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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to

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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 09 Oct 2013, 15:22
I chose D), because on E) the 'they' refers to good eating habits, and not the gymnasts/dancers. Is this correct logic?
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 11 Oct 2013, 02:17
'E' doesn't have the word ballet in it. That is the only reason.
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail [#permalink]

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New post 29 Jan 2014, 16:59
Prometoh wrote:
I also have a hard time to choose between D and E.

But in E they seems ambiguous, and pick D.


I don't know to what extent one can say that 'they' in E is ambiguous since it is obvious the habits is not a realistic antecedent. This is getting very weird my friends

In D, I didn't quite like the construction. I think that this is not a very clear question

Just my 2c

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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 14 Jul 2014, 22:07
[quote="izing"]Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

The answer is D. Here, "they" refers to female dancers and gymnasts ambiguously in choice E. However, in choice D, "they" modifies the collective noun "female dancers and gymnasts" and hence there is no ambiguity.


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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 09 Dec 2014, 01:37
D is correct. In E the meaning of the centance is changed: it is wrriten not about " young female ballet dancers" but just about "young female dancers"
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 20 Feb 2016, 17:59
Is it a possibility that we can eliminate E on the basis that in original it is mentioned ballet dancers whereas in E it says dancers...........
Just wondering............
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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 20 Feb 2016, 21:23
mahakmalik wrote:
Is it a possibility that we can eliminate E on the basis that in original it is mentioned ballet dancers whereas in E it says dancers...........
Just wondering............


mahakmalik

The problem with E is that the pronoun they is ambiguous. It could refer either to habits or to dancers and gymnasts.

The omission of the word ballet seems to be inadvertent; in a GMAT test, you would probably not find such omissions.
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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 21 Feb 2016, 20:03
I don't really see a meaningful difference btw. D and E. Substitute "eating habits" for 'they' and the sentence clearly becomes absurd. It's pretty obvious that they refers back to ballet dancers and gymnasts.

Here's an example to illustrate my point: The Mavericks told the Celtics that they would win. This sentence is incorrect because we don't know whether 'they' refers to Mavericks or to Celtics, either of which would be sensible in this sentence. Now, if I used another example - The Mavericks practice fundamentals because they know that doing so is essential to win - it's pretty obvious that 'they' can only mean the Mavericks. 'Fundamentals know that doing so is essential to win' is an illogical meaning. The fact that 'they' is closer to 'fundamentals' and not to 'Mavericks' in this sentence doesn't create any confusion. I think the same logic applies to this SC question.
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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 22 Feb 2016, 04:36
bass31 wrote:
I don't really see a meaningful difference btw. D and E. Substitute "eating habits" for 'they' and the sentence clearly becomes absurd. It's pretty obvious that they refers back to ballet dancers and gymnasts.

Here's an example to illustrate my point: The Mavericks told the Celtics that they would win. This sentence is incorrect because we don't know whether 'they' refers to Mavericks or to Celtics, either of which would be sensible in this sentence. Now, if I used another example - The Mavericks practice fundamentals because they know that doing so is essential to win - it's pretty obvious that 'they' can only mean the Mavericks. 'Fundamentals know that doing so is essential to win' is an illogical meaning. The fact that 'they' is closer to 'fundamentals' and not to 'Mavericks' in this sentence doesn't create any confusion. I think the same logic applies to this SC question.


I agree with your point to an extent, but the writer of this problem eliminates answer E stating the same reason I mentioned earlier, that the pronoun is ambiguous. Moreover we have seen some examples from the official guide, in which although the antecedent for a pronoun is very clear from the context of meaning, the usage has not been allowed because of existence of another possible antecedent, even though that other antecedent would give rise to an absurd meaning to the sentence.

However there are examples that support your view as well... that an answer has been accepted although there are two antecedents of which only one is meaningful !!

Considering your point, I would say that we should eliminate an answer on the basis of pronoun ambiguity - when one of the antecedents give rise to an absurd meaning - only as a last resort. When we are stuck between two answers and none of them can be eliminated on the basis of grammar or more obvious meaning problem, we would use this ambiguity to eliminate one of them.
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 11 Apr 2016, 19:22
I think this logic is not good for studying. E is logically right in which they clearly refer to athletics. It can not refer to eating habits because it is not logical. Noun must be logic one. please experts help.
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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 18 Apr 2016, 01:25
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

[b]In option E) the word ballet is absent and this changes the meaning. We always have to stick to the meaning, which the original sentence conveys [/b]
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 19 Apr 2016, 10:03
gmantri18 wrote:
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

[b]In option E) the word ballet is absent and this changes the meaning. We always have to stick to the meaning, which the original sentence conveys [/b]


That seems to be a typo. It is very unlikely that one would intentionally incorporate such an error in the answer. The above discussion ignores the fact that "ballet" is missing from option E.

