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# To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers

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Re: SC: Demographers [#permalink]

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25 May 2011, 10:01
I see the same question posted on the MG blog, the OA is surely D.

http://www.manhattangmat.com/forums/forecast-t7862.html

The source here is quoted as GMATPrep, but I think I remember seeing this question in one of the MGMAT CATs.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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21 Jun 2011, 20:14
OA is definitely D.

But I have a question, and this always bugs me. Shouldn't this sentence be "To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers will(instead of would) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic"?
Isn't would used for hypothetical and will for certainty? Here the demographers certainly need to know a great deal....
Any insight is greatly appreciated.
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Re: SC: Demographers [#permalink]

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20 Sep 2011, 12:47
HOW?!

Rather, OA apart, how do we decide between the
have to vs. would have to split? (Tense split - meaning-wise). Can anyone help me here?
for me the tense is a tie. Mainly because both the meanings seem correct to me.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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30 Dec 2011, 18:57
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To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic determinants of fertility.

A. have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
B. have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
C. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
D. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
E. would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Pls help with the explanation of the correct answer

Last edited by Bibli on 31 Dec 2011, 02:25, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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31 Dec 2011, 02:20
@ Bibli

Even a casual look at the choices will prove E as a wrong choice. There is no need to entertain any doubt about the inappropriate and absurd use of the word economical in the context. Rather, you must evaluate the topic first and eliminate unfit ones.

Secondly, look at the following post.

to-develop-more-accurate-population-forecasts-demographers-54658.html -- 18 posts

It contains at least 18 posts on these topics and there are at least another five posts that run up to another 30 posts . In spite of all these, do you still want a new discussion?. The same thing will hold good for your other posts, which have all been thoroughly discussed in the pages of this forum. Please remember you have to look before you leap and search before you script
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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31 Dec 2011, 02:25
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@Daagh... thanks, i'm not a regular user so your post helped me realize that there's lots already on the forum. This saves me the pain of pasting the Qs.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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13 Feb 2012, 10:38
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devinawilliam83 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic determinants of fertility.

A. have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
B. have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
C. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
D. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
E. would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Had a query.. Am not sure how this compares to the following
- He believed it would work
- He believes it will work

Am i right in saying that since the second statement is in present tense the will work is not conditional.. if yes..why is "would have" in the question posted above right? if B was not ruled out because of "economical" could it be considered as a proper statement?

Ooh... now we're getting deep!

In the "pure" Anglo-Saxon system, the "conditional mood" does not exist because there is no inflected conditional mood. Idem for "future tense." What we call "future tense" and "conditional mood" are actually composed tenses from, respectively, the present and past forms of modal verbs.

However, neither of the two statements you proposed is actually a "conditional" statement. The second simply expresses factual belief about the future ("it will work"); the second refers to a future that is posterior to his belief but may well be anterior to the present moment; this is why we use the past tense form of "will" ("it would work"), also known as past posterior. The expression of his belief does not hinge on any condition.

In the case of this problem, however, we are dealing with a conditional statement, since the development of more accurate forecasts DOES depend on a condition (whether demographers can gather more information).

Whether the "if [present] then [present/future]" qualifies as a hypothetical conditional depends on the perspective and semantics. In this case it is clearly a conditional. The use of the present in the then-clause would make no sense, because while present tense can imply futurity in some cases, here we contrast this futurity to what they know now, so we would need another word (the "will") to "kick" it into the future.

Therefore, in answer to your question, it would not be correct to write: "To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic determinants of fertility." It would be correct to write, "To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers will have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic determinants of fertility."

This does, of course, imply a slightly different angle than does the correct answer D. D suggests that this is idle, parlour game hypothesizing, whereas the sentence I just wrote reads as an instruction or a prescription.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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29 May 2012, 06:56
hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

This is about an expecation ..IF I HAVE TO DO SOMETHNG, THEN I WOULD HAVE TO KNOW SOMETHING..its just plain guess though...if someone case help me understand this...

the first split is AB & CDE..choosing CDE

in CDE economical factors are not correct, its economic detriments... hence D
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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08 Jun 2012, 07:24
1
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hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

i pick D here. this is a conditional sentence. one condition is to be fulfilled to develop more accurate population forecasts that demographers need to know more social and economic detrimental facts of fertility. So A and B are out. "economical" is just wrong here so C is out. in E comparison is not expressed properly. correct me if i am wrong.

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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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10 Feb 2013, 03:13
MGMAT says 'would' is used to express the future from the past's point of view.

Ex- The scientist believes that the machine would be wonderful

The above example is wrong as 'believes' is in present. If believes is replaced by 'believed' the ex becomes correct.

Now can someone explain why would is used here as the tense used in the question is simple present/present perfect.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Feb 2013, 04:34
hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

"they" in D is correct because it parallel with "demographers" . This situation of pronoun ambiguity is acceptable according to gmat standard.

D is pattern of parallelism between main clause and subordinate clause. This kind of paralellism is tested brutally in the question " paris is her home before it it fastionable to be..." which you can search on the internet.

the concept tested here is that kind of parallelism.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Feb 2013, 08:34
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rajathpanta wrote:
MGMAT says 'would' is used to express the future from the past's point of view.

