Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body : Sentence Correction (EA only)

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Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

22 Mar 2022, 01:24

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AXAN wrote:

Seems a bit iffy to me. The meaning, in your example, will vary in my opinion. But for something generally true, don't we use the present tense?

We don't always a see a perfect match between the name of a tense and the way(s) it can be used. That's English for you.

AXAN wrote:

You would say "The Earth revolves around the sun." and not "The Earth revolved around the sun.".

That's only one clause. What about "(J.J. Thomson) discovered that the mass of the electron was very small, merely 1/1,836 that of a hydrogen ion" (source)? As far as I know, both the present (is very small) and past (was very small) tenses are acceptable in that structure.

As I said, it'd be good to get more thoughts on this, including from Charles/Mike.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

17 Sep 2019, 20:58

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Ayushpandiya wrote:

Hi,

Isn't Option D supposed to have a comma after 'Jazz pianist and composer' as it describes Thelonious Monk.

Hi Ayushpandiya,

It depends on how important that information is. For example:

1. Prime Minister Boris Johnson claimed that... ← This is fine.

If we feel that the Prime Minister bit is not really important, we could introduce a comma, but then we'd have to add an article as well:
1a. A Prime Minister, Boris Johnson claimed that... ← Change in meaning.
1b. Prime Minister, Boris Johnson claimed that... ← This one is not correct.

Similarly, if we wanted a comma in the correct option, we'd have to go with a "A jazz pianist and composer, TM..." and not "Jazz pianist and composer, TM". However, the more important point here is that, like (1), option D is perfectly fine the way it is.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

21 Sep 2019, 23:15

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gurudabl wrote:

A. Thelonious Monk (noun), who was a jazz pianist and composer (appositive modifying the preceding noun), produced a body of work both (we don’t require “both” this because we have a singular body of work) rooted

The reasoning is correct but a few corrections:

1) "who was a jazz pianist and composer" is a relative clause and not an appositive
2) "both" is wrong because the correlative conjunction then must be "both X and Y" (explained below)

gurudabl wrote:

B. Thelonious Monk (noun), the jazz pianist and composer (appositive modifying the preceding noun), produced a body of work that was rooted both (“both” is used here for “the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington”) How can this option be wrong?

Both can be used in the following ways:

Both Ram and Shyam played cricket.

Here, "both" is attaching itself to the nouns X = Ram and Y = Shyam. At the core, this is really the rule being tested.

Now, in this option, we have a word "both" that has to attach/apply itself to some nouns or noun phrases.

Both X=(rooted in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith)) and Y=(Duke Ellington)) --> X & Y don't match hence wrong

Rooted in both X=(the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith) and Y=(Duke Ellington) --> X & Y don't match hence wrong

Rooted in the stride-piano tradition of both X=(Willie (The Lion) Smith)) and Y=(Duke Ellington) --> X & Y match hence okay but redundant

In short - the word "both" doesn't make sense here. So we can take off the options which attempt to create that structure.

In general, correlative conjunctions are the easiest (if you know how) to eliminate - so ensure you understand the mechanics.

gurudabl wrote:

C. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk, who produced a body of work rooted
D. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted (Official answer)
E. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work rooted both
I directly eliminated options C, D and E because the starting sentence “Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk” implied to me that “Jazz pianist” and “composer Thelonious Monk” are actually two different people.

Okay so to understand this better, let me use an analogy:

Chairman and Managing Director, Mr.Mukesh Ambani produced a great result for his shareholders.

What is wrong with this sentence? Nothing!

So I think one thing we need to be very wary of is using rules that we are not sure about. Always use a bigger juicer grammatical reason to eliminate.

For example, C is a sentence fragment as there is no predicate for the subject Thelonious Monk.

Hope this helps,

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

23 Sep 2019, 01:38

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gurudabl wrote:

Hey arun@crackverbal Thank You for the reply. Great explanation!

I have one last confusion that I want to resolve. (Hope it doesn't sound silly)

<snip>

My question is, does the presence of a "comma" play any role in our case?

In general, on the GMAT you don't need to worry about the comma. I can pretty much assure you that the difference between the right and the wrong answer option will not be based on the presence (or absence) of a comma.

