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# Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate

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Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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10 Jul 2007, 10:37
As the subject states, I'm currently in the process of prepping for applicaitons to several B-schools with an indepth concentration in real estate development and finance. I know HAAS, Wharton, and USC have sub-programs dedicated to real estate development and finance. However, I am not aware of any other schools that offer such depth in their concentrations. Can anyone point me to schools that I may be missing?

I have also considered a masters in real estate finance which USC, Columbia, MIT, and Cornell each offer and are most notably recognized for.

Any advice would be of great help

Cheers!
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 13:40
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A relative of mine actually worked the real estate division at a bulge bracket bank until he retired. His advice when I was looking at schools is the overall image of a school means more than any specialty ranking it may have. You could go to the #1 school in xxx but if its ranked 35th overall then you will be much better off at a top 10 school. This probably is true for most things, yes some specialties like marketing or management may be different but I dont think real estate falls into that since its not a huge post MBA field.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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13 Apr 2008, 15:02
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artshep wrote:
It sounds like you've badly misjudged the relative strength of these programs.

You're way off the mark if you're putting Chicago (or even Kellogg) on a level with Haas or Duke because "Haas is better in terms of quite a few areas". Especially if you're using examples such as non-profit and tech. DePaul has an arguably better entrepreneurship program than many super-elites, does that mean it's a better school? Hardly.

I understand that folks fall in love with the HBS brand (sometimes for good reason), but let's not get ridiculous here and imply that it is leagues above and beyond any other B-school.

Artshep, I'm not sure what your point is, other than trying to slam other Elite MBA colleges. And BTW, MIT has always been a more respected school than BOTH Chicago schools, if you want to talk about general perceptions. I'm surprised your "top 5" does not include them.

Personally, I DON'T CARE what the brand reputation difference between the UE/Elite schools are, just the areas I'm interested in. Otherwise, I would not have chosen to NOT to apply to Chicago, MIT, and HBS. I'm currently debating Kellogg vs Haas only because from all my research with recruiters, alums (from both schools), students, sitting in on classes, etc..., I can NOT see a difference between the two schools in terms of what I want to do. Kellogg is better for Midwest and East Coast placements, and for traditional industries of finance and consulting, while Haas is much better at West Coast placements (what I care about) and tech/entrepreneurship industries. All the top recruiters recruit at both Kellogg and Haas in the traditional industries, so there is almost zero differences there. I don't know much about Chicago other than my initial research last year, but if you put Chicago in the same bin as Kellogg, then I will stand by my statement that Haas is a comparable school to any of the top 5 in terms of the work I want to do, and the quality of the faculty and students are pretty much on par (considering I met almost 10 students who are deciding between Haas and Kellogg this weekend, and many are leaning Haas but will decide after Kellogg's admit weekend next week).

I'm also actually quite disturbed that you're comparing Haas and Duke to schools like DePaul. Just based on your arguments alone I almost suspect that you may be "rankingsgod" in disguise, trying to cause some trouble here. Those types of "dramatics" are not welcomed here.

I also have no interest in arguing with someone regarding which is a "better school", because the fit and culture is more important than any discussions on rankings and strength. Chicago was ranked below Haas a few times on US News, generally a good indicator of "general reputatin" only 5-6 years ago. It may have bumped up because of its strong efforts to improve many programs and the great facility, but that does not mean it's solidly in this "Top 5" that you speak of. People obsessed with believing that the "Top 5" (which is subjective to begin with) is "leagues above and beyond" any other Elite school will only miss out on the complete picture when it comes to school selection.

I also honestly do not believe that Chicago and Kellogg are any more above the Haas/Tuck schools than HBS/Stanford is above the Chicago schools. Just like you, I've been talking to recruiters and alums at companies in the tech industry for general management, strategy, and product management type jobs, and they pretty much said that they don't really see any difference between Haas and any of the UE schools, especially the Chicago ones. The only time they mentioned a difference is with the top level strategy jobs in some bigger companies, they prefer Harvard and Stanford, over ANY other schools. That is why I have mentioned the comments I mentioned.

In the PE field, my MBA friends who are trying to get into those have definitely said the brand name of HBS/Stanford makes it easier to get into than any other school, UE or not. And after attending Haas' admit weekend this weekend, I honestly believe the quality of education and the level of professors at ANY of the top 10 schools, yes, ANY of the TOP 10, are pretty much the same. You won't get a "better" education at Stanford than at Haas, or at Wharton than at Chicago, etc... In the end it's all about the students and the field you want to get into.

