Last visit was: 24 Apr 2024, 15:07 It is currently 24 Apr 2024, 15:07

Close
GMAT Club Daily Prep
Thank you for using the timer - this advanced tool can estimate your performance and suggest more practice questions. We have subscribed you to Daily Prep Questions via email.

Customized
for You

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History

Track
Your Progress

every week, we’ll send you an estimated GMAT score based on your performance

Practice
Pays

we will pick new questions that match your level based on your Timer History
Not interested in getting valuable practice questions and articles delivered to your email? No problem, unsubscribe here.
Close
Request Expert Reply
Confirm Cancel
SORT BY:
Date
User avatar
GMAT Club Legend
GMAT Club Legend
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4307
Own Kudos [?]: 806 [28]
Given Kudos: 5
Location: Back in Chicago, IL
Concentration: General/Operations Management
Schools:Kellogg Alum: Class of 2010
 Q49  V42
Send PM
avatar
Current Student
Joined: 11 Apr 2009
Posts: 212
Own Kudos [?]: 14 [1]
Given Kudos: 2
Concentration: Operations
Send PM
User avatar
GMAT Club Legend
GMAT Club Legend
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4307
Own Kudos [?]: 806 [1]
Given Kudos: 5
Location: Back in Chicago, IL
Concentration: General/Operations Management
Schools:Kellogg Alum: Class of 2010
 Q49  V42
Send PM
avatar
Retired Thread Master
Joined: 29 Jan 2011
Posts: 61
Own Kudos [?]: 16 [1]
Given Kudos: 24
Location: United States (TX)
Concentration: Technology, Strategy
GMAT 1: 650 Q35 V45
GPA: 3.72
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
You probably just described one of the big reasons women are only 20-30% of a lot of MBA programs. And why there's so few women in the upper echelons of the corporate world. If they don't already have children pre-MBA, many women will want them at some point, and there's only so many years that's physically possible. Those happen to overlap with the years that a company will likely want you to travel the most. So everyone has to make their choices about what they want more.
User avatar
GMAT Club Legend
GMAT Club Legend
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4307
Own Kudos [?]: 806 [3]
Given Kudos: 5
Location: Back in Chicago, IL
Concentration: General/Operations Management
Schools:Kellogg Alum: Class of 2010
 Q49  V42
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
3
Kudos
Izvos, could you please give credit and direct people to this site.

Besides women, there are also plenty of men who decide that the extra hours and stress aren't worth it in the end. It is probably true for many women who have kids and other commitments, then again taking 3/4 months off wont kill a career and plenty of women return to work that quickly after having kids. If/When my wife and I have kids, we will end up with a nanny since my wife working and paying a nanny makes far more sense than my wife quitting. This is a decision plenty of women who are successful will make.

Don't be scared of the hours, there are plenty of jobs that wont demand more than 50-60 hours and lots of those will pay plenty. That may sound like alot of hours for people who work 40-45 now, but if you really are enjoying your work then it is very tolerable. I think my long hours are easier to take than my previous life as an engineer working minimal hours. For one, there is much greater job satisfaction. Most people going to top MBA programs are very motivated and want to succeed and have an impact. Many of my friends who are working long hours, do like it since they feel that their contributions are valued and important to their companies. One ironic things is that my friends who are working the least hours actually aren't very enthusiastic about their jobs. Either they feel they are not getting to show what they can accomplish or that they are already being marginalized.

Some industries also offer much easier hours. I know some friends in oil/gas who work 45 hour weeks, where as I have friends at tech and manufacturing companies who work much more than that. If you are passionate about what you are doing those hours fly by. If easy hours is important definitely look at industry norms.
avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 23 Sep 2010
Posts: 233
Own Kudos [?]: 57 [1]
Given Kudos: 14
Location: United States (MN)
Concentration: Entrepreneurship, Marketing
Schools: Harvard Business School - Class of 2013
GMAT 1: 750 Q48 V45
GPA: 3.67
WE:Supply Chain Management (Consumer Products)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
Great post riverripper! As someone who has worked a great deal in CPG, the work-life balance situation for general managers, brand managers, and finance analysts post b-school isn't all that it's cracked up to be. My brand manager friends regularly work 60-80 hours a week and depending on the time of the financial calendar, my finance friends also work similar hours. So while travel is minimal, you're being paid significantly less than consulting or banking with still a great deal of work to be done. Also, these positions (since they are grooming roles for organizational leaders) are extremely competitive (imagine 80-100 new MBA grads from the top schools vying for a handful of management positions). You really have to love corporate finance or brand management to go down this route. Sure, you can find functions and roles in CPG that will be 40-50 hours that pay in the low six figures but like riverripper mentioned, you're not going to ever climb the ranks that way. The 40 hour work week is a myth. :)
User avatar
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
Joined: 14 Oct 2009
Status:Current Student
Posts: 353
Own Kudos [?]: 244 [0]
Given Kudos: 53
Concentration: CPG Marketing
Schools:Chicago Booth 2013, Ross, Duke , Kellogg , Stanford, Haas
 Q41  V42
GPA: 3.8
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
eskimoroll wrote:
Great post riverripper! As someone who has worked a great deal in CPG, the work-life balance situation for general managers, brand managers, and finance analysts post b-school isn't all that it's cracked up to be. My brand manager friends regularly work 60-80 hours a week and depending on the time of the financial calendar, my finance friends also work similar hours. So while travel is minimal, you're being paid significantly less than consulting or banking with still a great deal of work to be done. Also, these positions (since they are grooming roles for organizational leaders) are extremely competitive (imagine 80-100 new MBA grads from the top schools vying for a handful of management positions). You really have to love corporate finance or brand management to go down this route. Sure, you can find functions and roles in CPG that will be 40-50 hours that pay in the low six figures but like riverripper mentioned, you're not going to ever climb the ranks that way. The 40 hour work week is a myth. :)


