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The health commissioner said that the government had

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 14 Dec 2010, 09:52
anithamajji wrote:
I feel "E" is the correct answer.
The sentence says health commissioner was quoting whatever the govt had said.

So, from the elementary school grammar, when i want to quote something said by others, the origianl senstence remains the same.
Eg : She said "I will not do the homework".

If the above sentence should be written without quotes, we say.

She said that she would not do the homework.

When quotes are removed, simple present/future tense becomes simple past and
simple past will become past perfect.

Same applies here too.

If we are quoting commissioners exact words, sentence will be as below:
The health commissioner said "The govt implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and, despite the recent illnesses, it will try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future"

But if i want to say what the commissioner said, i'll say it as below
The health commissioner said that the govt had implemented and that it would try to prevent


I went for A. But after reading this explanation (very well done) the answer is E.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 14 Dec 2010, 10:05
I chose A too :( Props to anithamajj for the detailed explanation.
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 14 Dec 2010, 11:40
Also chose E.

Says->will
said-> would

perhaps just intuition.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 14 Dec 2010, 19:49
I got - A

But after reading the explanation definetly its 'E'
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 15 Dec 2010, 03:22
E should be correct answer.

This is not a straight indicative sentence. This is indirect form a speech. So according to the grammer rules, when we convert a direct speech into indirect speech-

Past Indefinite changes into Past Perfect
Future always changes to Would

So will is the correct form if the sentence is being present in direct speech but it will change into would when the sentence is being delivered in indirect speech.

Similarly, the Past Perfect tense in first clause represents a Past Indefinite in direct speech.

So (E) is the correct answer.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 15 Dec 2010, 03:30
syog wrote:
E should be correct answer.

This is not a straight indicative sentence. This is indirect form a speech. So according to the grammer rules, when we convert a direct speech into indirect speech-

Past Indefinite changes into Past Perfect
Future always changes to Would

So will is the correct form if the sentence is being present in direct speech but it will change into would when the sentence is being delivered in indirect speech.

Similarly, the Past Perfect tense in first clause represents a Past Indefinite in direct speech.

So (E) is the correct answer.


very good explanation.. thanx...

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jan 2011, 04:20
E! E! E!.. I misread option E and chose A. Sigh!!!
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 30 Jul 2011, 19:50
Prax wrote:
The OA is E.

In the original sentence, the verb "had implemented" is in the past perfect tense, indicating that this event occurred at some point before the commissioner spoke. The verb "will try", however, is in the simple future. When the future is indicated from the point of view of the past, the simple future is not used. Instead, the conditional is required. For example, "The man said that he would buy a new car" is preferable to "The man said that he will buy a new car." We need to find a conditional verb. Moreover, the pronoun "it" begins a new clause and thus requires repetition of "that" in order to make clear, using parallel structure, that this new clause is still something that the commissioner said. For example, "The man said that he would buy a new car and that he would drive it everywhere" is preferable to "The man said that he would buy a new car and he would drive it everywhere."

(A) This choice is incorrect as it repeats the original sentence.

(B) This choice does not offer the conditional "would try", though it does offer another "that". The past tense "tried" is definitely wrong here because the trying will happen "in the future" according to the original sentence. Thus this choice changes the meaning unacceptably.
(C) This choice uses the past perfect tense "had tried" where the conditional "would try" is preferred. An extra "that" is needed to make the two clauses "the government had..." and "it had tried" parallel.

(D) This is a tempting choice as it fixes the verb tense to the conditional "would." However, the tense is technically "conditional perfect" (would have tried), which is not the proper tense. Moreover, an extra "that" is needed to make the two clauses "the government had..." and "it would try" parallel.

(E) CORRECT. This choice provides the plain conditional tense and another "that".


I understand the part that says "that" is needed, BUT I just don't understand why "would have" is wrong. Please please please, somebody help me understand the tense rules for "would have" here. Btw, the above explanation is from MGMAT CAT test, so we can trust the source.

Also, the only right use of "would have" I know is when it is used in "if... then..." condition.
- If I try hard, I will score 750 in GMAT.
- If I tried hard, I would score 750 in GMAT.
- If I had tried hard, I would have scored 750 in GMAT. (hope I don't have to say that in future :p)

Does the above rule have anything to do with the choice (D) here? I can't spot the correlation. Can somebody please help me spot a correlation, if it is there?