In that case, both D and E would be correct. The reason for eliminating E that the author of the question stated , that the pronoun "they" is ambiguous, may not be sufficient enough to eliminate the answer. Such pronoun usages have been accepted in some instances in GMAT.
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 21 Apr 2016, 19:13
sayantanc2k wrote:
gmantri18 wrote:
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

[b]In option E) the word ballet is absent and this changes the meaning. We always have to stick to the meaning, which the original sentence conveys [/b]


That seems to be a typo. It is very unlikely that one would intentionally incorporate such an error in the answer. The above discussion ignores the fact that "ballet" is missing from option E.

In that case, both D and E would be correct. The reason for eliminating E that the author of the question stated , that the pronoun "they" is ambiguous, may not be sufficient enough to eliminate the answer. Such pronoun usages have been accepted in some instances in GMAT.


okay, thanks. just one last question, between which two is the ambiguity in option E ? The good eating habits and young dancers & gymnasts ??

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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 22 Apr 2016, 08:38
gmantri18 wrote:
sayantanc2k wrote:
gmantri18 wrote:
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

[b]In option E) the word ballet is absent and this changes the meaning. We always have to stick to the meaning, which the original sentence conveys [/b]


That seems to be a typo. It is very unlikely that one would intentionally incorporate such an error in the answer. The above discussion ignores the fact that "ballet" is missing from option E.

In that case, both D and E would be correct. The reason for eliminating E that the author of the question stated , that the pronoun "they" is ambiguous, may not be sufficient enough to eliminate the answer. Such pronoun usages have been accepted in some instances in GMAT.


okay, thanks. just one last question, between which two is the ambiguity in option E ? The good eating habits and young dancers & gymnasts ??

780 in GMAT...holly **** !! tumi to fatiye diyecho dada :wink:


Yes, "good eating habits" and "young dancers & gymnasts" are the two antecedents the pronoun "they" could refer to - nonetheless, this would probably not be considered ambiguous - "they", being subject of a clause clearly refers to the subject (" Young dancers and gymnasts") of another clause in the sentence (by virtue of parallelism).

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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 03 May 2016, 01:49
E says Young female dancers ... instead of Young female ballet dancers ...
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 05 May 2016, 06:55
aparajita123 wrote:
E says Young female dancers ... instead of Young female ballet dancers ...


We have discussed this in a previous post in this thread:

young-female-ballet-dancers-and-gymnasts-sometimes-fail-to-82988-60.html#p1674510
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 07 Jun 2016, 09:09
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.[/u]

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

Dear Experts.

How "they" in option E is ambiguous?

IMO it clearly refers to Young female dancers and gymnasts. "They" cannot refer to "good eating habits", logically it doesn't makes sense to say

good eating habits desire to be as thin as possible!

Please advise
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 08 Jun 2016, 11:28
smartguy595 wrote:
Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.[/u]

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.

Dear Experts.

How "they" in option E is ambiguous?

IMO it clearly refers to Young female dancers and gymnasts. "They" cannot refer to "good eating habits", logically it doesn't makes sense to say

good eating habits desire to be as thin as possible!

Please advise


I agree with you. Moreover, the following may be noted (from a previous post of mine on this thread):

Although "good eating habits" and "young dancers & gymnasts" are the two antecedents the pronoun "they" could refer to, this construction would generally not be considered ambiguous - "they", being subject of a clause clearly refers to the subject (" Young dancers and gymnasts") of another clause in the sentence (by virtue of parallelism).

Nonetheless, D does not have even this slightest provision of argument and is thus better than E. ( This is not at all a solid argument to eliminate E - in GMAT such elimination is not expected).
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Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 08 Jun 2016, 12:06
Here are my explanations, please comment whether you agree or not ;) thanks !!

Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.

(A) Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits caused by the desire to be as thin as possible.
"Caused by" modifies noun : "good eating habits", so incorrect meaning.

(B) Good eating habits sometimes fail to be maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts caused by desiring to be as thin as possible.
Passive form, not correct

(C) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, good eating habits are sometimes not maintained by young female ballet dancers and gymnasts.
Modification problem. An opening modifier should be followed by the subject of the clause

(D) Because they desire to be as thin as possible, young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits.
OK

(E) Young female dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to maintain good eating habits because they desire to be as thin as possible.
The antecedent of "they" is not clear : habits or dancers and gymnasts ?
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Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to [#permalink]

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New post 19 Aug 2016, 17:47
Although I thought both D & E are correct, i chose E :(

However, in hindsight, I think D is correct because the modifier "because they desire to be as thin as possible" is closer to what it modifies.
Re: Young female ballet dancers and gymnasts sometimes fail to   [#permalink] 19 Aug 2016, 17:47

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