Finally, I do not consider this a "healthy debate" when you claim that people who disagree with you are crazy or uninformed. Using phrases I've bolded above ("way off mark", "badly misjudged", and "let's not get ridiculous") do not lead to a friendly discussion, especially when the differences between the top schools are so razor thin. We've all done our homework here, and our views can be colored slightly by whom we talk to, but to imply that your research is definitive compared to others is simply arrogant and irresponsible.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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13 Apr 2008, 18:23
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riverripper, rhyme, or kryzak, I believe that with all the other discussion taking place on this thread, the usefulness of this link may get overlooked:

http://www.usc.edu/schools/sppd/private ... arison.pdf

I think something like this may have a place in the knowledge vault, or another relevant place that it could be bookmarked. As a prospective MBA student interested in real estate, I found the breakdown of top real estate programs as a great resource after researching, applying, and doing all my due diligence on top MBA programs.

If I were starting the application process all over again, I would probably have applied to these 4 programs rather than 5 traditional MBA programs and the one real estate focused program that I did apply to.

When I first started visiting this board, I connected with several people who were interested in real estate, but no one knew of or mentioned the real estate specific programs. I think providing this link to future MBA applicants interested in real estate could be a great resource for those people. This thread will most likely eventually get buried and then next year's applicants will have to start the search all over again.

Since I have been accepted at both the Johnson School and the Program in Real Estate at Cornell, I have had a number of conversations with current students and faculty in both programs. The clear consensus is that the best industry connections come from the real estate specific programs, and that there is also a growing preference among employers to recruit from the real estate specific programs because of the preference and loyalty it shows to the industry.

If any of you can look it over and tell me if you think it's worthy of being added to the collective knowledge, I'd appreciate it. I know it would have saved me a lot of time.
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21 Sep 2007, 08:34
I'm in the same boat. Does anyone know where to find rankings of the top real estate programs? I know US News ranks specializations such as Operations, Marketing, etc, and apparently they used to rank Real Estate concentrations. Where can I find this info?

Haas claims to be consistently ranked in the Top 3 real estate programs. But according to what rankings?

Thanks!
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26 Sep 2007, 13:42
rizzoss669 wrote:
I'm in the same boat. Does anyone know where to find rankings of the top real estate programs? I know US News ranks specializations such as Operations, Marketing, etc, and apparently they used to rank Real Estate concentrations. Where can I find this info?

Haas claims to be consistently ranked in the Top 3 real estate programs. But according to what rankings?

Thanks!

I am also planning to concentrate on real estate. I started this thread a while back, and some people left suggestions:

http://www.gmatclub.com/forum/t51088

From what I've gathered, the top 3 Berkeley is referring to is Columbia, Wharton, and Haas. I've looked at individual programs, and I really liked UNC, Duke, and Vanderbilt as a sort of wild card. They're building a real estate program and if I am accepted/attend, I'd plan on working in Nashville afterward, and they have very good regional placement.

Hope this helps!
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26 Nov 2007, 15:03
Top 3 are:

1. Wharton
2. ?????
3. Wisconsin

I'm planning on going to B school for an MBA in real estate and urban land economics from UW for this reason. Their overall grad program is only like top 40 so I guess it's not on a lot of radars here, but UW has an incredible real estate program.

give them a look. it doesn't hurt that Madison was just ranked the number 1 college sports town in the US and consistently one of the best places to live.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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01 Feb 2008, 17:17
Also check out:

UCLA Anderson
McCombs

-Janet
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 09:48
How can USC Marshall possibly be left off the list???
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 12:02
There's good reason for all those schools, and I think it's worth noting that they all handle separate markets. Although big REITs are often national, a lot of the real estate industry is regionally focused.

USC and UCLA have all the southern California real estate firms, which, living in Oregon, I know are strong up and down the west coast for major developments and innovation. Haas has the Bay Area firms, which I also see a lot of around here.

Wisconsin has the Midwest market, largely to itself, in terms of a strong focus on real estate.

Wharton, Columbia, and Cornell are strong for New England. UNC has a great program for the South.

I was also reading on the BW forums posts from a graduated MBA who works in real estate. He emphasized that it is more important to get in to a great school than a school that emphasizes real estate. Of course, all the above are strong schools, so they should still be strong either way.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 12:18
Quote:
I was also reading on the BW forums posts from a graduated MBA who works in real estate. He emphasized that it is more important to get in to a great school than a school that emphasizes real estate. Of course, all the above are strong schools, so they should still be strong either way.