Having said so, there is no problem even if we have it as "Chairman and Managing Director Mukesh Ambani" or "Actor and Director Kamal Hassan". It just is telling the occupation.

The only case I can think of is in the case of a modifier (like an adjective):

Young and dashing, Rishabh Pant is playing right now.

But let me reiterate: there are plenty of things you need to worry about on the GMAT. This is not a rule you should worry about

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

22 Apr 2020, 03:43

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lakshya14 wrote:

Isn't (D), also showing that there are 2 subjects "Jazz pianist" and "Thelonious Monk"?

Hello, lakshya14. In (D), jazz pianist is no more a subject than composer. Both are being used as adjectives in a restrictive appositive phrase, as in, The one and only jazz pianist and composer known as Thelonious Monk... The only option that does not employ such an appositive phrase is (A), which opts for a who clause to convey the same information.

If you have further questions, feel free to ask.

- Andrew

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

07 Feb 2022, 19:57

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SJ5 wrote:

I got it why option 'E' is the correct choice but I still have a small problem with the question. Can't "Jazz pianist and composer T. Monk" refer to two separate people in the option choices C,D,E?

If we were talking about two different people, the first a jazz pianist, and the second composer Thelonious Monk, then the verb "produced" would apply to both of them, right?

Here's the problem: it's fine to write, "Composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work," but we can't write "Jazz pianist produced a body of work." (At minimum, we'd need an article before "jazz pianist" for it to make any sense.) So it stands to reason that because "jazz pianist" can't function as a subject, it must be operating as a modifier. And the only entity it could logically modify here is "Thelonious Monk." Perfectly reasonable.

And really, even if there were some ambiguity about whether we were talking about two people or one, (A) and (B) have concrete parallelism errors, so you're stuck with the construction, even if you don't love it.

I hope that clears things up!

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

26 Mar 2022, 07:47

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AXAN wrote:

GMATNinja

Really good explanation as always.

For me there seems to be a meaning issue in the correct option-

Quote:

D. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted

Doesn't the "work that was rooted" mean that either the work is no longer rooted in what it used to be or somehow doesn't exist anymore? According to me this shouldn't be the case and it should be in present or continuous tense instead of being in simple past.

Could you shed some light on this please? Much appreciated.

Better question: which answer choice would you pick if not (D)?

Can you make the case that the verb tense is a little confusing in (D)? Sure. Can you make the case that the past tense is warranted? Absolutely (kudos to AjiteshArun and AndrewN for their explanations on this issue!) -- the production of the body of work happened in the past, so it's not unreasonable to say that the body of work produced in the past was rooted.

Even if we don't love the tense, that's not a strong enough reason to eliminate (D). The other choices have more flagrant errors that we can't ignore, so we have to live with (D), like it or not.

I hope that helps!

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Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

27 Apr 2023, 20:33

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vikonomics wrote:

Shouldn't there be a comma after "Jazz pianist and composer" in option D? without comma isn't what "jazz pianist" modifying unclear? How can we say it's referring to Thelonious Monk

Hi vikonomics,

We use modifiers without commas all the time.

1. light music
2. Prime Minister Boris Johnson
3. a student in the class who has taken the GMAT

(2) uses an actual title, without a comma. We wouldn't want to go with something like "Prime Minister, Boris Johnson".

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

29 Apr 2023, 23:02

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As for the question from TheUltimateWinner, if we add THE, we absolutely cannot add a comma. This would imply that he is THE ONLY jazz pianist and composer. To use this form, we'd need to restrict the modifier further to apply to just one person: "The jazz pianist and composer most frequently copied by contemporary artists, Thelonious Monk . . . "

We also can't add a comma without THE. We'd only add a comma if we started with "A jazz pianist and composer," and even then, this would create something more like an adverbial modifier, in which we'd be showing WHY/HOW he was able to do what he did. For instance, I might say "A gifted composer, Monk could come up with enough solid material for an entire album in one sitting." Sure, that initial modifier describes Monk, but it's also providing context for the specific ideas that follow. We don't have a need for this type of construction in the sentence as presented.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

Updated on: 01 Jul 2015, 03:35

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Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work both rooted in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington, yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory.

