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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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study wrote:
Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|?

(1) y < x
(2) xy < 0


Statement I is insufficient

x....y.....(|x|-|y|)....|x-y|.....YES/NO
3....2.......1..............1........NO
3..-3........0..............6........YES

Statement II is sufficient
xy<0 means that either one of the numbers is negative and other is positive

|x-y| will always result to be a greater value as negative - positive or positive - negative will result in addition of the numbers and |x| - |y| will always result in subtraction.

Hence the answer is B
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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Forget conventional ways of solving math questions. In DS, Variable approach is the easiest and quickest way to find the answer without actually solving the problem. Remember equal number of variables and independent equations ensures a solution.

Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|?

(1) y < x
(2) xy < 0

If we modify the original condition,
if |x|>=|y|,
|x-y|>|x|-|y|>=0, so we can square both sides, which gives us (|x-y|)^2>(|x|-|y|)^2, and (x-y)^2>(|x|-|y|)^2
This becomes x^2+y^2-2xy>x^2+y^2-2|xy|, and if we simplify the inequality, -2xy>-2|xy|, and we ultimately want to know whether xy<0. This makes condition 2 sufficient.
if |x|<|y|, then |x|-|y|<0,
so |x-y|>|x|-|y| always work. Hence we do not need to deal with this, so the answer becomes (B).

Once we modify the original condition and the question according to the variable approach method 1, we can solve approximately 30% of DS questions.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
Bunuel wrote:
LM wrote:
Please tell the quick approach.... it took me loner than I should have taken....


Algebraic approach is given in my first post. Below is another approach:

\(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\)?

(1) \(y<x\)

Try two positive number \(x=3>y=1\) --> is \(|3-1|>|3|-|1|\)? --> is \(2>2\)? Answer NO.

Try ANY other case but both positive: \(x=-5>y=-7\) --> is \(|-5-(-7)|>|-5|-|-7|\)? --> is \(2>-2\)? Answer YES.

Two different answers. Not sufficient.

(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs.

Now we can spot here that when \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs \(x-y\) always "contribute" to each other so that its absolute value will increase: \(x=3\), \(y=-1\) --> \(|x-y|=|3+1|=|4|=4\) or \(x=-3\), \(y=1\) --> \(|x-y|=|-3-1|=|4|=4\).

But \(|x|-|y|\) is difference (thus not "contributing") of two positive values (as neither equals to zero). \(x=3\), \(y=-1\) --> \(|x|-|y|=|3|-|-1|=2\) or \(x=-3\), \(y=1\) --> \(|x|-|y|=|-3|-|1|=2\).

So \(xy<0\) means \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) is always true.

Sufficient.

Answer: B.

Hope it helps.


This graphical approach will help to verify those value.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
study wrote:
Is \(|x - y| > |x| - |y|\)?

(1) \(y < x\)
(2) \(xy < 0\)


Explanation from RON (Manhattan)

Statement (1)
let's try x = 2, y = 1
is |2 - 1| > |2| - |1| ?
no.
let's try x = -1, y = -2
is |-1 - (-2)| > |-1| - |-2| ?
yes.
Insufficient.

Statement (2)

this means we have to pick OPPOSITE SIGNS. therefore, there are basically 6 cases to try:
* x is negative "bigger", y is positive "smaller"
* x is negative, y is positive, same magnitude
* x is negative "smaller", y is positive "bigger"
* x is positive "bigger", y is negative "smaller"
* x is positive, y is negative, same magnitude
* x is positive "smaller", y is negative "bigger"

If you try all of these --

-2, 1 --> is |-3| > 2 - 1? YES
-1, 1 --> is |-2| > 0? YES
-1, 2 --> is |-3| > 1 - 2? YES
2, -1 --> is |3| > 2 - 1? YES
1, -1 --> is |2| > 0? YES
1, -2 --> is |3| > 1 - 2? YES

the pattern is pretty clear: in each of these cases, the two numbers' magnitudes are working together on the left, but against each other on the right. therefore, the left-hand side is always going to be bigger.
Sufficient.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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Answer: B
IS |X-Y| > |X| - |Y| ?
a) Y<X
b) XY<0

Statement A:
If, Y=-1 X=1 then LHS=2 and RHS=0 -->Correct
If, Y=1 X=3 then LHS=2 and RHS=2 -->Incorrect
Thus INSUFFICIENT

Statement B:
Either of X or Y is -ve.
If, Y=-1 X=1 then LHS=2 and RHS=0 -->Correct
If, Y=1 X=-3 then LHS=4 and RHS=2 -->Correct
Thus SUFFICIENT
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
Bunuel wrote:
Basically the question asks whether the distance between the two points x and y on the line is greater than the difference between the individual distances of x and y from 0.