Thanks! Any other CPG knowledge you have to share would be extremely valuable to me as there is not too much available here :)

Are any of your friends in brand management looking at alternative industries/career paths?
User avatar
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 261
Own Kudos [?]: 23 [0]
Given Kudos: 45
Concentration: Finance, General Management
Schools: Michigan (Ross) - Class of 2013
WE:Other (Insurance)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
Izvos wrote:
Very nice article. I posted it to my blog EDITED

Actually, i did not consider this factor till now and really started thinking about it. And how your life changes after of years of such work?

Speaking about those IB 100+ hours week guys, how are they?


Izvos -

On your blog you are not giving credit to the original writer of this post (Riverripper). This is plagiarism, and I’m sure that the original poster doesn’t appreciate it. This makes me wonder if any of your articles are legitimately yours.

Riverripper has written many helpful posts for future MBAs. Please give credit when credit is due.

Thank you.
User avatar
Current Student
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Status:Attending Johnson!
Posts: 80
Own Kudos [?]: 53 [0]
Given Kudos: 8
Location: United States (NY)
Schools: Cornell (Johnson) - Class of 2013
WE:Engineering (Consulting)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
I second Mreevit's comment, wholeheartedly!
User avatar
GMAT Club Legend
GMAT Club Legend
Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4307
Own Kudos [?]: 806 [0]
Given Kudos: 5
Location: Back in Chicago, IL
Concentration: General/Operations Management
Schools:Kellogg Alum: Class of 2010
 Q49  V42
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
The compensation myth is another one that people always spin. A lot of people think consulting pays a lot more, while it pays more than most it is not always the case. The spread isn't what you would think, I know my total 1st year income probably matched consultants. I know many of my consultant friends who are working very long hours and doing work on weekends too. I also know a few that have not enjoyed the work or people very much and area already looking for a new job.

Due diligence is very important no matter what you do, the culture for difference companies is very different no matter what the function. You may want to consulting and realize only a few of the firms are good for you. You may want to go GM and avoid the major recruiters who are massive corporations for a position at a small or mid-cap company. Alumni are typically very honest about all aspects of a job, as long as they aren't part of the recruiting team. I knew what I was getting myself into pretty well thanks to an alumni, I also can say for certain that my company is not for everyone and a lot of my classmates would hate it.

I didn't travel this week and probably will work a 45 hour week as long as something crazy doesnt come up. I think this is one thing that corporate jobs do have, peaks and valleys. For example, if you are finance then quarter end will probably be crazy for you. It seems to work out for me when I start to hit that wall I get a break. That definitely doesnt seem to occur with my friends in consulting or banking. For them it is go go go, consultants really depend on the length of the project and I know people still working on the same project 10 months later and they burned out long ago.
User avatar
MBA Admissions Consultant
Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 2457
Own Kudos [?]: 598 [16]
Given Kudos: 2
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
16
Kudos
Some great points all around here.

Only thing to add:

The irony of b-school admissions is that they want these super ambitious "change the world" types who put career first and who value "what matters most to you" and self-fulfillment, ambition, etc. -- or even some sort of social conscience ("save the planet'!) sort of mantra where the seeds of that ambition is still ego and self-interest.

But in reality, like most human beings, it comes down to family. And family first. No matter what nationality or cultural background.

The fact is, most people (MBAs included) don't have the equivalent of winning the lottery by "having it all" -- being at the very top AND having all the time and resources in the world to have a wonderful personal life. Of those who are at the top of their professions (business, law, medicine, politics, entertainment, etc) most still have a lot of trouble with work-life balance. The very few who have both tend to recognize how incredibly lucky they are, because it's luck (being at the right place at the right time and having everything align).

