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Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 27 Feb 2014, 11:37
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equator.
POE:
(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on -- HOLD ON
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun -- Changing meaning suggesting sun spots never have been sighted on the surface of sun.
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at -- although sighted : ed modifier modifying dark spots instead of sun spots.
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at -- having been sighted : ing modifier placed after comma unable to modify Sunspots and it having ing modifier is 99% wrong on gmat.
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on --- which modifier error modifying immediate noun surface.
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 27 Feb 2014, 12:01
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My 2 cents :
msln2008 wrote:
Hi e-gmat,

Please can you answer my queries below regarding the above OG question.

1. When compared to sighted at equator, sighted on equator sounds good and I feel we must say sighted on equator and not sighted at equator as equator is not a place like an area in a city. Please can you let me now if my understanding above is correct and can I eliminate an option based solely on this one?

2. Consider the sentence, Sunspots appear on the surface of the sun as dark spots although never sighted at equator. Can I assume sighted is a verb - ed modifier which modifies the previous noun Dark Spots? or the presence of although would restrict sighted as a verb-ed modifier?
Ans: It is very common to get confused with presence of a modifier in subordinate conjunction marker. Even I also struggled initially to understand that we can place modifiers in this way e.g Although sighted at equator, sunspots are blah blah clause; thus, Always check whether it is a clause or a modifier introduced with subordinate conjunction or any transition word. You correctly identified that its an ed modifier not a verb. GOOD !!


3. Consider the below two sentences:
a. Sunspots are visible as dark spots on the surface of the sun but have never been sighted on equator. (X but Y) Correct
b. Sunspots appear on the surface of the sun as dark spots although never sighted at equator. (X although Y). Grammatically right/ Meaning wise wrong
here sighted is modifying dark spots instead of Sunspots. Although is just invisible here focus on only ed modifier and ed modifier modifies preceding noun

In sentence (a) can I say the parallelism rules allow the sunspots to be the subject in both X and Y clauses? Yes
If the answer is yes for the above question I assume then the same holds true for (b) also. Is my understanding correct? No

While attempting this question I felt the construction X but Y is not appropriate (for I think X, but Y is the correct form) and hence eliminated option A and selected C thinking that the "sighted" is acting as verb-ed modifier for dark spots. However, I was wrong. Please could you elaborate your answer for my 3 queries above?

But is a coordinating conjunction; it is one of the FANBOYS
Refer sentence structure and comma : Subject verb1, and Subject verb 2 [ clause 1, and clause 2 ]
Here Subject is common for both verbs no comma required: Subject verb1 and verb2 [ only one clause subject is common]

In option C You correctly identified the ed modifier, but meaning wise it should modify sunspots not dark spots: dark spots is describing how sunspots appear.


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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on --> CORRECT
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun --> on the surface of the sun the sun's poles or equator.. a COMMA is missng here
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at --> SUBJECT is missing here, we have a subordinate clause wo. a subject and actually woa verb too
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at --> SUBJECT is missing here, we have a subordinate clause wo. a subject
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on --> Which modifies the surface -it's not the entended meaning
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 30 Apr 2016, 12:30
skim wrote:
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.


(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun (meaning change - sunspots are visible indeed.)
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 21 Aug 2016, 16:07
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.



Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity,
are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but
have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.

Sunspots are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun (simple present -passive voice)
Sunspots ....but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater. (present perfect -passive voice).....i.e. starting from some point in the past and till now sunsposts have never been sighted
as per the meaning , there is no other way to make these two exactly parallel (i.e. simple present || to simple present ) and thus this parallelism (simple present || to present perfect) is perfectly acceptable . moreover other options are not even close to this option

(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on -correct
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun---change in intended meaning -sunspots have never been sighted not the dark spots
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at-- (simple present- appear made || to simple past-sighted --worse than original ||ism)
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at -(active voice- appear - made ||to passive voice- having been sighted)
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on- which is modifying sun's surface- wrong

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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Responding to a PM:

1. Can you throw some light on sighted on vs sighted at usage in terms of meaning.
"Sighted on" can be used to refer to a surface, a line or a point. "Sighted at" can be used to refer to a location. Since poles / equator can be considered points/line or location, both the usages would be alright.
2. Why although usage is incorrect here in options.
As per the OE, "although" should be used to introduce a clause.
3. Sighted or have been sighted is mentioned as not a complete verb? Why? What does it need more?
"Sighted" is not a complete verb - since the usage is in passive voice, complete forms would be "is sighted", "was sighted" etc.
" Have been sighted" is definitely a complete verb. (passive -present perfect)
4. Is there no difference in between Sunspots visible as dark spots and Sunspots appear as dark spots?
In some cases the meaning can be different:
"Appear" may mean " to become visible" (i.e., something was not visible before, but now it is):
Madonna appeared on the stage.
"Visible" does not imply so:
She was visible because of her bright dress.

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 23 Oct 2016, 05:13
zoezhuyan wrote:
zoezhuyan wrote:
Hi experts,

I totally got the reason why eliminate D.
but I am still curious whether "having been sighted" can be an adjective ?
it might not be the point of this question but it can help me to understand "having" because I am sunk in "having" recently, I have no idea when "having" is correct, when incorrect.

and I have another question
OE wrote:
B) also, without punctuation, the phrase on the surface of the Sun the Sun’s poles or equator is ungrammatical and makes no sense.


