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Going to school somewhere you DON'T want to live?

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RLM
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 05:48
lepium wrote:
pelihu wrote:
I want to go ahead and clear up some misinformation. Students at any of the ultra-elite schools and most of the elite schools will have no problem moving along to work in whatever city they fell like. It is a complete falsehood that job postings are localized for a school like Kelogg. Students at that school will have no problem landing jobs in any city in the US, or around the world.

People at all the elite schools can and do land jobs with major companies in cities around the country. If you're targeting a specific job in a specific locale, you might have to do your own footwork, but if your goal is generally to "work in LA" or "work in Chicago" any of the top schools will work out just fine.

Generally speaking, you should consider schools according to their cluster (as defined by Hjort), and then decide among schools within the same cluster. You'll want to have a very very compelling personal reason before passing on a school in a higher cluster to attend one in a lower cluster.


I agree with pelihu. L.


Hmm.. can you elaborate on why you agree?

Here's what we know so far:

- Theoretically an MBA from a good school will get you good jobs anywhere
- Most grads end up in a first gig that's located around/close to their b-school
- Many large companies recruit at a school but allow grads to choose the specific office they wish to work
- You'll have to carry out your own job search when graduating, thus foregoing a lot of the Career Services job postings (ie. defeating one of the biggest reasons for going to b-school!!)
- Big companies that hire many grads do not post on job boards / corporate websites.

So it's still not convincing to me that you can goto a school on the east coast (ie. Kellogg, Columbia) and easily find a first job on the west coast (ie. LA), especially with the fact that companies don't post entry level MBA jobs on internet job boards! Where else will you get job postings?
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 08:48
I went to an event with Chicago GSB students and recent grads in Boston and one of my questions I asked each was did they have a hard time finding a job/internship outside the Midwest. Everyone of them said that there were companies in all fields from all parts of the country and the world. If you aim to go to any city its pretty much possible.

If you look at the stats on where students come from, generally schools, even top ones, draw heavily from their region. Kellogg and GSB are the schools people from the Midwest aim for. Stanford and Haas attract a lot of students from the west coast. Columbia, MIT, and other schools attract heavily from the Northeast. Duke and Darden attract a lot from the south.

Several of the GSB students/alums said a lot of classmates were originally from the Midwest but went to schools in other parts of the country and then stayed and worked there following undergrad but they everntually wanted to return to the Midwest. Its seems fairly common especially for married people to eventually migrate back towards family, this becomes even more common once you have kids and want them to be near grandparents and other family.
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 09:18
RLM wrote:
- You'll have to carry out your own job search when graduating, thus foregoing a lot of the Career Services job postings (ie. defeating one of the biggest reasons for going to b-school!!)



Where are you getting info that you will need to carry out your own job search without the Career centers help? Take a look at GSB's career services stats. 87.1% of all hires were school facilitated while 32% stayed in the midwest (26% in Chicago). That means at least 50% of their class found a job outside of the midwest and used the school's contacts.
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 10:37
riverripper wrote:
If you look at the stats on where students come from, generally schools, even top ones, draw heavily from their region. Kellogg and GSB are the schools people from the Midwest aim for. Stanford and Haas attract a lot of students from the west coast. Columbia, MIT, and other schools attract heavily from the Northeast. Duke and Darden attract a lot from the south.


Something seems flawed with the logic here... I get the impression that a lot of students choose their schools based on what they want to do post-MBA, ie. Wharton for finance, UCLA for entertainment industry, Kellogg for marketing, etc.... and that the location is not of highest importance. And this should especially be true for top schools since they are likely to attract students from all over.. So I'm surprised that top schools draw heavily from their own region.... but I think I'll have to look at the stats more carefully.
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 10:50
RLM wrote:
riverripper wrote:
If you look at the stats on where students come from, generally schools, even top ones, draw heavily from their region. Kellogg and GSB are the schools people from the Midwest aim for. Stanford and Haas attract a lot of students from the west coast. Columbia, MIT, and other schools attract heavily from the Northeast. Duke and Darden attract a lot from the south.


Something seems flawed with the logic here... I get the impression that a lot of students choose their schools based on what they want to do post-MBA, ie. Wharton for finance, UCLA for entertainment industry, Kellogg for marketing, etc.... and that the location is not of highest importance. And this should especially be true for top schools since they are likely to attract students from all over.. So I'm surprised that top schools draw heavily from their own region.... but I think I'll have to look at the stats more carefully.