For everyone else, sooner or later you are forced to make tradeoffs between your own career satisfaction and the needs of your entire family. And if you come from a culture where the extended family is very close knit (or you don't just kick out aging parents into a nursing home), it becomes even more of a difficult tradeoff.

When you have kids, your own self-fulfillment, career satisfaction, etc. becomes secondary if you are being the classic responsible parent who wants the best for his/her kids. "Work-life balance" takes on a different meaning when you are responsible for a family.

Which is why this whole talk about "career goals" becomes moot once you have kids -- because it's no longer driven by what YOU want to do. It's no longer about you. But about what you *need* to do to provide for your family - not just financially, but also everything else (school districts, spending time with them, etc).

If applicants were to answer the "career goals" essay honestly -- especially medium- to long-term, it would most likely be this:

"I will take whatever job at that time that is best for my family, especially my kids."

It's that which dictates what your job will be. You may not like your job at Behemoth Bureaucratic Corporation, but it provides health insurance for your entire family that Super Sexy Startup doesn't provide. Or you stick with another "okay" job over another "super sexy" job offer because the "okay" job means you don't need to move (you're in a great school district, you don't want to move your kids mid-year, etc). Regardless, your own personal career satisfaction may not be irrelevant, but it becomes secondary.

You may rather live and work in Manhattan, but with kids you may not have that choice. So you compromise for your kids to make sure you're living in a great school district, or you're living in a cheap enough area so you have money to pay for private schools if the public school system in your area sucks.

The reality is, most of you out there had parents who compromised (or even completely put aside) their own personal career aspirations after a while to raise you. And chances are, you'll do the same thing for your kids.

That's why in the end -- consulting, finance, industry, etc. really doesn't matter as much - it's all dependent on the situation and specific job/company at the time. You do what you need to do that you feel is best for your family.
User avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 132
Own Kudos [?]: 12 [0]
Given Kudos: 14
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
I would be interested to hear some perspectives on jobs outside of the U.S. Would the same industries or similar levels within a corporation have the same descriptions as the U.S when looking at work-life balance?

Becky
User avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 103
Own Kudos [?]: 23 [0]
Given Kudos: 6
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
riverripper wrote:
Izvos, could you please give credit and direct people to this site.




Thanx for the answer. I will give a back link.

I like the part with the hours will fly :-D
User avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 103
Own Kudos [?]: 23 [1]
Given Kudos: 6
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Bookmarks
mreevit wrote:
Izvos wrote:
Very nice article. I posted it to my blog EDITED

Actually, i did not consider this factor till now and really started thinking about it. And how your life changes after of years of such work?

Speaking about those IB 100+ hours week guys, how are they?


Izvos -

On your blog you are not giving credit to the original writer of this post (Riverripper). This is plagiarism, and I’m sure that the original poster doesn’t appreciate it. This makes me wonder if any of your articles are legitimately yours.

Riverripper has written many helpful posts for future MBAs. Please give credit when credit is due.

Thank you.


I added back link. Sorry for that
avatar
Intern
Intern
Joined: 26 Jun 2011
Posts: 32
Own Kudos [?]: 1 [1]
Given Kudos: 0
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
I've got to say that a lot of this is also dependent on where you are currently at. I'm in public accounting, which is renowned for having absolutely awful work/life balance. From January to June I'm out of town about 50% of the time, and when I'm not out of town I'm working minimum 6 days a week. Not to mention, in terms of compensation per hour worked, I'm positive that public accounting has ONE of the worst returns on hours worked that you'll find in professional life. Big 4 people might argue, but lets face it, they're usually brainwashed into thinking that 70+ hrs per week and 60k per year for 5-6 years of their life is just paying their "dues". In reality, sticking in public accounting is just about the absolute slowest way to work your way up in the world. The only slower way might be hanging out at bars hoping to befriend a billionaire CEO who subsequently hires you because he likes you. Public is GREAT for getting awesome experience in a variety of industries and for building a great resume. But long term? It's a heart attack at 40 just waiting to happen.

Anyway, yes, you have to look at your current situation. For me, in public accounting, my hours might increase marginally, but my pay will increase substantially. For many others, going to 60+ hour weeks year round might be a significant factor for consideration.

Oh, and riverripper, I live and work in West Virginia and you speak of it like it's punishment!! haha.
avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 113
Own Kudos [?]: 15 [1]
Given Kudos: 3
Schools:Wharton R2 (Int), Columbia (Ding), Kellogg R2, Duke R2 (Int)
WE 1: International Development (2 years)
WE 2: Ibanking (3.5 years)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
Pretty weak link back. I think its common courtesy to say at the beginning of your post something along the lines of this:

Hey everyone check out this great article of found here_________ by ________. Enjoy. They way you have the link masked at the bottom the post still appears as your own prose.

