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Carlson v/s Questrom

Carlson v/s Questrom

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ajtmatch
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Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 00:53
Hi Guys,

I am an international student from India with a GMAT 680 (Q49, IR 8). I have received admits from Questrom and Carlson with equal amounts of scholarship - $50,000 for two years, for each. Carlson ranks ahead of Questrom for the last many years US news rankings. The latest rankings are - Carlson at #28, while Questrom is at #48.

I am an entrepreneur - started my own company, and recently transtitioned to manufacting industry (family business). So no 'brand name companies' on my resume per-se. My post-MBA aim would be to work, for a say around 5 years, for a consulting firm (not MBB) in a Generalized Management/ Strategy consulting role; the back-up option would be a PM in a tech firm. Which school would serve a better option for these goals? I would ideally like to work and live in New York/Boston (family in NY/NJ), which would make Questrom seem like an obvious choice but I feel that Carlson is all around stronger.
I understand that off-late many consulting firms have stopped hiring internationals.

The pros and cons of both:

Questrom:

- Pros:
dual degree MSDT that gives me STEM designation (better chance at finding job?);
Great city, which beats Minneapolis, any day?
More brand recognition outside of the US compared to Carlson.

- Cons:
Expensive living cost;
lower avg salary($92K for internationals v/s $110K for Carlson's international - data for both from the 2019 employment report)
career center is non-existent (from the reviews); too many better schools in town.
Tuition is around $130K v/s $100k for Carlson.
Not all big firms hire on campus or recruit from BU directly per se. Is it possible to get a job on your own in one of the firms I would want to?

Carlson:

-Pros:
Have few international students (18% only), which is actually good - less competition perhaps? (but Only 69% of the internationals secured a job, according to their 2019 employment report)
Better reputation and ranking
higher average salary ($110k for internationals)
Good career center (almost 30% going into consulting)
much cheaper cost of living

- Cons:
no STEM; I will also have to network out of my way to get your dream position given the mid-west location.


In terms of the tuition and stay/other expenses, I will be spending around $40Kish more, over the two year program, if I were to select BU. While I am in a fortunate enough position to not worry too much about the finances, I wouldn't also like to spend it just because of only that single reason. Is BU worth that extra money?

With the unfortunate outbreak of Covid, does it make more sense to go for the STEM designated degree and prefer safety over brand value? What do you guys think? I have only a small time window for making decision, and I'm so divided right now.

PS - Though I will be taking on a debt, it will be at a LIBOR rate - I will repay my company back at the LIBOR rate (around 1.8% p.a.)

bb Mo2men stonecold - your opinions, please?
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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 11:03
Hi,

How old are you? Have you applied to other schools this season other than Carlson and Questrom?
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Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 12:31
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Hi ajtmatch,

Looks like you have done your homework by listing out the pros and cons. The location of BU also offers a lot of advantages. Its surrounded by great schools and you can attend events organized by these schools. Boston is also home to a lot of startups, tech, healthcare and financial services companies. BU has a good track record in various case competitions over the past 5 years and you get to work with fantastic professors. I have also spoken with many alums and current students, and they all had good things to say about BU. There are a plethora of opportunities available at Questrom, be it tech/healthcare/finance/venture capital and private equity, and if you are good at networking you can find success in whatever you want to achieve at BU and beyond. I can't comment much on Carlson because I haven't researched much about it but BU is a very good school and I don't think the rankings quite reflect its potential.

To your other part - Yeah, STEM allows you to focus on your studies and goals without worrying much about the visa situation. BU is also trying to get STEM for finance and other concentrations too and it may happen in the 2nd year. Carlson's MBA/MSBA dual degree is also STEM but you have to shell out more for it and the duration of the program is longer.
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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 20:25
Mo2men - I am 27 and yes I did apply to few other schools but have been waitlisted in all - Simon, Vanderbilt Owen, Notre Dame Mendoza and McDonough. Do not know by when I will get a revert from these schools.

What's your opinion?


Mo2men wrote:
Hi,

How old are you? Have you applied to other schools this season other than Carlson and Questrom?
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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 20:34
Vyshak - thank you so much for the detailed reply.

While I agree Boston as a city offers some great opportunities, at the same time there are also many many schools, infact better schools against whom we would compete against for a job.

