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solidcolor
Thanks. Interesting post.

However, for the sake of PRACTICING, I would really want to know, ow many WRONG ANSWERS are allowed if I am targeting 700, for example?

I wonder how people could tell they scored V43 Q47, blah blah...

What I knew from trial tests (paper based) was, for example, I got 31/37 right answers for Quant, 31/41 right answers for Verbal.

How should I estimate my "level"?


I know that everyone claims "there is no answer" for "how many" you should get right when practicing. I've been struggling with the same issue and have, in fact, posted a very similar question earlier on this forum to no avail. Through the study/practice process and scouring this forum once in a while, I did come up with a "methodology" of sorts that should help you target and tune your practice sessions to your target score. In retrospect, the approach is reminiscent of how the software attempts to zoom in on your score.

The key here is question difficulty. On the GMAT, not all questions are created equal, and so, your practice of "typical % correct" must also include a dimension of difficulty. The OG makes this possible since the questions in those books are sorted, roughly, by difficulty (from easiest to hardest).

Here's a method I used to target 700 in practice...

Divie up the questions in PS and DS into quartiles (1/4ths). The first quartile is rated "upto 500", the second "upto 600", the third "upto 700", and the last "upto 800". When practicing, you should be able to get over 90-95% correct consistently on the first 3 quartiles to get close to or break a 700. That's it. More specifically, I'd say 100% on the first, 95% on the second, and 90% on the third. If you can do this, you can be assured that the CAT will tempt you with 800 level questions and, by virtue of probability alone, you will get one of them right... that should counteract the one or two you get wrong on the 700 or 600 level. A higher percentage of correct on the highest quartile, assuming a stellar performance on the lower questions, should bump your score above 700.

This is in line with the standard GMAT study approach of:

I. Fundamentals. [up to 600]
II. Consistency. [up to 700]
III. Challenging math. [700+]

In other words, if you know the stuff but are as careless as a, to quote from above, a retarded monkey, you should hit ~600. If you know your stuff and know the difference between + and - (unlike yours truly, for instance), you should be able to rub elbows with 700. If you can do all this and carry a big heavy math whooping stick for those tough 800-level quants, you will likely join the ranks of the fine 700 club members. (oh wait... there's verbal too?! ;))

In summation...
1. consistent 10/10 on the first 50% of OG
2. consistent 9/10 on the 50-75% of OG
3. and *some* number of the last 25% of OG
...is a recipe for GMAT [quant] success.

Hope this helps.
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For test takers who don't miss any questions in the early going, since they will consistently receive hard questions (which probably take longer to solve), won't they be more pressed for time than those who are receiving slightly easier questions? Just wondering how GMAC takes this into account, since it obviously doesn't make any sense to miss questions on purpose just so that you'll get easier questions in the future and not run out of time hahah

I'm going to take a stab at this based on my meager experiences with the GMAT, GMATprep, and OG.

My thought on this is that pretty much all of the questions you will find on the GMAT can easily be solved in 2 minutes, or max 2.5 minutes - but that is once you realize HOW to solve it. The tricksy thing with advanced level questions (and i'm talking about quant here) is that they are written in a more devious manner. For example they might incorporate multiple topics or subject matters, they will have more traps, and word problems will be harder to 'decode' so to speak. The actual calculations are generally no more difficult than lower level questions, but figuring out how to solve the problem and separating out the different parts of the problem is what makes them tougher. The main thing is that you have to be learn to just wing it when you see a problem that doesn't look familiar, and that takes practice - especially for someone like me who doesn't have a strong quantitative background.

The other key thing is that you have to be very effective in managing your time. I said all problems can be solved in around 2 minutes, but it is VERY easy to sit there going in circles around a problem you don't understand. Its natural to want to get every question right, but in a case like that you HAVE to make a guess. Take a stab or two at the question, if you still don't get it, eliminate any answer choices you can and make a guess. So if after about a minute, you aren't sure that you're on track to come up with the right answer, move on because it isn't worth it to waste more time at the risk of sacrificing questions you do know how to answer.
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Does anyone else want to share their insights into test design?
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A similar study of Executive MBA programs has revealed that the median correlation between first year MBA GPA and GMAT score was 0.49. The correlation between undergrad grades and first year MBA was only .22.

The GMAT V score alone had a correlation of 0.38 while the Q score alone had a correlation of 0.44. Even the often marginalized AWA score had a correlation similar to that of the undergrad grades (.22).