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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The health commissioner said that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and, despite the recent illnesses, it will try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

A. it will try

B. that it tried

C. it had tried

D. it would have tried

E. that it would try

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 16 Aug 2011, 13:15
bsaikrishna wrote:
The health commissioner said that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and, despite the recent illnesses, it will try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

A. it will try

B. that it tried

C. it had tried

D. it would have tried

E. that it would try


That the government .......that it would try. would for possibility in the future.
Ans. E
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 16 Aug 2011, 14:10
bsaikrishna wrote:
The health commissioner said that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and, despite the recent illnesses, it will try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

A. it will try
B. that it tried
C. it had tried
D. it would have tried
E. that it would try


1. parallel structure: "said that x........... and that y................."

This eliminates A, C and D

2. Tense: "that it tried" does not fit with the future action stated in the past. Therefore need "that it would try".

Remains E.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 16 Aug 2011, 23:43
I know E is the official answer for the problem, but i am not too convinced with it.

Which of the following sound more correct ?

The health commissioner said [strike]that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and,[/strike] despite the recent illnesses, that it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

OR

The health commissioner said that [strike]the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and,[/strike] despite the recent illnesses, it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future

OR

The health commissioner said [strike]that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food[/strike] and, that despite the recent illnesses, it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 16 Aug 2011, 23:50
crick20002002 wrote:
I know E is the official answer for the problem, but i am not too convinced with it.

Which of the following sound more correct ?

The health commissioner said [strike]that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and,[/strike] despite the recent illnesses, that it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

OR

The health commissioner said that [strike]the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and,[/strike] despite the recent illnesses, it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future

OR

The health commissioner said [strike]that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food[/strike] and, that despite the recent illnesses, it would try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future


What problem do you see with "E"? I'm not able to find any grammatical or meaning error in it. Could you please point out the error or awkwardness?
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 00:12
The point that I can not understand is why we are using "that". What if we dont use it? Are we using it for parallelism?

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 00:20
bsaikrishna wrote:
The health commissioner said that the government had implemented strict measures to eradicate the contaminated food and, despite the recent illnesses, it will try to prevent the outbreak from recurring in the future.

A. it will try

B. that it tried

C. it had tried

D. it would have tried

E. that it would try


This is how I see it:

The health commissioner said:
that
>>>>>the government had implemented strict measures (This happened before the "said" event)
and that
>>>>>it would try to prevent outbreak.(This would happen after the "said" event)

said is past tense AND any claim the govt. made would be from that point onward (thus would)

D is incorrect because "it would have tried" is a hypothetical situation that could have been done. But, the meaning of the sentence conveys that government "will" definitely try to do something, a situation not at all hypothetical.
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 01:05
okk i get your point but then doesnt "dat it WOULD try"...is also hypothetical?

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 01:15
DeeptiM wrote:
okk i get your point but then doesnt "dat it WOULD try"...is also hypothetical?


No, I don't think it is. You/others may correct.

"Government said it would try" means that "the government will try". Note: this is a certain event that will happen in future from the point the claim was made.

"Government said it would have tried" means that government did not try but it would have tried in the past from the point the claim was made. Also, "would have tried" is almost always preceded by a condition that is past perfect; something like:

Government said that it would have tried if it had had any hope of a positive result. (if it had had any hope of a positive result- Condition with past perfect)

"would is used" to convey a non-hypothetical condition from a point in past.

So,
Past perfect->would have->hypothetical
Past tense->would->non-hypothetical
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 01:27
Quote:
The health commissioner said:
that
>>>>>the government had implemented strict measures (This happened before the "said" event)
and that
>>>>>it would try to prevent outbreak.(This would happen after the "said" event)



Where would you fit "despite the recent illnesses" in this?

I think it is distorting the parallelism. In my earlier post I had asked which one of the three versions sounds correct.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 01:33
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crick20002002 wrote:
Quote:
The health commissioner said:
that
>>>>>the government had implemented strict measures (This happened before the "said" event)
and that
>>>>>it would try to prevent outbreak.(This would happen after the "said" event)



Where would you fit "despite the recent illnesses" in this?

I think it is distorting the parallelism. In my earlier post I had asked which one of the three versions sounds correct.

Crick


despite the recent illnesses -- is a prepositional phrase that we can do without. It really doesn't add much to the main clause. Moreover, it is embedded between commas, thus we can continue from what precedes comma to what follows the latter comma.
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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had [#permalink]

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New post 17 Aug 2011, 02:34
despite the recent illnesses , though a prepositional phrase, has some importance as it is part of the statement made by the health commisioner.

But I broadly agree with the underlying concept. Thanks fluke.

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Re: The health commissioner said that the government had   [#permalink] 17 Aug 2011, 02:34

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