Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial

Hi Mike,

There is something I quite don't get in the correct sentence.

As you said, "not every woman" is singular. But then, when it comes to specify the "singular" woman, the sentence use "those". Is it logical to refer back to a singular noun with "those"?

In this one, I did not know if "Not every woman was" was correct or not.
But I find it right in less than 2 minutes.

This was my process:

A. Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer. - Correct

B. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer. - She is not correct because sentence is plural

C. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if they carry a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer. -They is not correct because sentence is singular

D. Not every woman, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer. She is not correct because sentence is plural

E. Not all women, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, considered a serious risk factor for that cancer She is not correct because sentence is plural

The fastest way I found to solve this question is as follow.

A: wants (Singular) carries(Singular) Correct
B: want (plural) carries(Singular) Wrong
C: wants (Singular) carry (Plural) Wrong
D: want (plural) carries(Singular) Wrong
E: want (plural) carries(Singular) Wrong

I hope it helps

Official Explanation

Answer A - In this example, you must make sure that you have proper agreement between both the subject and verb and the pronoun and antecedent. Only (A) contains proper agreement on both counts. In (B) the singular “she” improperly refers back to the plural subject women. In (C) “Not all women…wants” is an error of subject-verb agreement. Likewise in (D), “Not every woman…want” contains a similar error. (E), like (B) improperly uses “she” to refer to “women” Only (A) uses the proper “wants” and “she” to go with the singular subject woman.

Mike ,
Are these 3 sentences correct on GMAT:
1. The GDP of Brazil is larger than those of India and Korea.
2. The GDPs of India and Korea are smaller than that of Brazil.
3. The melting points of most metals are 100 degrees above room temperature, but that of mercury is below 0 degree.

Dear tushain,
My friend, this is subtle. In math, you can make up your own examples of math questions ("would this be right?" questions), and chances are, it will be clean question, focused only on the math about which you intend to ask. Verbal is very different.

For example, the first is fine as a demonstrative example sentence illustrating a grammar point, but that doesn't mean it's ideal as a GMAT sentence. You have to understand, the standards for the GMAT SC are very high --- the sentence has to be grammatically correct, the logic must be flawless, and the topic must be meaningful and interesting. This sentence is too short, too simple, to even begin to qualify as a proper GMAT SC sentence. The grammar is correct in #1 & #2, and yes, the grammar there could appear in a much more complex and meaningful sentence as the correct answer to a SC question. The grammar could appear, but these particular sentences are too short and simple to appear.

The logical construction of the comparison is shaky in #2 --- are we comparing the sum of those in India & Korea to that of Brazil, or are we comparing them separately and independently? Also, "smaller" is not the most natural word --- we need "less" to compare numbers. You see, in trying to ask about grammar, you introduced a number of other problems. One suggestion:
2. The GDP of India, like that of Korea, is less than that of Brazil.
Now, this is grammatically & logically correct, although I don't think it's long and complex enough that we could make a good SC question out of it.

The final sentence is grammatically correct as well, and this is starting to get to a level of length and complexity such that it might quality for a good SC sentence.

It's important to keep two very different things in mind: (a) could the grammar in the sentence appear in a larger sentence on the GMAT? vs. (b) could the sentence itself appear on the GMAT? Certainly for #1 & #3, we could say "yes" to (a), but probably not to (b).

Does all this make sense?
Mike

Mike, "those" in #1 stands for GDP "
"that in #2 stands for GDPs"
"that in #3 stands for melting points "
How is pronoun usage okay? i dont understand

Dear tushain,
The pronouns "this," "that," "these," and "those" are demonstrative pronouns. Their rules are somewhat different from the rules for personal pronouns (he, she, they, etc.) Magoosh has grammar lessons explaining this distinction in detail. I highly recommend joining Magoosh to see those lessons.
Mike

EMPOWERgmatRichC

Isn't 'those who' redundant?

In the following link https://gmatclub.com/forum/in-a-blow-to ... 39698.html it is saying that when those is used as pronoun using 'those who' is redundant.