What might be the most interesting revelation of this study is the limited predictive value of some other variables. For instance, the number of year of work experience had virtually no association with academic success (correlation of -.02) while entering base salary was extremely weak (correlation of .09).

While it is important to stress that these data are for EMBA programs, it is intriguing how the other variables have even less predictive power than the AWA alone!


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Some interesting insights into changes in test scores-
It appears that in both nominal scores and percentiles the lower edge of the GMAT distrubtion have increased greatly over the past twenty years. In the late 1970s and early 1980s some of the most selective schools still enrolled at least 10% of their students with scores near average. Not surprisingly, the difference between the score of the 90th percentile and 10th percentile matriculant has decreased considerably as well.


Duke early 80s had a 10th percentile of 500 whereas in the early 2000s it was about 650. Thus, the lower edge a Duke went from about average to considerably above average in 20 years. Likewise, the center of the distribution increased about 150 points from 550 to 700.

Columbia had a difference of 180 points in the early 1980s from the 90th to the 10th. Twenty years later the spread was only some 90 points.

Yale had a difference of 180 that has since fallen to about 100.
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Is anybody still reading this thread? Is it still useful?
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My Take on issue...
-------------------------

let’s face it, after MBA, or even before it, we strive for visibility and control of situation and GMAT CAT exactly deprive us from these.

The mysterious algorithm will give you some number and ask you to trust it. You really can not question! You have no idea how many question were correct and where did you mess up etc etc.. So, What if algorithm messes up —My first for example GMATPrep has question which was incorrect!, and off course having spent last 6 years in Hi-Tech industry and writing few of algorithm myself, I know that algorithms are written by human and prone to bugs.

So what my really point, situation at hand is that there is a computer game and we need to play against it and off course try to score as much as possible, or bluntly speaking ‘beat it’. But challenge is we really don’t know whom we are playing again and we only partially have some idea of rules, not substantial enough.

So what can we do, lets do what we engineers normally do, reverse engineer the algorithm, lets run through some pattern reorganization of our own and try to fine out more about this Beast, that we are really up against.

And only way to do this is to collectively take a aim at the algorithm, our buddy Hubby have done lot of efforts in it, but lets everyone spend some time to get more data points (Score details) I will volunteer to manage Excel sheet of all available data point and I hope we will have enough of that to conclude something objectively.
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Please read this before asking "How many questions can I get wrong before I get a X score on the GMAT" or "is the first 10 questions more important than the later ones?"

our illustrious rhyme has written this dissertation on the algorithms. Based on the little I know, I think he's got it on the spot. So read on and just focus your test time on doing your best, double checking your answers, and moving on. Any second-guessing the system will only hurt you instead of help you.

Kryzak

Quote:
This is a fundamental misunderstanding to how adaptive tests work.

The first few questions do not count more than the last few.

The number you get wrong is meaningless. You could get 15 wrong and score 700, it wouldn't matter (there will be some upper limit .. at some point you have to get something right to score well)

Its WHICH questions you get wrong that matter.

I wish I could find my post from ages ago that describes how this works in detail, unfortunately I can't.

Oh wait... here it is...

The super short version: There is a bell curve. The system figures out where you sit on it. In 37 questions, you can't "fool it".

The longer version: Here it is in a nutshell.. The GMAT develops a confidence interval around your score. In the beginning this score is wide - say, 500 to 600, as you answer questions, two things happen - one, it tightens the band (550 to 575 say) and it changes the actual estimate (say 571). (Think raw scores if you want) Eventually it tries to get to a point where the probability of getting a question right is .5 - that is your "estimated ability" is precisely in the middle of a standard normal curve, and around that is a very narrow band - a confidence interval of your score (the variance decreases, think basic stats.. Few numbers with large ranges vs lots of data points with trending singularity - variance decreases over time with each q answered).

The bottom line is this: whether or not you get the first question right or wrong doesn't matter because by the time you get to 37, it will have "snuffed" you out. Moreover, how many questions you get right doesn't matter either (again, within reason, if you get all 37 wrong then yea, it matters) - its WHICH questions you get right. This is the critical thing to remember - its not whether or not you get one right ... its whether or not you got one with P < .5 right. Getting a "600" level question right (where for you p(correct) = .5)) is not the same as getting a "700" level question right.

