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For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to

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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 08 Aug 2018, 13:00
Harshit2802 wrote:

AGree with your explanation and was stuck between A & E,
But ,why "The devastation and enslavement" isn't that makes devastation Specific



Hello Harshit.

I will be happy to help you with this one. :-)

From the usage of the before devastation and enslavement in Choice E, we can understand that the author wants to talk about the devastation and enslavement that the native people of the Western hemisphere had to suffer after Columbus set his foot on the countries in this hemisphere. The author does not talk of devastation and enslavement in generic sense.

However, is usage of the in Choice E a deciding factor in choosing this choice as a correct answer choice? IMHO, no. The correct meaning and the correct grammatical structure of this sentence makes it superior than all the given answer choices.

Hope this helps. :-)
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 12 Aug 2018, 12:16
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GMATNinja wrote:
This question is an irritating exception to the so-called “touch rule” for noun modifiers.

We also covered this example during our YouTube live chat, so if you prefer to get your SC via video, click here. And we also discussed “that” and the “touch rule” in our recent Topic of the Week on “that.”

Full disclosure: I fell asleep at the wheel and totally missed this question the first time I saw it a few years ago. So please be smarter than I was. :D

Quote:
A. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that has decimated native peoples of the Western Hemisphere

This sounds great! “… progress that has decimated native peoples…” Yeah!

Oh, wait. That doesn’t actually make sense. It wasn’t the progress that decimated native peoples – the “devastation and enslavement in the name of progress” was the thing that decimated native peoples. Oops.

Notice that this is a plausible exception to the “touch rule”: the only things separating “that” from “devastation and enslavement” are a pair of prepositional phrases, and it would be awfully tough to separate them from “devastation and enslavement.” So sure, “that has decimated native peoples” could refer back to “devastation and enslavement.”

But there’s a new problem: “devastation and enslavement… has decimated.” Subject-verb error. Eliminate (A).

Quote:
B. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress by which native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated

This one just doesn’t make any sense. The native peoples were decimated; the way (B) is written, it sounds like they decimated somebody else, but we don’t know who. And that doesn’t make sense. Eliminate (B).

Quote:
C. devastating and enslaving in the name of progress those native peoples of the Western Hemisphere which in the name of progress are decimated

Lots of messy issues here. It’s not ideal to use the gerunds “devastating and enslaving” when we could use the noun forms “devastation and enslavement.” That’s not necessarily an absolute rule, but it’s one strike against (C).

(Also, “in the name of progress” is repeated… but I think that’s a GMAT Club typo, and that error doesn’t appear in the actual question. Oops.)

“Which” is a problem here, too. If the phrase beginning with “which” modifies “Western Hemisphere,” then it’s illogical; if it reaches back to “native peoples of the Western Hemisphere”, then it’s still wrong, because “which” can’t modify people – only things. (C) is gone.

Quote:
D. devastating and enslaving those native peoples of the western Hemisphere which in the name of progress are decimated.

Basically, all of the errors in (C) are repeated in (D). So (D) is out, too.

Quote:
E. the devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that have decimated the native peoples of the Western Hemisphere.

Almost everything we said about (A) applies here too: this looks like a classic exception to the “touch rule.”

The only difference? “Has” in (A) has been changed to “have” in (E). “Devastation and enslavement… have decimated the native peoples.”

So (E) is the best answer, even if you think (A) might sound better. :)

And if anybody is still curious about the article "the" at the beginning of (E): I don't think it's a big deal, but adding "the" helps clarify that Columbus personifies the specific devastation and enslavement that decimated the native peoples, rather than devastation and enslavement in general. But again: that's not a major issue, and not something that should worry you too much.


GMATNinja

Sir I am not clear with the explanation you provided for option B. Could you elaborate this a little more?
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 13 Aug 2018, 19:30
Prateek176 wrote:

GMATNinja

Sir I am not clear with the explanation you provided for option B. Could you elaborate this a little more?


GMATNinja wrote:
Quote:
B. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress by which native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated

This one just doesn’t make any sense. The native peoples were decimated; the way (B) is written, it sounds like they decimated somebody else, but we don’t know who. And that doesn’t make sense. Eliminate (B).

Consider a silly example: "After working up a huge appetite on the ski slopes, Charlie decimated the buffet." In this example, some guy named Charlie decimated ("destroyed") the buffet, presumably by eating all of it. "Charlie" is the grammatical subject for the verb "decimated" -- and the poor buffet is the thing that is decimated.

(B) is actually structured the same way: "... native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated." "Native peoples" is the subject, and "decimated" is the verb. The problem is, the sentence never says what, exactly, the "native peoples" decimate. There is no object for the sentence. And logically, the native peoples themselves WERE decimated. They didn't "decimate" anything.

(In in case anybody is wondering, there are apparently two different versions of this question. My explanation was originally attached to a slightly different version of the question than the one that appears at the very beginning of this thread.)