Also, coming to the tuition fees - I would have to shell out almost $90K at BU v/s $50K at Carlson. The starting salary at Questrom is pretty low as well - just $92K for internationals (v/s $110-115K for Carlson). Isn't that a but too low? Your take here on the low starting salary?

Would BU be worth spending that extra $40K? Also, Carlson has many of the top companies, including Bain, BCG, Amazon and many more coming to their campus.

From my talks with current students at BU, I understand that the career services is almost non-existent and students are let on their own to fend for themselves. I understand that no school outside of may be top-10 will hand a job to internationals on a platter but having a supportive and a good career services team at least helps you in some way. What do you say?


Vyshak wrote:
Hi ajtmatch,

Looks like you have done your homework by listing out the pros and cons. The location of BU also offers a lot of advantages. Its surrounded by great schools and you can attend events organized by these schools. Boston is also home to a lot of startups, tech, healthcare and financial services companies. BU has a good track record in various case competitions over the past 5 years and you get to work with fantastic professors. I have also spoken with many alums and current students, and they all had good things to say about BU. There are a plethora of opportunities available at Questrom, be it tech/healthcare/finance/venture capital and private equity, and if you are good at networking you can find success in whatever you want to achieve at BU and beyond. I can't comment much on Carlson because I haven't researched much about it but BU is a very good school and I don't think the rankings quite reflect its potential.

To your other part - Yeah, STEM allows you to focus on your studies and goals without worrying much about the visa situation. BU is also trying to get STEM for finance and other concentrations too and it may happen in the 2nd year. Carlson's MBA/MSBA dual degree is also STEM but you have to shell out more for it and the duration of the program is longer.
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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 21:15
I don't know whether Bain and BCG visit Carlson because those companies aren't mentioned on their employment report. BU has students who pursue careers in social impact and that may have caused the drop in average salary (my assumption). But, MBA + MSDT students have walked away with an average salary of $108K. And yes, if you are relying upon the career services team to get you the job then BU may not be the right fit for you. Students have relied on networking skills and alumni to land jobs. Although, Bain and BCG don't visit the campus, you do see BU alums who are currently working there. Infact, ZS doesn't visit BU but a current student has managed to land a job at ZS. Amazon doesn't visit BU but students did their internships there. So, its all down to your networking skills at BU.

By the way, if you are planning to take up the MBA + MSBA dual degree program at Carlson, the total tuition cost would turn out to be $14K expensive than Questrom's MBA + MSDT dual degree.

ajtmatch wrote:
Vyshak - thank you so much for the detailed reply.

While I agree Boston as a city offers some great opportunities, at the same time there are also many many schools, infact better schools against whom we would compete against for a job.

Also, coming to the tuition fees - I would have to shell out almost $90K at BU v/s $50K at Carlson. The starting salary at Questrom is pretty low as well - just $92K for internationals (v/s $110-115K for Carlson). Isn't that a but too low? Your take here on the low starting salary?

Would BU be worth spending that extra $40K? Also, Carlson has many of the top companies, including Bain, BCG, Amazon and many more coming to their campus.

From my talks with current students at BU, I understand that the career services is almost non-existent and students are let on their own to fend for themselves. I understand that no school outside of may be top-10 will hand a job to internationals on a platter but having a supportive and a good career services team at least helps you in some way. What do you say?

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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 21:56
Vyshak - BCG is mentioned on their 2019 employment report. Regarding Bain, one of the current students told me.

The $108K salary is the average right? I mean, for internationals it will be comparatively lesser by 10% or so? (deducing this from the avreage salary difference b/w domestic and international who opt for the general MBA) Is the 108K figure even for internationals? Would you be having any insights into this? Cause if so, then it does make BU an interesting proposition as well (I was calculating paying back my loan with an average of $90K which would have been a lot worse)

Yes, I agree the MSBA at Carlson will be extra cost, but I am not thinking about it - it has a stringent coding requirement and I do not want to venture into that path. Also, as you said it takes longer time.

So, either it is the general MBA at Carlson, which has better employment statistics or the MBA +MSDT at BU, for which I will have to shell out almost $90K.

Also, would you know why BU has seen a steady drop in the rankings over the past few years? Some schools such as Alabama are ranked better, surprisingly. Carlson at the same time went up 7 places higher this year, from #35 to #28 on the US News ranking.