Do you happen to have a link to this post? I'd love to get in there and read up.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 14:33
That's great insight, river. The Here's the link eschn3am:

I'm not part of the other forums because I get better perspective here, but coming from an HBS grad, I think this is worth a look.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 20:54
riverripper wrote:
A relative of mine actually worked the real estate division at a bulge bracket bank until he retired. His advice when I was looking at schools is the overall image of a school means more than any specialty ranking it may have. You could go to the #1 school in xxx but if its ranked 35th overall then you will be much better off at a top 10 school. This probably is true for most things, yes some specialties like marketing or management may be different but I dont think real estate falls into that since its not a huge post MBA field.

I totally agree with river. The doors a top school will help open are far beyond its perceived "core".

L.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 21:06
Here's a kind of uber-specific scenario question:

Let's say you're going into the family business, and for the sake of argument, let's say that business is real estate. You know you'll eventually be running this company after years of working under the current partners. Would this change your opinion of which school to go for? In your opinion, do you think it'd be better to go to a school with a strong real estate concentration and pick up the rest in the 'real world' or vice versa? Make your connections and learn the general management from a top program and learn the real estate business in the 'real world'?
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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04 Feb 2008, 21:55
eschn3am wrote:
Here's a kind of uber-specific scenario question:

Let's say you're going into the family business, and for the sake of argument, let's say that business is real estate. You know you'll eventually be running this company after years of working under the current partners. Would this change your opinion of which school to go for? In your opinion, do you think it'd be better to go to a school with a strong real estate concentration and pick up the rest in the 'real world' or vice versa? Make your connections and learn the general management from a top program and learn the real estate business in the 'real world'?

In this caselet, I would still choose the Veritas Logo over the Wisconsin one. If you want to specialize in Real Estate, do some Real Estate specific courses before, during (electives) or after the MBA, or learn on the job. The general management aspect, however, is very relevant if you are running the company. Plus you can always benefit from having a wide and deep network.

L.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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05 Feb 2008, 12:02
I do know that a Haas student chose Haas over other schools like Kellogg for Real Estate and is loving the opportunities that the program gives him. Of course, both schools are in the top 10 (or top two clusters), so it doesn't matter so much.

I would add an amendment to what river and lepium said. If you're picking between two UE/E schools (say Kellogg and Haas, HBS and Chicago, Wharton or Duke, etc...), and the lower ranked school is much stronger in the area you want to go into, that's good enough reason to pick the lower ranked school (of course, with all the other "fit" criteria matched too). Beyond the top two tiers, I probably would pick the top 15 schools in case I change majors or try something else.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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05 Feb 2008, 12:53
Kry I think choosing the school of "lesser" standing is not so much a big deal once you are talking elite and above. You will have great opportunities. Yes an UE might give you more but it might not be enough to sway you if you love a school. Also the schools region matters. If you want to stay in Cali then Haas definitely has an advantage. However, if you want to go to Chicago post grad then Kellogg will have a huge advantage. Want to go the East coast, then Kellogg still probably has the advantage but if you want Nevada then Haas might be stronger there.

That said I am still a believe in opportunity cost. Personally I could have applied to some elite schools in R2 and see if I could get a scholarship but I am of the belief that any of the UE will be able to make up the difference between 0 in student loans and 80+K worth. I might be able to work a company to foot the second year so if I manage that then its only really going to be 40+k. Chances of landing a job that pays 10k+ more a year is pretty good at a UE. I know some companies do repay student loans over a period of time too.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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05 Feb 2008, 14:11
good points river. I did consider the salary thing too when I said I'm leaning Haas (other than the location, tech, entrepreneurship, yadda...), is that the average salary they pay (especially for people who go work in tech) is not that much lower (sometimes higher) than the UEs... Other than H/S/W, I think the rest of the UE cluster plus select Elites (Haas, Tuck, Ross, Stern) have very similar pay. I believe that Haas' average is higher than Chicago and Kellogg in BW, and 1K lower in US News (if you include bonuses and stuff). Not big enough a difference to forgo \$40K of scholarships.

But I know what you're saying river, and I think we're definitely agreeing on this one. One good way is to look at each school's employment report, and check how much the average pay is for REAL ESTATE and let that help you with your decisions.
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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19 Feb 2008, 05:08
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Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate [#permalink]

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10 Apr 2008, 20:12
kryzak wrote:
If you're picking between two UE/E schools (say Kellogg and Haas, HBS and Chicago, Wharton or Duke, etc...),

I noticed you had Chicago GSB as merely an "elite" school, on par with Haas and Duke, while Kellogg is given "ultra-elite" status in your post. I suppose that's a cross-town dig?
Re: Top 5 B-schools for Real Estate   [#permalink] 10 Apr 2008, 20:12

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