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# Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change

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Manager
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Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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14 Jul 2005, 10:40
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Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.

Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.

According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it

(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical
[Reveal] Spoiler: OA
VP
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21 Jul 2008, 10:20
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I choose E.

x97agarwal wrote:
I always find myself taking longer and performing poorly in these type of CR's. Can anyone offer any advise as to how I may improve in such questions.

Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.

According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses -> this is too specific and is not conveyed by anne's response.anne looks at reva's
argument much more than perspective of a driving licence. -> eliminate

(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program -> drop out rates hardly matter and drop out rates is not the point in the argument,point is that the deviced incentive program meant to change teenargers attitude failed -> eliminate
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years -> out of scope ,it does not matter to anne what parents think
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license -> this is quite close but here REVA does not talk about any positive approach neither does she refute any such .So this does not fully support..
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical-> this is apt here since it relates to the given context.Reva takes a simple example to prove the point that devised incentive program never work but anne refutes her and says [color=#FF00FF]but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful this statement itself proves that anne supports her argument over that of REVA with other examples which are opposite to REVA's.> [/color]correct

Funda in solving CR is just READ READ and READ. actually if we read properly the argument answer is just hidden in the argument.I usually follow pOE ,it sort of works.one should eliminate extreme choices.They are never correct.Also dont use ur own brains anywhere .This i learnt.We need to think in a way author thinks any other info other than the one conveyed by author and is related to argument might lead to mistakes and false assumptions and wrong answer. I still end up doing mistakes anyways just post in the OA for this
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Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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03 Apr 2012, 06:34
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Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it

(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical
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Re: Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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25 Mar 2013, 07:40
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Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical

http://www.urch.com/forums/gmat-critica ... agers.html

http://www.beatthegmat.com/using-extran ... 14415.html

PLs check the links and do not post the OA until u r 100% sure.......

Consider KUdos If my post helps!!!!!!!!!!

Rqst moderators to modify the OA to E

Archit
Magoosh GMAT Instructor
Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Posts: 4132
Re: Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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03 May 2013, 13:28
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Expert's post
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical

fameatop wrote:
Hi Mike, I think both options D & E are equally strong. In fact option A is also a good contender. Can you kindly explain how to evaluate these 3 options. Waiting eagerly for your valuable inputs. Regards, Fame

Fame: first of all, I don't consider this a particularly high quality question. It doesn't strike me as measuring up to the high standards that the GMAT holds on CR questions.

I think a crucial part of this question is the exact wording --- "According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is ..." ----- in other words, it's not enough simply to find a good weakener. Choices (A) & (D) both would be good weakeners in general, but neither is specifically to the content of what Anne says. Anne says zilch about how many West Virginia students have or don't have driver's licenses --- that's 100% unconnected to what she says ---- (A) is right out. Anne explicitly talks about incentives, but we get no clue from what she says whether the incentives she has in mind are positive or negative. We know Reva cites a negative incentive, but Anne apparently doesn't address the issue of whether incentives are positive or negative. It may be that all the incentives she cites are positive, but we have no way of knowing that. That's why (D), though a brilliant tempting answer, is ultimately untenable.

The OA is (E). Anne explicitly compares the results at West Virginia to the results elsewhere --- "many" schools have had good results with incentives. The word "many" implies those school may well be more typical than West Virginia is.

To summarize --- the fact that the question explicitly says "according to Anne" makes it incumbent on us to give her exact words extraordinary attention.

Does all this make sense?
Mike
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15 Jul 2005, 04:19

Ritesh, D is wrong. Let us consider the argument.

Reva's argument can be summed up as follows - she dismisses a methodology (Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school ), and backs it up with an example.

Anne on the other hand, admits that the example is true, but says that there are many instances where the methodology has worked successfully.

She weaken's Reva's argument, by implying that Reva's argument is based on a single example which may not be typical. Thus E

Besides D makes an invalid assumption. None of the two assume a positive incentive.

Hope this helps
Director
Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 853

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15 Jul 2005, 06:43
I will go with D.

Reva says extraneous incentives - a negative incentive like revoking school dropout kid's driving licenses is not effective.
Anne counters this by saying extraneous incentives have improved attendance, which means that the extraneous incentives were positive ones
Senior Manager
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Posts: 373
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15 Jul 2005, 09:40
Picked E.