I hope this helps!
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For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 31 Oct 2018, 22:59
GMATNinja wrote:
Quote:
B. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress by which native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated

This one just doesn’t make any sense. The native peoples were decimated; the way (B) is written, it sounds like they decimated somebody else, but we don’t know who. And that doesn’t make sense. Eliminate (B).

Consider a silly example: "After working up a huge appetite on the ski slopes, Charlie decimated the buffet." In this example, some guy named Charlie decimated ("destroyed") the buffet, presumably by eating all of it. "Charlie" is the grammatical subject for the verb "decimated" -- and the poor buffet is the thing that is decimated.

(B) is actually structured the same way: "... native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated." "Native peoples" is the subject, and "decimated" is the verb. The problem is, the sentence never says what, exactly, the "native peoples" decimate. There is no object for the sentence. And logically, the native peoples themselves WERE decimated. They didn't "decimate" anything.

(In in case anybody is wondering, there are apparently two different versions of this question. My explanation was originally attached to a slightly different version of the question than the one that appears at the very beginning of this thread.)

I hope this helps![/quote]



I have the same question, B has "have been" decimated. Also, more recently it has been observed that there is no preference for active over passive if the meaning of the sentence fits either choice. Can anyone please help? Why not B?
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New post 22 Nov 2018, 21:32
Hi Experts,

Could you shed some light on the usage of "peoples"? I believe people has the same plural as well as singular form.

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For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post Updated on: 09 Jan 2019, 09:33
Though I chose (E), I now wonder what exactly in (B) makes it an inferior choice to (E), as the question is written now? I thought it was because of the article ("the") - is this correct?

Originally posted by crazyasian1 on 07 Jan 2019, 19:55.
Last edited by crazyasian1 on 09 Jan 2019, 09:33, edited 1 time in total.
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For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 07 Jan 2019, 20:36
1
GMATNinja wrote:
This question is an irritating exception to the so-called “touch rule” for noun modifiers.

We also covered this example during our YouTube live chat, so if you prefer to get your SC via video, click here. And we also discussed “that” and the “touch rule” in our recent Topic of the Week on “that.”

Full disclosure: I fell asleep at the wheel and totally missed this question the first time I saw it a few years ago. So please be smarter than I was. :D

Quote:
A. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that has decimated native peoples of the Western Hemisphere

This sounds great! “… progress that has decimated native peoples…” Yeah!

Oh, wait. That doesn’t actually make sense. It wasn’t the progress that decimated native peoples – the “devastation and enslavement in the name of progress” was the thing that decimated native peoples. Oops.

Notice that this is a plausible exception to the “touch rule”: the only things separating “that” from “devastation and enslavement” are a pair of prepositional phrases, and it would be awfully tough to separate them from “devastation and enslavement.” So sure, “that has decimated native peoples” could refer back to “devastation and enslavement.”

But there’s a new problem: “devastation and enslavement… has decimated.” Subject-verb error. Eliminate (A).

Quote:
B. devastation and enslavement in the name of progress by which native peoples of the Western Hemisphere decimated

This one just doesn’t make any sense. The native peoples were decimated; the way (B) is written, it sounds like they decimated somebody else, but we don’t know who. And that doesn’t make sense. Eliminate (B).

Quote:
C. devastating and enslaving in the name of progress those native peoples of the Western Hemisphere which in the name of progress are decimated

Lots of messy issues here. It’s not ideal to use the gerunds “devastating and enslaving” when we could use the noun forms “devastation and enslavement.” That’s not necessarily an absolute rule, but it’s one strike against (C).

(Also, “in the name of progress” is repeated… but I think that’s a GMAT Club typo, and that error doesn’t appear in the actual question. Oops.)

“Which” is a problem here, too. If the phrase beginning with “which” modifies “Western Hemisphere,” then it’s illogical; if it reaches back to “native peoples of the Western Hemisphere”, then it’s still wrong, because “which” can’t modify people – only things. (C) is gone.

Quote:
D. devastating and enslaving those native peoples of the western Hemisphere which in the name of progress are decimated.

Basically, all of the errors in (C) are repeated in (D). So (D) is out, too.

Quote:
E. the devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that have decimated the native peoples of the Western Hemisphere.

Almost everything we said about (A) applies here too: this looks like a classic exception to the “touch rule.”

The only difference? “Has” in (A) has been changed to “have” in (E). “Devastation and enslavement… have decimated the native peoples.”

So (E) is the best answer, even if you think (A) might sound better. :)

And if anybody is still curious about the article "the" at the beginning of (E): I don't think it's a big deal, but adding "the" helps clarify that Columbus personifies the specific devastation and enslavement that decimated the native peoples, rather than devastation and enslavement in general. But again: that's not a major issue, and not something that should worry you too much.



Here we are not following touch rule,could you please provide some examples from OG ,where gmat has not followed touch rule?
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 08 Jan 2019, 00:46
E is the correct answer because of the correct usage of parallel the parallel elements . Also plural have is correctly used.
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 20 Jan 2019, 13:44
ovrup007 wrote:
Hi Experts,

Could you shed some light on the usage of "peoples"? I believe people has the same plural as well as singular form.

