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VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing

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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 04 May 2016, 05:57
Ok I get your point now. And I maintain my previous answer, yes you can use more than one modifier for a single entity.

However here it has to do with the meaning of the original sentence.

Notice why statement A is wrong? Only because WHICH doesn’t come with it’s own COMMA. "most of them ..." is modifying the 80 massive planets, WHICH is also modifying the same entity. We know that WHICH must always come with a COMMA. However notice how “most of them…” comes with 2 commas, it means that it is non essential and we can get rid of it.

If the sentence read: the 80 massive planets, which xxx… it would have been correct. The way to correct the lack of COMMA before Which is to add an ING form that does not need a COMMA to modify the preceding noun.
The correct answer actually reads: the 80 massive planets circling

Now if you go with B: 1/you have to make "most of them..." essential, 2/and the sentence would somehow have a different meaning:
most of them at least as large as Jupiter and (most of them) circling?
Also I am not sure whether the two are correctly parallel.
Experts?

Now if you go with B: 1- you have to make "most of them..." essential and 2-and the sentence becomes ambiguous

most of them at least as large as Jupiter and (most of them) circling?
also I am not sure whether the two are correctly parallel.

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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 07 Sep 2016, 19:02
Hi Shraddha,Neeti

Could you please explain the which related error that is mentioned in the example for type #2 of verb-ing modifier. Sentence : "In the past several years, astronomers have detected more than 80 massive planets, most of them as large or larger than Jupiter, which circle other stars."

I am still not clear with the logic mentioned
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 10 Feb 2017, 00:18
egmat wrote:
imhimanshu wrote:
Hi Shraddha/Payal,

Could you please help me in understanding the below question

The intricate structure of the compound insect eye, having hundreds of miniature eyes called ommatidia, help explain why scientists have assumed that it evolved independently of the vertebrate eye.

A having hundreds of miniature eyes called ommatidia, help explain why scientists have assumed that it
B having hundreds of miniature eyes that are called ommatidia, helps explain why scientists have assumed that they
C with its hundreds of miniature eyes that are called ommatidia, helps explain scientists' assuming that they
D with its hundreds of miniature eyes called ommatidia, help explain scientists' assuming that it
E with its hundreds of miniature eyes called ommatidia, helps explain why scientists have assumed that it

I know, that the comma + ing should modify the previous clause. Here, we don't have a clause before comma+ing modifier, hence the usage is incorrect, however OG says that the wording suggests that the intricate structure has miniature eyes. Could you please help me out. Also, does comma+ with modifier modifies closest noun or it can modify clause as well.

Thanks
Himanshu


Hi Himanshu,

• The intricate structure of the compound insect eye, having hundreds of miniature eyes called ommatidia, help explain why scientists have assumed that it evolved independently of the vertebrate eye.

It is true that comma + verb-ing modifies the preceding clause. But that happens when comma + verb-ing modifier is placed after a clause. There may be instances where you will see comma + verb-ing modifier is placed after the subject. In that case, the comma + verb-ing modifier modifies the subject.

Grammatically, in this OG 13#7 problem, “having” is modifying the subject “The intricate structure of the compound eye” after which it has been placed. However, this leads to illogical meaning. Now the sentence means that the intricate structure has hundreds of miniature eyes. Hence, we certainly have modifier error here.

Now, study the following OG 13#25 problem,

Neuroscientists, having amassed a wealth of knowledge over the past twenty years about the brain and its development from birth to adulthood, are now drawing solid conclusions about how the human brain grows and how babies acquire language.

In this sentence, usage of “having” is absolutely correct. It is placed after the subject “neuroscientists” and hence correctly modifies that entity. The meaning here is that neuroscientists have amassed a wealth of knowledge… The modification conveys the logical meaning.

Now let’s talk about the comma + with modifiers. So here we are talking about prepositional phrases. “with” modifiers are very versatile modifiers. They can modify either the preceding clause or the preceding nouns. What they modify actually depends on the context of the sentence and the wording of the modifier itself.

• Bihar is India's poorest state, with an annual per capita income of $111.

In this sentence, with modifier actually modifies the preceding noun. With modifier in this sentence has the following sense. Notice how “which has” can be understood to replace “with”.
India’s poorest state, which has an annual per capita income of $111

However, this modifier can be understood to modify the subject of the clause as well because of the nature of the verb - is. This is a linking verb, which establishes the following relationship:
Bihar = India’s poorest state.

Now lets consider a scenario in which “with” modifier modifies the preceding clause. This is a GMATPrep Question. You can find the detailed solution of this question at this link.

Visitors to the park have often looked up into the leafy canopy and seen monkeys sleeping on the branches, with arms and legs hanging like socks on a clothesline.

The comma +with modifier above modifies the preceding clause. In essence this sentence can be written as two separate sentences:

1. Visitors to the park have often looked up into the leafy canopy and seen monkeys sleeping on the branches.
2. Their arms and legs are hung like socks on a clothesline.

So sentence 2 has been converted into with modifier. This modifier extends the thought of the preceding clause by providing a detail supporting it.

Now if the above sounds very complicated, then do not worry about it. As long as you know that these modifiers are versatile and hence can modify preceding clause and preceding nouns, you would be fine. Let the meaning of the sentence guide you. You should understand the meaning of the sentence and ensure that one of these roles fit well.

Hope this helps.
Thanks.


This solution is very important! Thanks a ton!
Finally debunked [,+V-ing] after Phrase. 'Having' was so disturbing until this one.
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 10 Feb 2017, 07:45
egmat wrote:
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Hi Arunima,

Thanks for all your appreciation. I really appreciate it. :-)

Now let’s come back to your doubt.