\(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\)?

(1) \(y<x\), 3 possible cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

A. ---------------\(0\)---\(y\)---\(x\)---, \(0<y<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x-y\) --> \(0>0\). Which is wrong;
B. ---------\(y\)---\(0\)---------\(x\)---, \(y<0<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x+y\) --> \(y<0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<0<x\);
C. ---\(y\)---\(x\)---\(0\)--------------, \(y<x<0\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>-x+y\) --> \(x>y\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<x<0\).

Two different answers. Not sufficient.

(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs, hence 2 cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

A. ----\(y\)-----\(0\)-------\(x\)---, \(y<0<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x+y\) --> \(y<0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<0<x\);
B. ----\(x\)-----\(0\)-------\(y\)---, \(x<0<y\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(-x+y>-x-y\) --> \(y>0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(x<0<y\).

In both cases inequality holds true. Sufficient.

Answer: B.

Hi Bunuel,

Tried hard to understand the following related to the red part above but at the end no success. Would you please clear my doubt?

In 1 B & C, you have changed the sign of x and y in RHS, and not modified the LHS(red part) according to the sign of x and y.---- Understood the explanation of st. 1
But in 2 B, You have modified also the LHS part according to the sign of x and y. (red part) ------- Why have you not followed the process that you have followed in st 1 ?

What did this difference in procedure depend on?
Thank You in advance.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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TaN1213 wrote:
Bunuel wrote:
Basically the question asks whether the distance between the two points x and y on the line is greater than the difference between the individual distances of x and y from 0.

\(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\)?

(1) \(y<x\), 3 possible cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

A. ---------------\(0\)---\(y\)---\(x\)---, \(0<y<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x-y\) --> \(0>0\). Which is wrong;
B. ---------\(y\)---\(0\)---------\(x\)---, \(y<0<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x+y\) --> \(y<0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<0<x\);
C. ---\(y\)---\(x\)---\(0\)--------------, \(y<x<0\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>-x+y\) --> \(x>y\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<x<0\).

Two different answers. Not sufficient.

(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs, hence 2 cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

A. ----\(y\)-----\(0\)-------\(x\)---, \(y<0<x\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>x+y\) --> \(y<0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<0<x\);
B. ----\(x\)-----\(0\)-------\(y\)---, \(x<0<y\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(-x+y>-x-y\) --> \(y>0\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(x<0<y\).

In both cases inequality holds true. Sufficient.

Answer: B.

Hi Bunuel,

Tried hard to understand the following related to the red part above but at the end no success. Would you please clear my doubt?

In 1 B & C, you have changed the sign of x and y in RHS, and not modified the LHS(red part) according to the sign of x and y.---- Understood the explanation of st. 1
But in 2 B, You have modified also the LHS part according to the sign of x and y. (red part) ------- Why have you not followed the process that you have followed in st 1 ?

What did this difference in procedure depend on?
Thank You in advance.


When \(x \le 0\) then \(|x|=-x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \le 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = -(\text{some expression})\). For example: \(|-5|=5=-(-5)\);

When \(x \ge 0\) then \(|x|=x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \ge 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = \text{some expression}\). For example: \(|5|=5\)



(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs, hence 2 cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

B. ----\(x\)-----\(0\)-------\(y\)---.

This means that \(x<0<y\). So, \(x - y < 0\), \(x<0\) and \(y>0\). According to the properties above if \(x - y < 0\), then \(|x-y|=-(x-y)\), if \(x<0\), then \(|x|=-x\) and if \(y>0\), then \(|y|=y\).

Hope it's clear.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
Bunuel wrote:
When \(x \le 0\) then \(|x|=-x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \le 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = -(\text{some expression})\). For example: \(|-5|=5=-(-5)\);

When \(x \ge 0\) then \(|x|=x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \ge 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = \text{some expression}\). For example: \(|5|=5\)



(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs, hence 2 cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

B. ----\(x\)-----\(0\)-------\(y\)---.

This means that \(x<0<y\). So, \(x - y < 0\), \(x<0\) and \(y>0\). According to the properties above if \(x - y < 0\), then \(|x-y|=-(x-y)\), if \(x<0\), then \(|x|=-x\) and if \(y>0\), then \(|y|=y\).

Hope it's clear.