It's hard for me to understand , genuinely want your help

thanks a lot
have a nice day
>_~



experts,
HELP PLEASE...

thanks a lot
have a nice day
>_~


As indicated in a response to another post of yours, here as well "having been sighted" is a perfect participle (in passive voice). The base verb is "sight". In passive it would be "to be sighted". The perfect participle is "having been sighted", which indicates a completed action of being sighted. This structure implies that the sighting has been completed.

Your second question is a statement, a correct statement - without comma, the structure makes no sense.

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 23 Oct 2016, 23:15
sayantanc2k wrote:
Your second question is a statement, a correct statement - without comma, the structure makes no sense.

Hi sayantanc2k,

Does it mean add a comma as following,
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun , the Sun’s poles or equator.

it confused me a lot if add comma like this,

so the part after the added comma is noun phrase, right?
in an another word, the surface of the sun is the same as the sun's poles or equator, hm.. feel strange,
that's my confusion and sorry for my implicit previous post.

thanks a lot
have a nice day
>_~

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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zoezhuyan wrote:
Hi experts,

I totally got the reason why eliminate D.
but I am still curious whether "having been sighted" can be an adjective ?
it might not be the point of this question but it can help me to understand "having" because I am sunk in "having" recently, I have no idea when "having" is correct, when incorrect.

and I have another question
OE say: B) also, without punctuation, the phrase on the surface of the Sun the Sun’s poles or equator is ungrammatical and makes no sense.

It's hard for me to understand , genuinely want your help

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Hi sayantanc2k,

Does it mean add a comma as following,
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun , the Sun’s poles or equator.

it confused me a lot if add comma like this,

so the part after the added comma is noun phrase, right?
in an another word, the surface of the sun is the same as the sun's poles or equator, hm.. feel strange,
that's my confusion and sorry for my implicit previous post.

thanks a lot
have a nice day
>_~

Dear zoezhuyan,

I'm happy to respond. :-) I see that my brilliant colleague sayantanc2k already responded, but I will add a little more.

As sayantanc2k, the structure "having been sighted" is a perfect participle. Any participle can act as a noun or verb modifier. Be careful in your terminology, though: just because a participle acts as a noun modifier, we can't call it an "adjective." Technically, when a participle acts as a noun modifier, it is an "adjectival phrase"--that is a phrase that acts as a adjective--but it is not simply an "adjective."

The problem with (D) is the incorrect structure "although" + [participle]. The word "although" is a subordinate conjunction, designed to open a dependent clause: it is designed to have a full bonafide [noun] + [verb] clause after it. A participle cannot take the place of a full clause.

For (B), I think the OE gives only half the story. Part of the problem is that, when we have a list, we need commas: X, Y, or Z. That's one issue, but the deeper problem is the breech in logic. The prompt tells us quite clear: "Sunspots . . . are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun ..." Even if we know absolutely nothing about sunspots, we need to take that as an article of faith: sunspots are dark spots on the surface of the sun.
Given that, (B) makes the incredibly illogical statement: "Sunspots . . . never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun ..."
If sunspots are defined as dark spots on the surface of the sun, that implies that somebody had to see these dark spots on the surface of the sun at some point, and so the statement that they have never been seen on the surface of the Sun flies in the face of fact! That, I would say, is the real problem with (B).

My friend, do not be naive in trusting the OE given in the OG. The GMAT official questions, in the OG and in GMAT Prep, are among the best test questions on the planet: I am simply in awe of their high quality. By contrast, the OE vary wildly: some are good, some are mediocre, some leave out important things, and some every make incorrect statements. Every release questions has been on the GMAT: it had to undergo rigorous testing before appearing on the GMAT, and then it garnered mountains of data while it was on the GMAT. Every question in the OG or on GMAT Prep has hundreds of thousands of data points behind it, supporting its high quality. By contrast, when they wrote the OG, somebody (probably a starving grad student) had to write the explanations; perhaps they were proofread once or twice, but these have undergone absolutely no statistical feedback procedure. I write questions as part of my job. Of the hundreds of questions I have written, only a handful of my very best questions approach the quality of official question. By contrast, I and all the experts on GMAT Club regular give better explanations than those in the OG. Don't be surprised if the OE in the OG doesn't say everything or misses the point. Come here if you want high quality explanations.

My friend, does all this make sense?

Take very good care of yourself, my friend. :-)

Mike :-)
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 30 Apr 2017, 01:26
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.

(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on
--> correct.

(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun
--> "that" wrongly modifies "dark spots"; instead, "that" should modify "Sunspots". "never" should be put between "have" and "been".

(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
--> "as dark spots" should stand as close as possible to "appear". "although" at the and of a sentence like this one must be followed by a CLAUSE.

(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at
--> "although" at the and of a sentence like this one must be followed by a CLAUSE.

(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on
--> "which" wrongly modidies "Sun's surface".
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 14 May 2017, 10:12
skim wrote:
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.