Put it this way. I could get every single question at 600 right and NEVER get a 700 question right. No matter whether I end up getting 20 questions right and 10 700 questions wrong, my score isn't going to get to 700. Similarly, I could get 29 questions right, and 1 question wrong - if that question I got wrong was a 700 score question, I'm not getting a 700.

Make sense? Think about a bell curve that keeps getting tighter... So where was I ? Oh yea... Moreover, the software is using a bell curve, not a retarded monkey, to figure out your score. So getting one wrong doesn't decrease your score by 20 points and getting one right increase it by 20. If it did, it would be very very easy to figure out your score (see later how Kaplan and others make this insanely stupid assumption in their materials). What happens of course is that it takes an amalgamation of data points to determine the move in your score - your previous responses, the level of difficulty of that particular question, the confidence interval and variance expected around your "True" ability, the probability estimate for your true ability at a given question etc... All of this helps it decide how far to move your score up and down....

But the key to realize here - and this is the key - is that the band of scores you get continues to get TIGHTER AND TIGHTER with every question - while it keeps shifting up and down trying to gather data. Fundamentally, after 37 questions its shifted a bunch and the band has become narrow. Whether or not you got the first question right or wrong really doesnt matter.

Now for more detail:

Imagine each question with a bell curve of correct answers based on your true ability level. That is, each question has a known difficulty level. There is an expected number of right answers for people with true ability level of X and a percent of expected correct answers at Y.

I'm going to steal graphs from another site to make the point.

https://img485.imageshack.us/img485/5043/j225a322tn.jpg

In this graph, based on my previous response, the probability of getting this right is roughly 80% at this particular skill level. Ignore the bottom numers OK? Those aren't supposed to be a gmat score specifically. Think of "500" as ability level 3. Maybe a 600 is ability level 3.42.

As I answer a question the system figures out my "true" ability level estimate. This is based on the bell curves of the questions I got right and the inverse of the questions I got wrong.

So, lets say my true ability level is "4.0", an the GMAT ranks ability levels from 0 to 5. It'll hand me an ability level question of 2.5 to start, to guage my true ability.

At this point, the GMAT will do a few things:

1) It will update my ability estimate based on my answer.
2) It will determine the confidence interval for this ability estimate


So maybe we start out here: https://img485.imageshack.us/img485/9021/j225a338sk.jpg

But then we end up here: https://img140.imageshack.us/img140/9544/j471a135cp.jpg

The black line is my current estimated ability, the red my true ability and the yellow banded area is a confidence
interval.

As I answer questions, the estimated ability level comes towards the true level:

https://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3223/j471a233yx.jpg

But how does it decide what to show me?

https://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3191/j471a219dn.jpg

As I answer questions, the software uses its current estimate of your score by evaluating questions avaliable around that band and selects the one most appropriate.

As we keep doing this the confidence interval will continue to move - tighter and tighter.

Until eventually, the interval decreases:

https://img140.imageshack.us/img140/5456/j471a738yb.jpg

This is basically how the GMAT works, though from what I understand it comes to it's true ability estimate by meshing the curves as well, so the intervals get very small by the 37th question.

This doesnt mean the first questions are worth more... it means you are more likely to get an overly difficult or overly easy problem in the first ten questions because the band in which - the confidence interval of questions to pick from - is still wide... but the way it changes its own estimates will depend on the questions you get but they do NOT impact your score more than other questions.

The reason people seem to think this is because they sway more, so if you get a really easy one wrong early on, it might give you a really really question and set your ability level low, but this is only temporary as BY DEFINITION, the exam's purpose is to narrow that band to your natural ability.

By definition the exam is going to continue to give you questions to get your probability level to .5 on each question - this will give a nice confidence band and a good indication of you true ability.

Kaplan and Princeton all argue the first few questions argue more. The whole premise of their argument lies in the ridiculously simplified concept of a graph that looks like this:

https://img149.imageshack.us/img149/5439 ... ive1uh.gif

This, however makes NO SENSE. The sap getting hard questions right would quickly see his score increase, yes, but would very quickly hit a probability of .5, in which case he would flatten out. The person who saw their score decrease, would, of course get an easier question on #2, but based on their true ability, they would also be increased on subsequent correction questions - each question modifies the software's estimate of your true ability. The probabiliy of getting an easier question goes up, but so does the p that it is answered correctly..

In fact, if you really want to get into it....