1) The use of the relative pronoun is not correct. 2) The current placement of "both" suggests that the work should be rooted in something else in addition to the tradition. Eliminate A, B, E, and C (for the same modifier error).

A. Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work both rooted

B. Thelonious Monk, the jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work that was rooted both

C. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk, who produced a body of work rooted

D. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted

E. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work rooted both

Originally posted by OptimusPrepJanielle on 01 Jul 2015, 02:38.
Last edited by OptimusPrepJanielle on 01 Jul 2015, 03:35, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

24 Dec 2016, 18:09

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this question tests you on parallelism -

Note that this correlative conjunction - Both X and Y - requires X and Y to be perfectly parallel.

Let us look at the answer options -

A - "both rooted in ...and Duke Ellington" - these two things are not in parallel.

B - "both in the stride piano ... and Duke Ellington" - these two things are not in parallel.

C - "Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk, who produced a body of work rooted in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington, yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory"

Note that "yet" is used as co-ordinating conjunction here. Hence, two things that it contrasts must be parallel. Also, note that the portion in blue is a modifier.

"in many ways he stood apart ..." - a clause - is contrasted with "Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk" - a phrase.
Hence, incorrect.

D - Correct answer. Note that we are not using the correlative conjunction both X and Y.

"... rooted in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington" - these two things are in parallel.

E - "both in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington"
these two things are not in parallel.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

26 Dec 2016, 16:43

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sakshamgulati123 wrote:

Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work both rooted in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington, yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory-
(A) Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work both rooted
(B) Thelonious Monk, the jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work that was rooted both
(C) Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk, who produced a body of work rooted
(D) Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted
(E) Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work rooted both

Although the OG 16 mentions D as the correct answer, i would like to know the use of comma ,which makes b as the right choice in my assumptions.
Much guidance needed here.

The commas are fine in both (B) and (D). I assume you're talking about the modifier 'the jazz pianist and composer'/'jazz pianist and composer', which has commas in (B) but not in (D), right?

But you're in luck: the GMAT doesn't test commas in this way. The only situation in which I've seen the GMAT test commas, is when you're dealing with essential vs. inessential modifiers. Commas can sometimes give you a clue that something is wrong, but they aren't really tested directly, so you should focus on other issues first.

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

25 Jul 2017, 19:33

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adkikani wrote:

Hi Experts GMATNinja mikemcgarry

GMAT Qs are a bit funny sometimes, except that they cost a lot!!
Do we not actually need a BOTH after verb-ed modifier - rooted?
None of sentences have below format:
Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work
rooted both in the stride-piano tradition of Willie (The Lion) Smith and in Duke
Ellington, yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory.
But this too sound incorrect too me.

OA simply eliminates usage of
BOTH if BOTH in not used in correct idiom as : BOTH x and y (x and y: noun phrases)
Any views on the same?
WR, Arpit

Hello adkikani /Arpit.

I will be glad to help you with your doubt. :-)

Just because both is used in the original sentence, it is not necessary that this word must be present in the correct answer too.

You must first understand why a word has been used in the sentence. Does its usage convey logical meaning? If not, then we should figure out how it can be used correctly in the sentence. However, if an answer choice is logically and grammatically correct even without the usage of that particular word, then also the choice will qualify as the correct answer choice.

Same is the case with Choice D of this official sentence.

However, we can use both in the following way in this official sentence:

Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted in the stride-piano tradition of both Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington, yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory.

In the above-mentioned sentence, usage of both X and Y is grammatical as well as logical.

Hope this helps. :-)

Thanks.
Shraddha

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

31 Jan 2018, 20:20

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The tricky thing about open parallelism markers such as “and” is that while we know that they connect the elements on either side, we don’t know how far those elements extend! In this case, “and” connects “Jazz pianist” and “composer” only. How can we tell? First, “Jazz pianist” can’t be someone’s name. At the very least, we’d need to say “*The* jazz pianist and *the* composer to show that we were talking about two different people, and even then, the reader would ask “Which jazz pianist?” Second, the rest of the sentence only refers to one singular subject: “he stood apart.”