Ex- The scientist believes that the machine would be wonderful

The above example is wrong as 'believes' is in present. If believes is replaced by 'believed' the ex becomes correct.

Now can someone explain why would is used here as the tense used in the question is simple present/present perfect.

Hi rajathpanta,

The scientist believes that the machine would be wonderful --> is incorrect because here we are mixing present with conditional.

Why is this so? because it is a rule. For conditionals there a few rules and you have to just remember them, there is not much to understand here. The rules on Conditionals are governed by set rules. MGMAT has explained the rules quite well, just make a note of them.

Consider this sentence: The scientist said that the machine would be wonderful. --> here "would" is expressing past as it is being used in the reported speech. The sentence is correct as per another rule on the usage of would.

The scientist believed that the machine would be wonderful - Correct usage, "would" expresses future from the past point of view.

Hope that helps,

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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Feb 2013, 08:48
Hi rajathpanta,

Which question you are referring to. The main question of the post or your specific question. If it is your specific question, the please let me know which one.

Vercules
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Feb 2013, 11:12
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Expert's post
rajathpanta wrote:
Vercules wrote:
Hi rajathpanta,

Which question you are referring to. The main question of the post or your specific question. If it is your specific question, the please let me know which one.

Vercules

To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Here, why is would used?? I wanted to understand that as per your explanation given.

Hi rajathpanta,

In my last explanation I did not discuss hypothetical would, but a few rules related to would. I guess that you are confused because you are not able to find any conditional construct in the question above. The hypothetical would is used based on the context of the sentence. In almost all the questions which test standard conditional constructs "if then" constructions are used.

See the below question from OG12 which uses the conditional if x happened, then y would happen.

Q 67) Affording strategic proximity to the Strait of Gibraltar,.......

In the question above hypothetical conditional would is used. The sentence expresses a hypothetical situation, which needs a hypothetical conditional would. But, the incorrect answers are incorrect for different reasons, other than the use of would.

The question does not really test your knowledge on conditionals if you solve it by POC. The following question will also have the correct answer as (D). I have just made a change in option (D) ( "would have to" to "have to")

To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Correct choice is (D) because other options are wrong for clear grammatical and contextual errors; Although, "would have to know" will be better because the hypothetical situation is being discussed

The same conditional is tested in the following OG question;

Q 16) Retail sales rose 0.8 of 1 percent in August,
intensifying expectations that personal spending.....

I hope the above explanation helps,

Vercules
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Feb 2013, 12:15
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rajathpanta wrote:
of if there is a conditional and there are options with 'would' and options without 'would' we should prefer the 'would' ones is what I can gather as of now.

Hi rajathpanta,

From what I have seen in a lot of GMAT questions, I agree with you. In my estimate, I think you will be correct 80% of the times in selecting answer choice with would. Most often than not I have seen that it is relatively easier to do a 3:2 split based on apparent errors, but if you are stuck between two otherwise correct answer choices, which differ in the placement of just a word, then the choice with that word is likely to be the correct one.

Following example from OG12 contains an incorrect "would" option.

Q 39) In 1527 King Henry VIII sought to have his marriage to.......

Option (E) contains a conditional would, but you can get from the meaning that the usage is incorrect.

Vercules
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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31 May 2013, 18:05
hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

Just want to share my thoughts here:
i think the construction would and would have will go here. The only difference is between economic and economical. This eliminates B,C and E. In A the comparison is incorrect. D Wins.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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11 Jun 2013, 01:56
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hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

First split: economical VS economic
*Economical = efficient
*Economic = "money" value
==> Clearly, "economic detriments" is correct ==> B, C, E are out
A is wrong because the intended meaning is: in the future, demographers would have to know .... more than they do now. But in A, "have to know...more than now" is incorrect.

Only D is correct.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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27 Mar 2015, 11:37
hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

One must note a use of 'would' to show uncertainty.

Secondly, one must also note a difference between economic vs. economical.

economic is the subject economics.

economical is cheap/ low price

Hence, option D is a right choice with correct usage of would and economic.
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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28 Aug 2015, 20:37
hbs2012 wrote:
To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic detriments of fertility.

(A) have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
(B) have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(C) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
(D) would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
(E) would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical

Question 32 Set 1

help

if A contain "in the future" so that it parallel to "now" then, A will be correct

if we can use "now" in the second part of comparison but have no corresponding part in the first part such as "in the future" the sentence is not parallel.

we add"they do" to make sentence paralel.

A means

they have to know more than they have to know now.
future time is needed in the first part of sentence
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers [#permalink]

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15 Sep 2016, 01:36
[quote="devinawilliam83"]To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic determinants of fertility.

A. have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economic
The sentence refers to an action in future tense. "would have" correctly reflects the tense than "have"
B. have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
The sentence refers to an action in future tense. "would have" correctly reflects the tense than "have"
"economical" refers to something good value in return,while "economic" is something related to money
C. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economical
"economical" refers to something good value in return,while "economic" is something related to money
D. would have to know a great deal more than they do now about the social and economic
Correct: tense of the sentence is correct. Word "economic" is correctly used
E. would have to know a great deal more than now about the social and economical
"economical" refers to something good value in return,while "economic" is something related to money
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Re: To develop more accurate population forecasts, demographers   [#permalink] 15 Sep 2016, 01:36

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