If you want a very specific field like entertainment then it makes sense to choose entertainment. However, if you want to go into banking or consulting, which make up the majority of every schools post graduate careers, then pretty much all the top schools give you great opportunities. Chicago and Kellogg will get you a job on Wall Street if thats what you want.
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[#permalink] New post   Updated on: 24 Aug 2007, 10:53
RLM wrote:
lepium wrote:
I agree with pelihu. L.


Hmm.. can you elaborate on why you agree?

Here's what we know so far:

- Theoretically an MBA from a good school will get you good jobs anywhere
- Most grads end up in a first gig that's located around/close to their b-school
- Many large companies recruit at a school but allow grads to choose the specific office they wish to work
- You'll have to carry out your own job search when graduating, thus foregoing a lot of the Career Services job postings (ie. defeating one of the biggest reasons for going to b-school!!)
- Big companies that hire many grads do not post on job boards / corporate websites.

So it's still not convincing to me that you can goto a school on the east coast (ie. Kellogg, Columbia) and easily find a first job on the west coast (ie. LA), especially with the fact that companies don't post entry level MBA jobs on internet job boards! Where else will you get job postings?


There are treks/ trips / whatever they are called at every school. And while you may struggle for attention trying to "open up" NYC from a small regional school in another state, I'm almost sure that if you are attending Columbia, Michigan, Darden or any other of the Ultra Elites and Elites, you will get attention in LA, Beijing, London or wherever you travel. I've heard and read anecdotal evidence and talked about this issue extensively with alumni, students and adcoms. The opportunities are there if you put in some effort and focus your search from the get go. Now if you just sit down and wait for the posting to show up, it won't be so easy, but still, doable (you would apply to the LA office of a company based on a general job posting).

L.

Originally posted by lepium on 24 Aug 2007, 10:51.
Last edited by lepium on 24 Aug 2007, 10:53, edited 1 time in total.
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 10:52
forcefeed wrote:
RLM wrote:
- You'll have to carry out your own job search when graduating, thus foregoing a lot of the Career Services job postings (ie. defeating one of the biggest reasons for going to b-school!!)



Where are you getting info that you will need to carry out your own job search without the Career centers help? Take a look at GSB's career services stats. 87.1% of all hires were school facilitated while 32% stayed in the midwest (26% in Chicago). That means at least 50% of their class found a job outside of the midwest and used the school's contacts.


Good call - did you do well on your critical reasoning? :lol: That's a somewhat reassuring stat, but still the non-midwest placements for Kellogg have alot of variance, for example if I remember correctly the rate for Seattle was something like 9%, whereas LA was 3% last year... which is strange considering how much more industry there is in LA. I bet the Microsofts/Amazons out there, as well as other WA-based companies, have a lot to do with it by choosing to recruit at Kellogg, and so students are still somewhat at their mercy, and might not end up at their desired geographical location.

Anyways I feel like I'm almost over-analyzing this issue :lol: I think I'll just apply and see where fate takes me... :lol:
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 12:08
RLM wrote:
Good call - did you do well on your critical reasoning? :lol: That's a somewhat reassuring stat, but still the non-midwest placements for Kellogg have alot of variance, for example if I remember correctly the rate for Seattle was something like 9%, whereas LA was 3% last year... which is strange considering how much more industry there is in LA. I bet the Microsofts/Amazons out there, as well as other WA-based companies, have a lot to do with it by choosing to recruit at Kellogg, and so students are still somewhat at their mercy, and might not end up at their desired geographical location.

Anyways I feel like I'm almost over-analyzing this issue :lol: I think I'll just apply and see where fate takes me... :lol:


Take a look at Kellogg's placement report, they list out the company's that recruit there. If there are a few NW or Cali companies that you are specifically looking for, see if they are on that list.

My plan is to stay in the Chicago area but I'm still applying to HBS & Wharton. If I get in, I figure the name is so strong that I should be able to land a job here.
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 14:51
Just talked with a Kellogg 2nd year student on the phone, and he said that the placements on the West Coast is noticeable, and quite a few of his friends who are from the West Coast and want to go back have gone back for internships. The Amazons/Googles/Yahoos/Microsofts all hire at Kellogg, according to him.

Hope that helps!
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[#permalink] New post   24 Aug 2007, 15:42
Definitely helpful, I might end up settling in Seattle, but would like to go to a better school than UW if possible. So the fact that MS/Amazon recruits there is good news. Now I just have to decide between Chicago and Kellog. From basic research, I think Kellog may fit my personality and values better.
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