Another Cheating Scandal

You're probably better off asking GMAC.

As many as 6,000 prospective MBA students may have used an illegitmate web site to view "live" questions before taking the GMAT test and now face POSSIBLE cancellation of their test scores. Applicants, current students, and graduates may have the tainted scores.

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Ya how many of those votes let them off the hook are people who used ST.

300% They voted multiple times.

I do agree with a lot of what you have stated on your post, but I have to disagree with this. I see no reason why the cost of something should increase or decrease the likelihood of its fraud. Yes, there are probably a bunch of people who registered for the VIP section without knowing what it actually was and trust me, I feel for them. But to say that people won't pay $30 to cheat because it is too cheap is a little extreme IMO.


Well, the actual advantage that test takers got from the VIP section could vary from nothing to a lot. Some people who accessed the VIP section did so with the intent to gain access to live questions. So whether or not that really paid off for them is in no way related to how guilty they are. They are guilty. Period.



I completely agree with you. The GMAC screwed up. Big time. They knew (and know) that even today there are tons of sites like Scoretop in operation. As you said, at the very least, they could put up a warning on their site with the names of the blacklisted sites. Rather than go after the sites themselves, warn the test taker of severe consequences if it is found that he/she accessed the sites listed here. I don't think this would have taken too much effort on the GMAC's part.



Absolutely not. There are a few bad apples and they need to be taken down.

I've just read this thread and I'm stunned! I've decided to post my thoughts about this situation.
As a person who has a lot of experience as a top-manager, I'd like to take a look at the problem from the other point of view.


GMAC is a business. It is a good business: monopoly with intellectual properties that are hard to control from antitrust laws. I suppose that CMAC, as a business, is based on
one general principle: GMAT score must be fair and truly reflect person's knowledge.
Any threats to this principle is a crucial! if GMAT score were unfair then B-schools would seek another criteria for applicants, applicants would not take GMAT and GMAC would be a bankrupt. So, GMAC, as any normal company, must keep its Achilles as save as possible. That is a true reason (ethical reason is rather second one) why GMAC reacts and must react on any attempt to challenge its main principle. The main action of GMAC: do real steps (lawsuits, reduction probability of repetitions) and a large PR campaign directed to make GMAT score as fair as possible in the eyes of its main customers: B-schools.

Expulsion form B-schools. I guess GMAC will carry out some lawsuits and some people, not many, will lost their positions. Preys is needed both GMAC, to clean its reputation, and B-schools, to show that their graduates is a high-quality persons. Why only some people will suffer? Just because effect/costs ratio will be decrease with increase in the number of involved people and lawsuits.

Copyrights. I would like to ask some intelligent people at this site: when a person posts question from bought OG, because he or she want to understand this question deeply, does he or she violate copyrights? I think he or she does... and why is GMAC so reluctant to fight with this situation? I guess the situation does not threaten profit and reputation of GMAC and, to some extent, even increase profit, because people learn more and retake exam. And do not forget about effect/costs ratio....

I too was curious about that...I would hate for this place and some of the other upstanding sites like beatthegmat to get bagged. The only reason people post OG questions is either they got them from someplace like the 1000 series and didnt realize they were OG questions or the solution in the book didnt make enough sense to them. I dont think anyone on here would actually study materials found only on here and expect to do well. Personally, I think as soon as you decide to take the GMAT the OG is something you MUST own.

My understanding is this: There exists no law that protects a company's rules that the company has created. For example, there's no law that says that you can't cheat on a test. Therefore, GMAC is using copyright as a means (written law) to an end (prosecution of scoretop).

Now, people have already begun to confuse the two. Some on this thread have equated using "live" questions with using copyrighted questions, such as OG or PR or Kraplan. The two are not only vastly different, but also the difference in the level of culpability is great.

It's one thing to ask someone to explain a problem on a retired question, and another thing to use a "live" question that someone who recently took the gmat posts on a paid forum. It's worlds apart.

Just because GMAC is seeking relief via copyright, doesn't make all copyrighted material equal.

So it seems like this has a lot of steam on BW now...I was contacted to give my opinions on it for another article. They are also recruiting two people, one on each side, to debate the subject. I actually sent a PM to Rhyme about that since I think he probably did the most research and definitely has a great side to argue.

One good thing about this scandal is the fact that it doesnt seem like it will be blown over. I think the more that is out there about this the less likely it is that schools and GMAC can let it go without some significant response. If GMAC cancels a bunch of scores then its on schools to take actions. I would say that there are going to be people affected at almost every top school.

I really don't understand the debate here. I guess the issue is the "intent" on the part of the people who signed up. But there are blogs out there that clearly state they new what JJs were.

The cheaters are starting to believe their own BS that they were witless nitwits who chanced upon a random website that they threw money at and are innocent victims in this entire sham.

If the GMAC decides to shut us down, they're even more stupid than I had originally thought. No forum advocates the usage + purchase of the OG more than the people here. NONE.

Yeah, they are smart people and they prefer profit rather than satisfaction in protection of copyrights.

well the whole point of copyrights is to protect profits (integrity of the test is vital to long term profit).
It wouldn't make much sense for them to go after legit sites like this for copyright reasons because that defeats the purpose of having the copyrights.
(I'm assuming profit gained from OG sales increases from usage of this site > profit lost from people using materials on this site instead of buying OG. A pretty reasonable assumption imo)


Sites like this are providing free customer service for the OG/GMAC through more thorough explanations of the answers.

found this on GMAT website :

Inappropriate Uses of
GMAT® Scores
1. AS A REQUIREMENT FOR AWARDING A
DEGREE.
The GMAT® test is designed for selection for
graduate management study, financial aid awards,
or counseling and guidance. Any other purpose
should be avoided.

2. AS A REQUIREMENT FOR EMPLOYMENT,
LICENSING OR CERTIFICATION TO PERFORM
A JOB, OR FOR JOB-RELATED REWARDS
(RAISES, PROMOTIONS, ETC.).
The use of the GMAT® scores for these purposes is
inappropriate. Further, programs using the GMAT®
exam may not supply score reports for any of these
purposes.

From a leading GMAT preparation company:

"a teacher must score at the 99th percentile (currently a 760+ overall) on an Official GMAT exam in order to be considered for our staff. "

This is on the website and no action is being taken. Is this because this company is corporate partner to some blue chip companies and charges a lot of money for providing training by instructors who appeared for real GMAT?

After reading endless posts here and there about this whole affair, I am quite disturbed by a lot of people are so quick to rush to judgment regarding those who have used Scoretop.

In 100% honesty, can anyone here truly say what actually was happening at the Scoretop site over the course of the last 5+ years? Yes, we have seen SOME examples of questionable activity occur (based on the court documents), but that doesn't mean much of anything regarding everyone else associated in some way with Scoretop. Calling someone else a cheater is a serious accusation. In this situation, everyone's case needs to be examined individually. There should be no rush to judgment.

woot, river and rhyme are going to be famous now on BW.

I read through the entire BW posts, I'm just a bit disgusted by some of the defense people put up. I hope this doesn't blow over and the right amount of punishment gets dealt out (without turning into a witch hunt)