In the past several years, astronomers have detected more than 80 massive planets, most of them as large or larger than Jupiter, which circle other stars.

The modification of “which” is not the problem in this sentence. “which” in the original sentence modifies “more than 80 massive planets”. This is so because the information that follows the main clause – “most of them as large or larger than Jupiter” – is placed between two commas. This makes this information non-essential for the overall logical meaning of the sentence.

Notice that when we remove this information form the sentence, we also get rid of both the commas, in the beginning and at the end of the non-essential phrase.

In the past several years, astronomers have detected more than 80 massive planets, most of them as large or larger than Jupiter, which circle other stars.

In this case, “which” correctly refers to immediate preceding noun as mentioned above. This sentence is incorrect because the non-essential information is a mix of two idioms which is grammatically incorrect. We cannot write a combination of two idioms.

The correct answer choice corrects that error. Once again notice that both the commas belong to the information that comes between “more than 80 massive planets” and “circling”. The comma before the non-essential phrase is not the part of the main clause that will form “comma + circling”. This is will be a wrong modifier as it will modify the preceding clause. But the comma belong to the phrase that comes in between the main clause and “circling”. This is the reason why the correct answer choice is correct.

Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha


egmat

Hi Shraddha,

This nonessential part concept is so important. Thank you for this explanation. I have somehow missed this very essential point.
I read in VLP about Noun Modifiers modifying slightly faraway noun, but this above solution takes that concept to another level.

Could you please clarify my following understanding:

1. For Noun Modifiers in the form of Which, Who, That, etc, it will modify the Head Noun. If say the prepositional phrase cannot be placed to any other place in the sentence, then 'That', which is say placed after the prepositional phrase, yet That will modify the Head Noun, because the prepositional phrase cannot be placed any other place.

2. As told by you in this above thread, I will proceed to ignore both the commas, if the sentence warrants. So, in above case, 'Which...' would have been correct had the earlier 'as large as' been correct? So there, similar to Noun Modifier Rule, Which will modify Planets.
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 22 Feb 2017, 09:17
Hi Payal
I have a query in this.

<<Furthermore, notice the use of modifier - “circling…” . This modifier modifies the noun entity that precedes it – “more than 80 massive planets”. As we discussed in the sentence structure discussion for choice A, this modifier does not modify the immediately preceding noun "Jupiter". This is a verb-ing modifier that is not separated from the preceding clause by a comma and hence modifies the preceding noun entity. >>

I do not understand this. Answer choice C is "most of them at least as large as Jupiter, circling". Isn't this verbing modifier "circling" seperated by a comma? And if verb-ing modifier is with comma- after clause, it modifies the clause--> so it modifies most of them ie the stars?
Please explain.
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 31 May 2017, 12:31
GmatBawse wrote:
Hi Payal
I have a query in this.

<<Furthermore, notice the use of modifier - “circling…” . This modifier modifies the noun entity that precedes it – “more than 80 massive planets”. As we discussed in the sentence structure discussion for choice A, this modifier does not modify the immediately preceding noun "Jupiter". This is a verb-ing modifier that is not separated from the preceding clause by a comma and hence modifies the preceding noun entity. >>

I do not understand this. Answer choice C is "most of them at least as large as Jupiter, circling". Isn't this verbing modifier "circling" seperated by a comma? And if verb-ing modifier is with comma- after clause, it modifies the clause--> so it modifies most of them ie the stars?
Please explain.



Hello GmatBawse,

Thank you for the query. :-)

Let's take a look at the sentence with the correct answer choice C:

In the past several years, astronomers have detected more than 80 massive planets, most of them at least as large as Jupiter, circling other stars.

Take a look at the modifier most of them at least as large as Jupiter. This noun modifier modifies the preceding noun entity more than 80 massive planets. If you pay close attention to the sentence, you will realize that this modifier is placed between two commas. If we need to remove this modifier from the sentence then we will have to remove the commas that appear before and after the said modifier.

So the comma before circling does NOT belong to circling. It belongs to the modifier most of them at least as large as Jupiter. Hence, the verb-ing modifier circling is a noun modifier and correctly modifies a slightly far away noun more than 80 massive planets.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 31 May 2017, 12:36
ravi19012015 wrote:
Hi Shraddha,

This nonessential part concept is so important. Thank you for this explanation. I have somehow missed this very essential point.
I read in VLP about Noun Modifiers modifying slightly faraway noun, but this above solution takes that concept to another level.

Could you please clarify my following understanding:

1. For Noun Modifiers in the form of Which, Who, That, etc, it will modify the Head Noun. If say the prepositional phrase cannot be placed to any other place in the sentence, then 'That', which is say placed after the prepositional phrase, yet That will modify the Head Noun, because the prepositional phrase cannot be placed any other place.

2. As told by you in this above thread, I will proceed to ignore both the commas, if the sentence warrants. So, in above case, 'Which...' would have been correct had the earlier 'as large as' been correct? So there, similar to Noun Modifier Rule, Which will modify Planets.



Hello ravi19012015,


Thank you for your query. :-)


1. Yes, your understanding is correct.


2. Yes for sure. The original sentence is incorrect not because which refers to the preceding noun Jupiter. The original sentence is incorrect because if the incorrect idiom used in the modifier most of them as large or larger than Jupiter.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing [#permalink]

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New post 09 Aug 2017, 03:19
In the past several years, astronomers have detected more than 80 massive planets, most of them as large or larger than Jupiter, which circle other stars.

The correct answer circling is modifying the object of sentence right? how is that correct
Re: VERB-ING MODIFIERS PART 2 In our first article on verb-ing   [#permalink] 09 Aug 2017, 03:19

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