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# Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty

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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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03 Sep 2010, 08:20
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I said (C). I don't understand how it can be (E) - you don't really have the information to determine how many non-subscribers placed orders, which is what (E) is talking about. For example, what if 100 subscribers placed orders, and 30 of them were under age 35, while only 5 non-subscribers placed orders, and 4 of them were under age 35? Then both findings are still correct, but (E) is false (unless we're going on some very arbitrary definition of "many").

(C) fits both findings the best. 70% of subscribers who placed orders were age 35 or over, a big majority. The only way to make (C) not true is if the number of non-subscribers who placed orders is larger than the number of subscribers who placed orders - and even then, you can't really determine whether or not the 30% of subscribers under 35 + the "most" of non-subscribers under 35 outnumber the 70% of subscribers + the remaining non-subscribers.

Really it seems like the question doesn't give you enough info to properly answer it, but I think (C) is a better answer than (E), given the assumptions you have to make to choose either one.

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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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03 Sep 2010, 10:11
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TehJay wrote:
I said (C). I don't understand how it can be (E) - you don't really have the information to determine how many non-subscribers placed orders, which is what (E) is talking about. For example, what if 100 subscribers placed orders, and 30 of them were under age 35, while only 5 non-subscribers placed orders, and 4 of them were under age 35? Then both findings are still correct, but (E) is false (unless we're going on some very arbitrary definition of "many").

No, you may have misinterpreted one of the two findings. The second finding says that most orders were placed by people under 35; that includes orders from both subscribers and non-subscribers. I think you are interpreting that finding to be about orders from non-subscribers only, but it's not. So in your hypothetical example, you have 105 orders in total, but still, only 34 orders come from people under the age of thirty-five. That isn't consistent with the second finding in the stem which tells us that most orders come from under-thirty-fives, so is not a possible scenario.

TehJay wrote:
(C) fits both findings the best. 70% of subscribers who placed orders were age 35 or over, a big majority. The only way to make (C) not true is if the number of non-subscribers who placed orders is larger than the number of subscribers who placed orders - and even then, you can't really determine whether or not the 30% of subscribers under 35 + the "most" of non-subscribers under 35 outnumber the 70% of subscribers + the remaining non-subscribers.

It's actually mathematically impossible for C to be true. Say you have S subscribers and N non-subscribers who placed orders. We know that 0.7S orders came from subscribers over thirty-five. Say you have X orders in total from non-subscribers over 35. We know from the second finding that less than half of all orders come from people over thirty-five, so:

(0.7S + X)/(N+S) < 1/2

But the proportion of all orders coming from subscribers over thirty-five is 0.7S/(N+S), and this is clearly less than the left side of the inequality above, so must be less than one half. So it's impossible for 'most' orders to have come from subscribers over thirty-five, and C cannot be true.
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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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04 Sep 2010, 08:41
good question. agree with E.

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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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04 Sep 2010, 11:28
Seeing it first time....these type of questions...Good one

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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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04 Sep 2010, 11:42
Findings of magazine: 30% of the orders placed by subscribers in response to advertisements were placed by subscribers under the age 35.

Findings of the advertiser: most of the orders placed in response to advertisements were placed by people under the age 35.

As already illustrated by nusmavrik the argument subtly shifts from subscribers to general population.

Most in advertiser's finding means >50%.

Let us assume total 100 orders were placed in response to advertisement in the magazine.
Therefore at least 50 people who ordered were under the age of 35 as per advertiser's finding.

In case all the above 100 people were subscribers of the magazine.
Which means only 30 people under the age of 35 placed the order.

It follows from above that orders placed by subcribers = total orders placed cannot be true, since advertiser's survey finding states that 50 people were under 35.
Moreover number of orders placed by subscribers cannot be more than total orders placed.

Therefore the orders placed by subscribers has to be less than the total number of orders,
==>ie. part of the orders were placed by non subscribers of the magazine.
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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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06 Sep 2010, 11:20
Nice!!
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Re: gmatprep CR - tricky one! [#permalink]

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01 Jan 2011, 03:01
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i think E correct because E can be translated to the assumption that many people under the age of 35 who read the advertisement on the magazine decided to order merchandise but many of them did not buy magazine. They could read by chance.
C is counter fact.
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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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29 May 2011, 09:51
E because of above reasons

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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30 May 2011, 05:47
E, but took me two minutes!

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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30 May 2011, 07:33
E. It's the only option that reconciles the two different surveys.
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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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30 May 2011, 15:47
+1 E

Easy, but its lenght makes it difficult.
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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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31 May 2011, 05:04
E but took 2+ minute to complete.
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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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31 Jul 2011, 06:00
E....
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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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26 Oct 2011, 15:55
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Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty percent of all merchandise orders placed by subscribers in response to advertisements in the magazine last year were placed by subscribers under age thirty-five.

Finding of a survey of advertisers in Systems magazine: Most of the merchandise orders placed in response to advertisements in Systems last year were placed by people under age thirty-five.

For both of the findings to be accurate, which of the following must be true?

(A) More subscribers to Systems who have never ordered merchandise in response to advertisements in the magazine are age thirty-five or over than are under age thirty-five.
(B) Among subscribers to Systems, the proportion who are under age thirty-five was considerably lower last year than it is now.
(C) Most merchandise orders placed in response to advertisements in Systems last year were placed by Systems subscribers over age thirty-five.
(D) Last year, the average dollar amount of merchandise orders placed was less for subscribers under age thirty-five than for those age thirty-five or over.
(E) Last year many people who placed orders for merchandise in response to advertisements in Systems were not subscribers to the magazine.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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26 Oct 2011, 18:09
Can anyone explain it? I kind of get lost when reading the question. Complex...
why E is right? I chose C instead.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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27 Oct 2011, 11:15
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miaojunmaggie wrote:
Can anyone explain it? I kind of get lost when reading the question. Complex...
why E is right? I chose C instead.

Let's assume
1. A total of 100 merchandise orders were placed last year by the subscribers in response to the advertisement.
2. A total of 200 merchandise orders were received by Systems in response to the advertisement (place by non-subscribers, or in the survey's terminology - people)

Therefore, total non-subscriber (people) orders = 100

It follows from #1 that
Subscribers under 35 years old = 30 orders
Subscribers equal-to/more than 35 years old = 70 orders

Since, From stimulus: Most of the merchandise orders
placed in response to advertisements in Systems last year were placed by people under age thirty-five
,

Subscribers + Non-subscribers (people) less than 35 years old = 101 and above

Hence, the OA is "E"

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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27 Oct 2011, 13:24
Haha, I understand why C is wrong now. It says most of the merchandise orders are placed by people over 35, and it contradicts with the stimulus which says most of the orders placed are by people under 35.

It demonstrates how important reading comprehension is in critical reasoning.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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27 Oct 2011, 15:27
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I picked E...by POE it's very hard to understand the argument....I like gummybear explanation

Premise 1: Subscribers...... 35 years old or younger...... accounted for 30% of the orders
Premise 2: 35 years old or younger..... accounted for most of the orders
Therefore many orders were placed by non subscribers.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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03 Nov 2011, 01:51
it is hard to understand argument. I do not see the similar questions in OG and gmatprep or from other sources. Anyone see the similar questions.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty [#permalink]

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03 Nov 2011, 02:13
Tough one!!
I found it a bit confusing.Chose B first but now understand why it is E after reading gummybear's explanation.

E is correct.

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Re: Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty   [#permalink] 03 Nov 2011, 02:13

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# Finding of a survey of Systems magazine subscribers: Thirty

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