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Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier?

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MABE
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Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 11:55
Hey,

Im a norwegian citizen with a MSc in Political Economy from an ok university in Norway (top 65 european business schools). I would, as many, like to do the ultimate test of getting into a top-tier business school in the US. I do however only bring good grades (not great, like in the 5 %), with an average that could be compared to somewhere around 3,2-3,4 if I have understood the american grading system correctly.

Yet, it has struck me that the top business schools tend to include students with lower grades and also with GMAT scores all the way down to 600 (incl Harvard, Stanford and Wharton)! At the same time, most universities market themselves as highly international with X various nationalities. Is it then so that some of these students having lower than average grades (GPA or GMAT) are foreigners the universities accept to create a greater diversity among the candidates - or something in that direction? Is it so that, if there are no other, or poor norwegians (or scandinavias for that matter) applying for these universities, might the threshold for me being accepted be lower for say an american citizen?

Cheers!
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   Updated on: 24 Jan 2013, 16:39
Low GPA and/or GMAT for top tier, and especially for HBS, are almost always offset by being a superstar on some other part of the application. Also, I don't think the allowances for lower GPA/GMAT acceptances are isolated by Geography. Adcoms don't breakdown the acceptances by:

HiGPAandGMAT/USA
HiGPAorGMAT/USA
LoGPAandGMAT/USA

HiGPAandGMAT/Europe
HiGPAorGMAT/Europe
LoGPAandGMAT/Europe

HiGPAandGMAT/Asia
HiGPAorGMAT/Asia
LoGPAandGMAT/Asia


If you are a LoGPAandGMAT candidate, you are probably competing with applicants from all regions. I don't see the need to place applicants in buckets like this.

Originally posted by jontron on 24 Jan 2013, 12:34.
Last edited by jontron on 24 Jan 2013, 16:39, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 12:38
keeping other factors constant (which you never can) a candidate from an under-represented pool might have an easier pass. Schools want to play their diversity card and bring in people with a wide variety of life/work experiences.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 13:08
MABE wrote:
Is it then so that some of these students having lower than average grades (GPA or GMAT) are foreigners the universities accept to create a greater diversity among the candidates - or something in that direction? Is it so that, if there are no other, or poor norwegians (or scandinavias for that matter) applying for these universities, might the threshold for me being accepted be lower for say an american citizen?



Generally speaking, having a stellar profile and career achievements will off set a low GPA or GMAT. If being from an underrepresented country is what makes you "unique" then it's probably not going to be good enough. While schools like to have a diverse class, and nationality is definitely one of the categories, they won't sacrafice quality and standards just to have the token guy from country X attend.

Keep in mind, Bschools want to admit people who will contribute to the community, thrive in the classroom, and be attractive to recruiters. Simply being Norwegian doesn't tell the adcom if you can do these things.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 13:38
Thanks for the respons, everyone.

"Generally speaking, having a stellar profile and career achievements will off set a low GPA or GMAT." --> What if i already have made it to financial news channels as expert commentator on international financial markets (representing my international news bureau in the biggest private news channel in Norway) and co-founded a startup operating from Nice, France together with a french investor and already few months after launch being nominated "best startup in the Nordics 2012"?

Moreover, is the GPA based on the last education, or everything altogether? It may sound strange, but my grades on the masters (Norwegian B-average - which according to unis like LSE is acceptable for entry requirements) are higher than on the bachelor..
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 16:28
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MABE wrote:

"Generally speaking, having a stellar profile and career achievements will off set a low GPA or GMAT." --> What if i already have made it to financial news channels as expert commentator on international financial markets (representing my international news bureau in the biggest private news channel in Norway) and co-founded a startup operating from Nice, France together with a french investor and already few months after launch being nominated "best startup in the Nordics 2012"?


Now that's pretty cool and something you could write about in your essays! See how your nationality is fairly irrelevant in this achievement?

MABE wrote:
Moreover, is the GPA based on the last education, or everything altogether? It may sound strange, but my grades on the masters (Norwegian B-average - which according to unis like LSE is acceptable for entry requirements) are higher than on the bachelor..


MBA programs focus on your undergraduate GPA because:

1) Everybody has a Bachelors
2) That's the metric that is reported for the class profile, rankings, etc.

Having a masters is another data point and usually can't hurt, but most schools won't ignore your undergrad GPA for having a good grad GPA.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 16:35
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Admissions people tend to read for a geographic area--for example, focusing in on Latin American or South East Asian candidates. My guess is that your profile will be reviewed by someone in charge of Europe and you'll be compared to your European peers based on GMAT, GPA, etc. Being Norwegian may help a teeny tiny bit, but I'm guessing that they got a bunch of European applicants and if it comes down to the French dude with a 750 from La Sorbonne and a Norwegian from a mid-tier school with a so-so GMAT, they're going to still go with the French dude. The actual major advantage you probably have is that your English reads really natural, which is not going to be the case of every other European.

Have you taken the GMAT yet by the way? It's an American test, so I'm sure it'll be easy for you! :)
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   24 Jan 2013, 17:34
Norwegian, nah! Faroese, now we're talking about diversity.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   25 Jan 2013, 03:54
machichi wrote:
Admissions people tend to read for a geographic area--for example, focusing in on Latin American or South East Asian candidates. My guess is that your profile will be reviewed by someone in charge of Europe and you'll be compared to your European peers based on GMAT, GPA, etc. Being Norwegian may help a teeny tiny bit, but I'm guessing that they got a bunch of European applicants and if it comes down to the French dude with a 750 from La Sorbonne and a Norwegian from a mid-tier school with a so-so GMAT, they're going to still go with the French dude. The actual major advantage you probably have is that your English reads really natural, which is not going to be the case of every other European.

Have you taken the GMAT yet by the way? It's an American test, so I'm sure it'll be easy for you! :)


:) La Sorbonne is actually a very average university in France vs. the top Engineering Schools (Polytechnique, Centrale, Mines, ...), top Business Schools (HEC, ESSEC, ESCP, ...)and other Grandes Ecoles (Sciences Po, ENS, Paris-Dauphine, ...)
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   29 Jan 2013, 00:34
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Hi MABE,
Yes, I think it gives you some advantage, when you are European (especially from a small country) applying to US schools, since US schools always strive to be more international and diversify the class. You can also see here https://www.aringo.com/MBA_admission_cha ... ulator.htm that if you are "European applying to American program" it slightly increases your admission chances.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   29 Jan 2013, 03:33
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I agree with others - being from an under-represented country can give you an edge only if all else is equal. I am from Estonia and I have received both admits and dings from top-tier schools. I had a very good profile, not stellar though. So I don't think there was any correlation between the country of origin and acceptance.
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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   29 Jan 2013, 17:50
Just be aware that when applying to top American programs, that admissions expects GMAT and TEOFL scores from candidates from Scandinavia and Benelux to be very high. As for geographic diversity, I have noticed that candidates from developed countries like Norway are scrutinized to a higher level than are candidates from less developed countries. So, I would not bet my application on being from Norway as providing much to the diversity of the school.

Kimberly Plaga
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Manhattan Review

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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink] New post   18 Nov 2022, 14:39
Hello from the GMAT Club MBAbot!

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Re: Easier for foreigner from small country get into top-tier? [#permalink]
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