Thanks & Regards,
Abhirup

You're basically correct if we're talking about... well, actual people. "People" is just the plural of "person." But if we're talking about multiple ethnic groups or several nations of people, then the plural is "peoples". It's a weird bit of English. So it would be correct to talk about the various "Turkic peoples of the Asian steppe", for example.

And I would bet you a pair of Super Bowl tickets that you won't see the word "peoples" on your actual GMAT exam. So please don't lose any sleep over it.

I hope this helps a bit!
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 20 Jan 2019, 18:23
GMATNinja should which always have a comma before it?
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 10 Feb 2019, 05:33
For a question such as this one, how do we know whether "that" is acting as a modifier to describe "enslavement" alone or "devastation and enslavement". I marked A because I thought that "that" jumps over the prepositional phrase to modify enslavement alone, and choice E is wrong because "the devastation and enslavement" seems to be a singular entity.

Please help. Thank you
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 02 Apr 2019, 01:24
jelata wrote:
For a question such as this one, how do we know whether "that" is acting as a modifier to describe "enslavement" alone or "devastation and enslavement". I marked A because I thought that "that" jumps over the prepositional phrase to modify enslavement alone, and choice E is wrong because "the devastation and enslavement" seems to be a singular entity.

Please help. Thank you

Good question! Because the GMAT cannot ask us to read minds, we have to use context clues and logic to guide us.

Take another look at (E):

Quote:
the devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that have decimated the native peoples of the Western Hemisphere.

While we can't know what the author intended, we can see that the verb "have" is plural, and so the phrase beginning with "that" must modify a plural noun. The only possibility here is the compound noun phrase, "the devastation and enslavement"; otherwise, we’d have a subject-verb agreement problem otherwise, since “… enslavement that have decimated" doesn’t work at all.

Contrast this with (A):
Quote:
…devastation and enslavement in the name of progress that has decimated native peoples of the Western Hemisphere.

Now "has" is singular, meaning we need “that” to modify a singular noun. So at the very least, the phrase “that has decimated native peoples” can’t modify “devastation and enslavement”, since that pair of nouns would require a plural verb.

So what are our options for singular nouns? The closest preceding singular noun is "progress." But it doesn't make any sense to write that "progress" decimated peoples.

I suppose you could argue that “that has decimated native peoples” modifies only “enslavement.” But that requires a huge logical contortion: in order for "that" to refer only to "enslavement," we'd have to convince ourselves that "that" somehow jumps over "progress" and then refers to only one of two items in a compound noun construction (“devastation and enslavement”). That’s pretty far-fetched.

If finding an antecedent requires that much logical contortion, it's a good bet that we're over-complicating things -- we want the correct answer to be as clear as possible.

The simplest interpretation of (A) is illogical, and so (E) is clearly better.

I hope that helps!
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 12 May 2019, 10:21
" A and B" dose not allway require singular verb because semantically A and B can be considered one thing
for example
freedom and happiness in US is important. here, we consider freedom and happiness one thing.

but if "A and B+singular verb" exist in presence of "A and B +plural verb" , it is clear that the latter is correct, other things equal.

so, we can only eliminate choice A when choice E appear. we can not eliminate choice A when we read only choice A. we can not apply a hard and fast rule that " A and B + singular verb" is wrong
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 06 Jun 2019, 06:42
I understood that we are using HAVE for devastation and enslavement.

but it is mentioned THAT, we can use has because of THAT.

Can you help me to understand here Rakesh1987
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 06 Jun 2019, 07:19
Thanks Rakesh1987
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New post 08 Jun 2019, 20:36
In the first post, choice B has the present perfect "HAVE BEEN" before "decimated", in the discussions and GMAT Ninja's webinar, the verb is in simple past "decimated".

Im assuming this is a typo in the first post? If yes, maybe the moderator should edit it to prevent other people (like me hehe) from being confused?

Thanks!
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to  [#permalink]

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New post 09 Jun 2019, 06:11
Diwabag wrote:
In the first post, choice B has the present perfect "HAVE BEEN" before "decimated", in the discussions and GMAT Ninja's webinar, the verb is in simple past "decimated".

Im assuming this is a typo in the first post? If yes, maybe the moderator should edit it to prevent other people (like me hehe) from being confused?

Thanks!

Diwabag, I'm not sure that it's a typo, exactly. As far as I know, the version that's in the original post actually appeared somewhere -- maybe in a previous version of the GMATPrep software? This is not unusual: sometimes the GMAT publishes multiple versions of the same question, for some reason.

Bunuel, do you think it's better to change the original post to the version that's currently in the GMATPrep software? There's just a slight difference in the answer choices. I trust your judgment in all things related to forum hygiene. :)
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Re: For many revisionist historians, Christopher Columbus has come to   [#permalink] 09 Jun 2019, 06:11

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