Consider this way:

Even women who have a strong familial history of breast cancer want to know..

The pronoun "those" can be used to replace "women" (create a new copy of "women") and hence "those who" is alright. However I remember a point discussed in Manhattan SC guide that states that if the antecedent is singular and the new copy of the antecedent is plural, it is required to use the plural noun itself rather than the pronoun "those" (and vice versa), because a plural pronoun cannot refer to a singular antecedent (and vice versa). Hence here the word "women" should have been used.

Note that in option A, the subject is singular (every woman), and hence the verb "wants" is also singular. However the part "even women who...) is a modifier providing additional information about "every woman"- Such reference does not seem logical to me. The correct construction would be:
Not all women, even those who...., want to know.

I saw the question referred to in your link. The use of "those" seems wrong to me (even in OA). Unlike this question, the question you referred uses "those" as a demonstrative adjective, not a pronoun that creates a new copy of an antecedent noun. Hence there should have been a noun after "those" (e.g. those people - otherwise a personal pronoun "them" could be OK, if it were clear who "them" refers to). There is no redundancy issue as such in that question.

Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.



A. Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.

B. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer.

C. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if they carry a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer.

D. Not every woman, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.

E. Not all women, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, considered a serious risk factor for that cancer.


Good question,
subject is every women:singluar
verb is wants:singular
pronoun is she:singular
prepositional phrase: even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer

Option A is correct.

Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.

A. Not every woman, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.

B. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer.

C. Not all women, even those who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, wants to know if they carry a BRCA mutation, which is a serious risk factor for that cancer.

D. Not every woman, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, a serious risk factor for that cancer.

E. Not all women, even the ones who have a strong familial history of breast cancer, want to know if she carries a BRCA mutation, considered a serious risk factor for that cancer.

What is "those" in (A) refer to?

Your query has already been discussed here:
https://gmatclub.com/forum/not-every-wo ... l#p1803789

Just to be more clear…

Theory: ‘Those who’ is correct, if it is clear what ‘those’ refers to.

Would you please help me to find out what does 'those' refer to in the following correct sentences?

While some propose to combat widespread illegal copying of computer programs by attempting to change people's attitudes toward pirating, others suggest reducing software prices to decrease the incentive for pirating, and still others are calling for the prosecution of those who copy software illegally. https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-some-p ... 51395.html

The PTA decided that just as alcohol is discussed in health class to protect those who might actually abuse it, other drugs should also be covered to prevent students from falling prey to addiction. https://gmatclub.com/forum/the-pta-deci ... 21967.html

Those who maintain that technology is negatively rewiring our brains have several common targets: with GPS devices our ability to conceptualize space is eroded, with the Internet’s many hyperlinks we are driven to distraction, and with our smartphones our working memory is impaired when doing something as fundamental as recalling a string of digits. Magoosh, https://gmatclub.com/forum/those-who-ma ... 03263.html

I am confused with the usage of the pronoun 'those' for singular woman. 'Those' is used for plural nouns. By reading the comments on same doubt (by mikemcgarry) I got more confused.
can we use 'those' for collective nouns?
After seeing this question I started doubting my concepts.
Please help.

GMATNinja GMATNinjaTwo

Hi GMATNinja, I was wondering what is "those" referring to in option A? If "every woman" is singular and requires a singular verb, shouldn't "those" be something else instead? Please help! Would greatly appreciate it!

It pains me to say this, but I think the original question is flawed. Many of you have seen this story before, but the GMAT spends between $1500 and $3000 developing every test question, and even the very best test-prep companies can't compete.

In real life, I think the explanation in @mikemcgarry's post above is spot-on, but it seems to me that the GMAT is pretty strict and literal with its pronouns. In every official SC question I can think of, "those" needs to refer to a plural referent that's actually in the sentence. Sure, in real life, it would be completely clear that "those" refers to the plural women that are implied by the phrase "every woman." But I'm deeply skeptical that you'd ever see anything like this on the GMAT.

So please don't lose any sleep over this particular question -- it doesn't seem quite GMAT-like to me.

I hope this helps!