Vyshak wrote:
I don't know whether Bain and BCG visit Carlson because those companies aren't mentioned on their employment report. BU has students who pursue careers in social impact and that may have caused the drop in average salary (my assumption). But, MBA + MSDT students have walked away with an average salary of $108K. And yes, if you are relying upon the career services team to get you the job then BU may not be the right fit for you. Students have relied on networking skills and alumni to land jobs. Although, Bain and BCG don't visit the campus, you do see BU alums who are currently working there. Infact, ZS doesn't visit BU but a current student has managed to land a job at ZS. Amazon doesn't visit BU but students did their internships there. So, its all down to your networking skills at BU.

By the way, if you are planning to take up the MBA + MSBA dual degree program at Carlson, the total tuition cost would turn out to be $14K expensive than Questrom's MBA + MSDT dual degree.

ajtmatch wrote:
Vyshak - thank you so much for the detailed reply.

While I agree Boston as a city offers some great opportunities, at the same time there are also many many schools, infact better schools against whom we would compete against for a job.

Also, coming to the tuition fees - I would have to shell out almost $90K at BU v/s $50K at Carlson. The starting salary at Questrom is pretty low as well - just $92K for internationals (v/s $110-115K for Carlson). Isn't that a but too low? Your take here on the low starting salary?

Would BU be worth spending that extra $40K? Also, Carlson has many of the top companies, including Bain, BCG, Amazon and many more coming to their campus.

From my talks with current students at BU, I understand that the career services is almost non-existent and students are let on their own to fend for themselves. I understand that no school outside of may be top-10 will hand a job to internationals on a platter but having a supportive and a good career services team at least helps you in some way. What do you say?

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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   02 Apr 2020, 22:46
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I don't know on what basis you are assuming internationals to earn 10% lesser than the average. You also have to check how many of the companies mentioned on the employment report hire internationals from the school. Given a small base of internationals, you may also end up being neglected by those companies who don't sponsor internationals and you may have to network on your own to find a job.

Coming to the rankings, in FT 2020 rankings Questrom is placed at 67, Carlson is placed at 81 and Alabama is nowhere in picture. You can be misled by rankings and I don't want to get into how a school like Alabama or Knoxville ended up gaining so many places. Please do talk to current students at both the schools, see which school suits you better, try to negotiate for additional scholarship if you can and then take a decision. Questrom is also currently having an admitted students week that started on Monday. Today will be the final day and you can email the adcoms for links and past recordings in case you are interested.

All the best!

ajtmatch wrote:
Vyshak - BCG is mentioned on their 2019 employment report. Regarding Bain, one of the current students told me.

The $108K salary is the average right? I mean, for internationals it will be comparatively lesser by 10% or so? (deducing this from the avreage salary difference b/w domestic and international who opt for the general MBA) Is the 108K figure even for internationals? Would you be having any insights into this? Cause if so, then it does make BU an interesting proposition as well (I was calculating paying back my loan with an average of $90K which would have been a lot worse)

Yes, I agree the MSBA at Carlson will be extra cost, but I am not thinking about it - it has a stringent coding requirement and I do not want to venture into that path. Also, as you said it takes longer time.

So, either it is the general MBA at Carlson, which has better employment statistics or the MBA +MSDT at BU, for which I will have to shell out almost $90K.

Also, would you know why BU has seen a steady drop in the rankings over the past few years? Some schools such as Alabama are ranked better, surprisingly. Carlson at the same time went up 7 places higher this year, from #35 to #28 on the US News ranking.

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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink] New post   03 Apr 2020, 01:28
In my view, I'm concerned about employment in both schools. Carlson has by far less internationals compared to other schools. Also, the many consulting firms stopped hiring internationals. As you did you due diligence, BU has problem in it career office.

In short, I'm leaning to advice you to wait this year to see the whole situation and work hard to get higher GMAT score to apply to big schools next season.

P.S. my Indian friend was apply to Darden last season and was advised by adcom to break 700 to be considered. Do not forget that you come from very competitive pool.

Good luck

ajtmatch wrote:
Mo2men - I am 27 and yes I did apply to few other schools but have been waitlisted in all - Simon, Vanderbilt Owen, Notre Dame Mendoza and McDonough. Do not know by when I will get a revert from these schools.

What's your opinion?


Mo2men wrote:
Hi,

How old are you? Have you applied to other schools this season other than Carlson and Questrom?
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Re: Carlson v/s Questrom [#permalink]
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