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

28 May 2020, 23:58

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RAHUL_GMAT This is a fairly common construction used to tell the reader who a person is. Our point is not that he did these specific things just because he is a jazz composer. Rather, the author is just adding some context for those unfortunate people who haven't had the pleasure of learning about Thelonious Monk yet. In similar fashion, we might say "Hollywood legend Tom Hanks" or "former UK prime minister Theresa May."

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

29 Sep 2020, 10:35

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Redundant isn't the word I would use here, but we *do* have two subjects with only one verb, so I suppose we could call "he" redundant. However, the "yet" creates the expectation that we are joining two clauses, so I'd say it's more appropriate to view this choice as missing a verb for the first noun. There are other questions where the presence of two nouns in a row can seem truly redundant, such as the "heirloom tomatoes" question: https://gmatclub.com/forum/heirloom-tom ... 75868.html

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Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

06 Mar 2021, 16:36

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Adambhau wrote:

GMATNinja wrote:

This is one of my favorites, just because I see a lot of errors on it – but it’s actually really straightforward, and is easy to solve if you follow a couple of simple rules. And that doesn’t happen as often as we’d like on GMAT SC, unfortunately.

Quote:

A. Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work both rooted

OK, the thing that should jump out at us is the word “both.” In this case, “both” is paired with the word “and” – and this is a very strict parallelism “trigger”. The word “both” and the word “and” must be followed by two parallel elements.

And in this case, we don’t have those parallel elements: “…both rooted… and Duke Ellington…” Nope: “rooted” is an adjective in this situation, and “Duke Ellington” definitely is not. So we can eliminate (A).

(And for anybody who was paying extremely close attention in our YouTube webinar on parallelism and meaning: when I mentioned “special parallel triggers”, this both/and construction is one of the most important examples I had in mind.)

Quote:

B. Thelonious Monk, the jazz pianist and composer, produced a body of work that was rooted both

I’m OK with the use of “that” here: “that was rooted” just modifies the “body of work.” You could probably argue that the words “that was” aren’t strictly necessary, but they also aren’t doing any harm at all.

The more important thing is the parallelism again: “…both in the stride-piano tradition… and Duke Ellington…”

Nope, that’s definitely not parallel, either. (B) is out.

Quote:

C. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk, who produced a body of work rooted

Hm, no more “both”! That’s cool. Now the parallelism isn’t a problem at all: Willie (The Lion) Smith and Duke Ellington are parallel to each other in the non-underlined portion.

But now there’s a more subtle problem: this thing isn’t a legitimate sentence anymore, because the presumed subject of the sentence (“Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk”) never actually “performs” a main verb. I think we can agree that the part beginning with “who” is just modifying Thelonious Monk, so let’s strip that out for just a moment to see what we have: “Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk,… yet in many ways he stood apart from the mainstream jazz repertory.”

Huh? That makes no sense. Basically, the sentence is structured as a noun, followed by a modifier, followed by a dependent clause. That’s not a sentence. So (C) is out.

Quote:

D. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work that was rooted

As in (C), we don’t have any parallelism issues here, since “both” has been removed. But unlike (C), (D) is actually a real sentence, since it starts with a nice, independent clause: “…Thelonious Monk produced a body of work…”

So let’s keep (D).

Quote:

E. Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work rooted both

And we’re right back to the same parallelism problem as in (B): “…both in the stride-piano tradition… and Duke Ellington…” That’s just plain wrong, and we’re left with (D) as the correct answer.

Hi GMATNinja,

If we rewrite the correct option as below (removing "that was"), then is it still correct? If yey, then why?

(D) Jazz pianist and composer Thelonious Monk produced a body of work rooted

If anyone can clarify, that would be great!
Thanks!

I don't think there would be any issue removing that was because rooted would be considered as modfying body of work.
Even GmatNinja also highlighted about this in his explanation of B option:

Quote:

I’m OK with the use of “that” here: “that was rooted” just modifies the “body of work.” You could probably argue that the words “that was” aren’t strictly necessary, but they also aren’t doing any harm at all.

Hope it is clear

gmatclubot

Re: Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body [#permalink]

06 Mar 2021, 16:36

GMAT Sentence Correction (EA only) Questions

Thelonious Monk, who was a jazz pianist and composer, produced a body