesn’t make sense: we’re trying to discuss the quantity of services, not the size of them.

So we can eliminate (A).

Quote:
(B) little water or services exists

Once again, “little” seems to modify both “water” and “services”, and that doesn’t make sense, since “services” is countable. See the explanation for (A) for more on that issue.

Plus, the subject-verb is wrong now: “services” is plural, but “exists” is the singular form of the verb. (If it helps, replace “services” with “they” to make it easier to hear the error: “they exists.”)

(B) is out.

Quote:
(C) few services and little water exists

Hm... "little water exists" sound pretty good to me! But it's wrong.

In (C), the “or” has been replaced with an “and”, so the subject (“services and water”) is plural. But the verb “exists” is singular, so it's incorrect. (If you’re not convinced: replace “services and water” with “they”. “They exists” is clearly wrong.)

But at least the modifiers are correct now: “few” is countable, and correctly modifies the countable noun “services”, while “little” modifies the non-countable noun “water”, so it indicates a small quantity of water.

But still: that subject-verb thing is a pretty big deal, so we can eliminate (C).

Quote:
(D) there is little water or services available

(D) has the same problem as (A): “little” seems to modify both “water” and “services”, and that causes a problem, because “little services” doesn’t make logical sense. See the explanation for (A) for more on this issue.

In case anybody is wondering: I think the subject-verb agreement is OK here. When the subject of a clause contains the word “or”, then the verb generally is conjugated using the nearest noun: so “services or water IS” would be correct, for example. And in this case, “there is little water…” seems fine.

But that modifier problem is a pretty big deal. (D) is out.

Well poop, I hope we like (E), since we’ve eliminated everything else.

Quote:
(E) there are few services and little available water

I know what some of you are thinking: (E) arguably sounds wordy and awkward, and it seems like the phrase “there are” is a waste of words. I agree with all of that. I feel like there HAS to be a better way to write this sentence.

But writing the BEST possible version of the sentence isn’t our job. Our job on SC is to find the four answer choices that contain grammar or meaning errors. All of the first four answer choices have definite errors with either subject-verb agreement or modifiers. (E) has none of those mistakes: “few services” and “little available water” both are modified correctly, and “services and water” is correctly preceded by a plural verb phrase, “there are.”

So we’re stuck with (E), whether we like it or not.



Hi GMATNinja

How "services and water" is a plural phrase. Water is singular noun. For this very reason daagh eliminated option A in his explaination. Please elaborate.

Thanks.
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Jaisiyaram wrote:
Hi GMATNinja

How "services and water" is a plural phrase. Water is singular noun. For this very reason daagh eliminated option A in his explaination. Please elaborate.

Thanks.

Yes, "water" is indeed singular, but it is joined to "services" by the conjunction ("and"). Here, have some examples:

    "Tim likes to drink fermented mare's milk." - singular

    "Tim's wife likes to drink fermented mare's milk." - also singular

    "Tim and his wife like to drink fermented mare's milk." - the "and" connects the two singular subjects to create a new plural subject.

(E) is similar to the third example above, only it's a plural subject plus a singular subject to make a new plural subject. In this case, it's not just the water that "is" -- instead, we're saying that both the water AND the services are.

I hope that helps!
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