One can just as equally argue that, in the begining the software is wildly guessing - and lets say that you just get lucky and get 5 really Oops hard questions right. The software has 32 more questions to find your true ability. It will. If on the other hand, you END WITH 5 extremely hard questions that you get right, the software may have found your true ability by question 32 - in which the 5 you randomly got correct by luck, have increased your overall score. Woot!

But do you see it? It goes the other way too...

Lets say you get hte first 10 right. The machine thinks you are a 750er. You think it wont adjust that by the time you get to question 37? Now think. What happens if you get the first 10 right, and the last 10 wrong? By then, its narrowed your estimated ability yes, but with each incorrect answer (after the first), you begin to widen that band again - and the software will readjust your true ability estimate downwards. The confidence levels will remain tight but your overall score has still decreased just as if you ahd taken the first 10 and gotten them wrong.

The only difference here is whether the questions sets become exhausted or less than ideal at a given level - unlikely as hell on the gmat - but even if the software is forced to give you less than p=.5 q's, it would still effectively continue to drop your score approriately - and proportionally.

In other words,

Question 1 is just as important as question 37.
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I believe you will get the worst score when you do consecutive mistakes(it could be anywhere in 1-37 or in 1-41)
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Guys, in the GMAT, are the first 10 questions more important than the others? I remember taking a Princeton sessio last year where they said so but Manhattan GMAT says this is not the case. Any ideas?

I just took a practice GMAT from the practice tests mba.com sends out and I noticed that even though I got 15 wrong on the math section and only 5 wrong on the verbal section, my math overall score was higher. heres te breakdown of which questions I got wrong:

math:
9,14,18,20,22,26,28,29,30,31,33,34,35,36,37
overall math score: 46

verbal:
3,14,24,28,41
overall verbal score: 42

the only thing i can think of is that because i got an early questio wrong in verbal that really hurt me.

any thoughts? thanks!
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Some readers might question what to do with test takers who do not finish a section. Suppose that there are 36 questions in each section that contribute to the final score (we have eliminated any validation questions). Suppose that test taker performs perfectly on the first 18 questions but runs out of time. Should this student get a perfect score for having missed none of the questions she attempted? No, this would seem to benefit this student and penalize other students who rationed their time to answer all 36 questions. One way to correct this problem is to adjust each student's raw score by the proportion of questions she answered. Thus, we would cut this student's raw score in half since she only finished half of the section. Of course, cutting the raw score in half would not necessarily cut the scaled score in half.

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Did anyone find this overview helpful?
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Hey Hjort, I did find your review helpful :) . However, I do not have any insights into it yet. Maybe soon enough...
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Another important issue for adapative and pencil-paper examinations is the apparent variability of scores. Suppose two students receive a 500 each the first time they take the exam. Student A then receives a 520 on the second exam and sees this score as proof that her study techniques are working. Student B takes the exam again and scores 480 and thus believes that his study techniques are actually causing his skills to decrease. Unfortunately, all of these scores are consistent with the two students having a true score of about 500. Since the SEM is nearly 30 points, we would expect about two thirds of students to receive scores within 30 points of their true score on any given administration of the test. Thus, it would not be a great surprise for a student to take the GMAT on Saturday and receive a 570 and then receive a 600 the next Monday. Indeed, given a large number of test takers, we should not be surprised to see several students with observed scores 50 or more points above their true score.

Many of the impressive claims made by "test preparation" companies do not fare well when one considers the impact of the inherent variability of observed scores.

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Hjort's Empirical Score Estimator

(Vscaled score + Q scaled score)*7.35 + 70.3; (ROUND, -1)

This estimator is best suited for the 620-720 or so range which is probably of greatest interest to test takers here.

This predictor is purely empirical, it should not be construed as the product of theoretical derivation.

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By chance i happened to check these posts today only. Interesting findings. I would like to know how these studies were formulated. Are you referring to a simple regression on Grades versus say GMAT score? What were the partial regression coefficients. Were they significant?
What was the goodness of fit when you used all the variables - GMAT score, AWA, Grades, Work experience and salary.

I also had a feeling that work experience might infact have a negative correlation with Grades....
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All good questions regarding the admissions validity studies. I have only been able to read very brief summaries of these studies so I cannot comment on them in any detail. They appear to be based on simple regressions. Further, the overall goodness of fit for the multiple regression model is probably not great (but still pretty good when compared to other variables used to predict academic success).

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