Not trying to highjack the thread just trying to point out proper etiquette.

Izvos wrote:
mreevit wrote:
Izvos wrote:
Very nice article. I posted it to my blog https://izvos.com/after-mba-worklife-balance/.

Actually, i did not consider this factor till now and really started thinking about it. And how your life changes after of years of such work?

Speaking about those IB 100+ hours week guys, how are they?


Izvos -

On your blog you are not giving credit to the original writer of this post (Riverripper). This is plagiarism, and I’m sure that the original poster doesn’t appreciate it. This makes me wonder if any of your articles are legitimately yours.

Riverripper has written many helpful posts for future MBAs. Please give credit when credit is due.

Thank you.


I added back link. Sorry for that
User avatar
Senior Manager
Senior Manager
Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 261
Own Kudos [?]: 23 [0]
Given Kudos: 45
Concentration: Finance, General Management
Schools: Michigan (Ross) - Class of 2013
WE:Other (Insurance)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
All of his articles are from somewhere else. In one post, it even says "MBAmission" in the article. I'm not sure if he understands that this is not acceptable, or if he is attempting to make some kind of "wiki" of useful articles.

Go ahead and see for yourself. Pick an article and paste a few sentences into Google. You will see his page and the source's page.
avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 23 Sep 2010
Posts: 233
Own Kudos [?]: 57 [1]
Given Kudos: 14
Location: United States (MN)
Concentration: Entrepreneurship, Marketing
Schools: Harvard Business School - Class of 2013
GMAT 1: 750 Q48 V45
GPA: 3.67
WE:Supply Chain Management (Consumer Products)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
Michmax3 wrote:

Thanks! Any other CPG knowledge you have to share would be extremely valuable to me as there is not too much available here :)

Are any of your friends in brand management looking at alternative industries/career paths?


Some are. I've had a few friends leave for tech product management roles (Ubisoft, Microsoft, etc.) but many just bounce around from one CPG to the next. Procter, J&J, Unilever, Kraft, General Mills, Cambells, Pepsi... etc. Definitely "the grass is greener" syndrome.
avatar
Manager
Manager
Joined: 15 Jun 2011
Posts: 55
Own Kudos [?]: 9 [1]
Given Kudos: 7
Concentration: Finance, Economics
GPA: 4
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
Izvos: thumbs down to you! Booooooooo.

Not only are you plagiarising the post, but you are even distracting everyone's attention from the OP's great post.
User avatar
Intern
Intern
Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Posts: 42
Own Kudos [?]: 19 [2]
Given Kudos: 2
Concentration: Finance, General Management
GMAT 1: 690 Q44 V41
GPA: 3.76
WE:Corporate Finance (Energy and Utilities)
Send PM
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
1
Kudos
riverripper wrote:
The compensation myth is another one that people always spin. A lot of people think consulting pays a lot more, while it pays more than most it is not always the case. The spread isn't what you would think, I know my total 1st year income probably matched consultants. I know many of my consultant friends who are working very long hours and doing work on weekends too. I also know a few that have not enjoyed the work or people very much and area already looking for a new job.

Due diligence is very important no matter what you do, the culture for difference companies is very different no matter what the function. You may want to consulting and realize only a few of the firms are good for you. You may want to go GM and avoid the major recruiters who are massive corporations for a position at a small or mid-cap company. Alumni are typically very honest about all aspects of a job, as long as they aren't part of the recruiting team. I knew what I was getting myself into pretty well thanks to an alumni, I also can say for certain that my company is not for everyone and a lot of my classmates would hate it.

I didn't travel this week and probably will work a 45 hour week as long as something crazy doesnt come up. I think this is one thing that corporate jobs do have, peaks and valleys. For example, if you are finance then quarter end will probably be crazy for you. It seems to work out for me when I start to hit that wall I get a break. That definitely doesnt seem to occur with my friends in consulting or banking. For them it is go go go, consultants really depend on the length of the project and I know people still working on the same project 10 months later and they burned out long ago.



Based on my experience working in Corporate Finance for a Fortune 500, you are spot on with your peaks and valleys statement. At certain times during the year (quarter close, mid year analysis, end of year close, etc.), work weeks probably resemble that of Consulting or Ibanking (80 hrs plus, extra travel, etc.) The nice thing about these jobs as you mentioned is that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, which may not exist in these other functions. It makes it much easier to put in three consecutive 80 hour weeks if you know you will get a month of 45 hour weeks to follow.

I'm curious about the compensation spread of Corp Finance/Gen Mgmt vs Consulting...I agree that it probably tends to be overstated. I always figured similar post-MBA salaries with Consulting getting much larger bonuses.
GMAT Club Bot
Re: So you want great work life balance post MBA [#permalink]
 1   2   3   

Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group | Emoji artwork provided by EmojiOne