Following this same approach, shouldn't the following part become (-x-y)?
Quote:
1C. ---\(y\)---\(x\)---\(0\)--------------, \(y<x<0\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>-x+y\) --> \(x>y\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<x<0\).


in 2 B you have modified the \(x-y\) to -(x-y) because x is negative and y is positive. So in the same way the 1C should take (-x-y) as per the sign of x.
What am I missing?
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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TaN1213 wrote:
Bunuel wrote:
When \(x \le 0\) then \(|x|=-x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \le 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = -(\text{some expression})\). For example: \(|-5|=5=-(-5)\);

When \(x \ge 0\) then \(|x|=x\), or more generally when \(\text{some expression} \ge 0\) then \(|\text{some expression}| = \text{some expression}\). For example: \(|5|=5\)



(2) \(xy<0\), means \(x\) and \(y\) have different signs, hence 2 cases for \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\):

B. ----\(x\)-----\(0\)-------\(y\)---.

This means that \(x<0<y\). So, \(x - y < 0\), \(x<0\) and \(y>0\). According to the properties above if \(x - y < 0\), then \(|x-y|=-(x-y)\), if \(x<0\), then \(|x|=-x\) and if \(y>0\), then \(|y|=y\).

Hope it's clear.

Following this same approach, shouldn't the following part become (-x-y)?
Quote:
1C. ---\(y\)---\(x\)---\(0\)--------------, \(y<x<0\) --> in this case \(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) becomes: \(x-y>-x+y\) --> \(x>y\). Which is right, as we consider the range \(y<x<0\).


in 2 B you have modified the \(x-y\) to -(x-y) because x is negative and y is positive. So in the same way the 1C should take (-x-y) as per the sign of x.
What am I missing?


C. ---\(y\)---\(x\)---\(0\)--------------, \(y<x<0\):

x - y > 0, so |x - y| = x - y;
y < 0, so |y| = y;
x < 0, so |x| = x.

\(|x-y|>|x|-|y|\) --> x - y > -x - (-y) --> x - y > -x + y
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
I am a little bit concerned here.
If the question states x and y, can we make an assumption that x ≠ y?
For example here, without this assumption, i can let x = y and (2) is NS?
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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khiemchii wrote:
I am a little bit concerned here.
If the question states x and y, can we make an assumption that x ≠ y?
For example here, without this assumption, i can let x = y and (2) is NS?


Unless it is explicitly stated otherwise, different variables CAN represent the same number.

For (2) though x = y is not possible because in this case we'd get x^2 < 0, which is not true for any real number, so x = y does not satisfy xy < 0 and therefore should not be considered for the second statement. Similarly, for (1) it's give that y < x, so x = y cannot be true.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
Can anyone tell me the flaw in my logic

|x - y| > |x| - |y|
Squaring both sides
x^2 +y^2-2xy> x^2 +y^2-2|x||y|
simplifying, xy<|x||y|,

It will only be possible when product of xy is -ve. or xy<0, Hence B.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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ManishKM1 wrote:
Can anyone tell me the flaw in my logic

|x - y| > |x| - |y|
Squaring both sides
x^2 +y^2-2xy> x^2 +y^2-2|x||y|
simplifying, xy<|x||y|,

It will only be possible when product of xy is -ve. or xy<0, Hence B.


Given:
|x - y| > |x| - |y|, you cannot square it. You can square only when you know that both sides are positive. Here, the right hand side may not be positive. For example, if x is 2 and y is 5.
3 > -3
Squaring does not work here since you get 9 > 9 which doesn't hold.
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
VeritasPrepKarishma

Is it incorrect to say that question is asking is |x|>|y| ?

Posted from my mobile device
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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Mudit27021988 wrote:
VeritasPrepKarishma

Is it incorrect to say that question is asking is |x|>|y| ?

Posted from my mobile device


For all real x and y, |x – y| >= |x| – |y|

|x – y| = |x| – |y| when
(1) x and y have the same sign and x has greater (or equal) absolute value than y
(2) y is 0

|x – y| > |x| – |y| in all other cases (i.e. y is not 0 and |x| < |y| or x and y have opposite signs)

So |x – y| > |x| – |y| is not the same as |x| > |y|

Check: https://www.gmatclub.com/forum/veritas-prep-resource-links-no-longer-available-399979.html#/2014/0 ... -the-gmat/
https://www.gmatclub.com/forum/veritas-prep-resource-links-no-longer-available-399979.html#/2014/0 ... t-part-ii/
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
Dear GMATGuruNY

In this question stem, can I square both sides? or is it wrong?

Thanks
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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Mo2men wrote:
Dear GMATGuruNY

In this question stem, can I square both sides? or is it wrong?

Thanks


Squaring both sides of an inequality is a good approach when both sides are guaranteed to be nonnegative.
Here, the right side of the question stem is NOT guaranteed to be nonnegative, so squaring the inequality is not recommended:
If x=2 and y=1, then |x| - |y| > 0
If x=1 and y=2, then |x| - |y| < 0
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Re: Is |x - y| > |x| - |y|? (1) y < x (2) xy < 0 [#permalink]
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