D - Reva's argument does not assume that positive incentives are more effective, it just states an example bases on negative incentive being ineffective.

HMTG.
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Posts: 5043
Location: Singapore
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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02 Sep 2005, 08:29
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork wonâ€™t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.

Anne: Itâ€™s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.

According to Anne, the weak point in Revaâ€™s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesnâ€™t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentiveâ€”a prize or a rewardâ€”will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical
GMAT Club Legend
Joined: 07 Jul 2004
Posts: 5043
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02 Sep 2005, 10:51
Bhai wrote:
What is wrong with D?

Good question ! I actually picked D myself ! The only reason I can think of why E is better than D, is only because of the direct mention of the west virginia incentive program. D on the other hand, attempts to generalise the argument made by Reva, making it seem like Reva made the conclusion/assumption based on the observations made across several instances, when it actually only involved only one institute. Someone might have a better idea...
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02 Sep 2005, 12:25
E

D can be easily rejected because, it is out of scope of the passage to assume good incentive and bad incentive
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I always find myself taking longer and performing poorly in [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2008, 09:10
I always find myself taking longer and performing poorly in these type of CR's. Can anyone offer any advise as to how I may improve in such questions.

Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.

According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical
Manager
Joined: 10 May 2009
Posts: 65
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change [#permalink]

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24 Jun 2009, 03:39
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical
Director
Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Posts: 542
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24 Jun 2009, 04:48
prinits wrote:
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical

Good question.

A, B, C - Out of scope
D - wrong comparison

E
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24 Jun 2009, 05:26
I'll vote for E.

This argument is a typical example of scope shift. Reva is just talking about "West Virginia", whereas Anne is talking about "many schools". So basically Anne mean to say that a single example is not sufficient to reach the conclusion, hence E.

D is out: The details used in Reva's example, i.e. "for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses...." is not challenged by Anne's argument. Anne has never said that whether the +ve or -ve incentive will work.

Option A, B and C are not relevant.
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25 Jun 2009, 13:17
To me both D and E sound right......
D is logically right.
E is right taking the information purely from the argument.
OMG I am not sure what I would on test day if such questions with 2 possible answers appear....I will try out my luck and pick D.

Manager
Joined: 15 May 2009
Posts: 169

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25 Jun 2009, 17:07
prinits wrote:
Reva: Using extraneous incentives to get teenagers to change their attitude toward school and schoolwork won’t work. Take the program in West Virginia, for instance, where they tried to reduce their dropout rate by revoking the driving licenses of kids who left school. The program failed miserably.
Anne: It’s true that the West Virginia program failed, but many schools have devised incentive programs that have been very successful in improving attendance and reducing discipline problems.
According to Anne, the weak point in Reva’s claim is that it
(A) fails to consider the possibility that the majority of potential dropouts in West Virginia do not have driving licenses
(B) doesn’t provide any exact figures for the dropout rate in West Virginia before and during the program
(C) ignores a substantial body of evidence showing that parents and employers have been using extrinsic incentives with positive results for years
(D) assumes that a positive incentive—a prize or a reward—will be no more effective than a negative incentive, like the revoking of a driving license
(E) is based on a single example, the incentive program in West Virginia, which may not be typical

I would go for E over D as well.

I know the word incentive often has a positive connotation, but if the case brought up by Reva in her argument is also an example of an "incentive program", then we can assume negative "incentives" also count.

Anne never stated whether the other incentive programs she mentioned were "positive" or "negative", so D is outside the scope of the original info.

That leaves us with (E) as a better description of Anne's argument.
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30 Jun 2009, 01:06
i just googled the question and found out the OA to be E.

i think When anna says " Its true that program in virginia failed " leads us to more to E than D.
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30 Jun 2009, 12:01
E is better than D becoz anna didnt talk about positive or negative incentives.

She simply accepted that one programme might have failed, but MANY have been successful ...... without going into the details of what the incentives were.

That is why, E is better
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30 Jun 2009, 12:03
Guys please use the Spoiler tag and post the OA along with the question, at least for Verbal questions.

I'm leaning towards D but the correct answer is E. Anne clearly points out ' while the program in WV failed .. '
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Re: Tricky CR   [#permalink] 30 Jun 2009, 12:03

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