(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on

This is Q14 of the OG 12th ed. (Q9 of the OG 11th ed) However:

1. I don't understand the OE of option (C), in that "sighted is not a complete verb".

2. I don't understand the OE of the top paragraph which states "The adjective visible is a complement and is parallel to the past particle sighted"

Would appreciate any form of explanation. Thanks



A Correct.
B "That have never..." modifies "dark spots", but should modify "sunspots." The "dark spots" have of course been seen before.
C "Although" creates a dependent clause, but this one lacks a verb.
D "Although" creates a dependent clause, but this one lacks a verb.
E "Which" incorrect modifies "surface" (the "surface" isn't the thing that hasn't been "sighted on the Sun's poles or equator."

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 14 May 2017, 12:41
Merged topics. Please, search before posting questions!
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2017, 02:53
Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong electromagnetic activity, are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on the Sun’s poles or equater.

(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on - CORRECT
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun - "that never have been" is a mess.. "never have been" modifies "dark spots", however it should modify "sunspots"
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at - "at" is incorrect, we need an "on".. "dark spots" should be next to "appear"
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at - "never having been sighted at" incorrect.. again not sure if "at" can be used here as "on" has been used earlier "on the surface of the Sun"
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on - "which" must refer to "Sun's surface" & therefore the sentence becomes illogical
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2017, 05:40
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Quote:
C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at

(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at

D) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on


Use of 'although' in C and D: The subordinate conjunction 'although', when used at the end of a sentence can only be in the form of a clause with a full subject and verb and not in the form of phrase or modifier. 'Although never sighted', and 'although never having been sighted'' are not legitimate clauses. So, C and D can be omitted.

However, E is trickier. Even though one can apparently eliminate based on the wrong reference of which' 'to Sun's surface, still there is a strong argument that the relative pronoun indeed refers to the spots only.
According To Ron, E is wrong because that it implies that the same spots that appear on the surface of the Sun have not been sighted on the poles or the equator.

Of course, it understandable that spots do not travel.
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2017, 10:55
I chose option C
appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
But the second part of option C is suspicious .
The second part of the sentence tells a universal fact , but the original sense of the sentence is not a universal fact .
Also what will come at the end of the sentence at or on?
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 21 Jun 2017, 13:34
arvind910619 wrote:
I chose option C
appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
But the second part of option C is suspicious .
The second part of the sentence tells a universal fact , but the original sense of the sentence is not a universal fact .
Also what will come at the end of the sentence at or on?



Hello arvind910619,

I will be glad to help you with this one. :)

Use of although never sighted is incorrect in Choice C. The original sentence says that the Sunspots have not been seen so far on the Sun’s poles or equator. But the way Choice C is worded, it seems to convey that Sunspots never sighted anything on the equator.

Also, use of at is not correct. The preposition on should be used in the context of the sentence as the sentence says that Sunspots are visible on the surface of the Sun, but have not been seen on the Sun's poles.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 01 Jul 2017, 10:52
(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on
Correct. No error

(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun
darkspots
That modifies dark spots which changes the intended meaning. That should refer to sunspots

(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at
although begins a subordinate clause without a subject + correct use is sighted on not at (as if someone sighted them)

(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at
although begins a subordinate clause without a subject. 'Having been' is used when an activity is completed. Here correct use should be have been as till the present day sunspots have not been spotted on the equator.

(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on
which modifies surface and that makes no sense.

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 03 Jul 2017, 05:26
(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on - Correct
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun - Incorrect- dark spots on sun? or Sunspots? Change in meaning!
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at - Incorrect- Subject is needed after although
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at - Incorrect- us of 'never having been' changes the meaning as it seems as if this activity is complete
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on - Incorrect- which refers to surface

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 04 Jul 2017, 03:51
Pratishtha21 wrote:
(A) are visible as dark spots on the surface of the Sun but have never been sighted on - Correct
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun - Incorrect- dark spots on sun? or Sunspots? Change in meaning!
(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at - Incorrect- Subject is needed after although
(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at - Incorrect- us of 'never having been' changes the meaning as it seems as if this activity is complete
(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on - Incorrect- which refers to surface



Thanks for the answeres. I have one more thing to add.
'Appear as' means 'come up' as in, 'the tiny cracks appear as imperfections pon the surface of table'

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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong [#permalink]

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New post 04 Jul 2017, 09:39
Imo A
Lets analyse each answer choice
(B) are visible as dark spots that never have been sighted on the surface of the Sun

This choice changes meaning and leaves some part of the original sentence

(C) appear on the surface of the Sun as dark spots although never sighted at

C seems to suggest that it is a universal truth by using although never sighted at .
But it is case that they have not been sighted at sun's poles or equator , it can in future .That is what the sentence is trying to convey

(D) appear as dark spots on the surface of the Sun, although never having been sighted at

appear as dark spots is not the correct way to express this thought visible as dark spots is much better and wrong use of having

(E) appear as dark spots on the Sun's surface, which have never been sighted on

Same error as D and use of which is ambiguous.
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Re: Sunspots, vortices of gas associated with strong   [#permalink] 04 Jul 2017, 09:39

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