H/S/W Lottery

Question

What % of applicants to H/S/W do you think are just simply playing the lottery? I understand that everyone that applies sees a spot for themselves at the school, but some people just know that they are way out of range. In other words, how many people that belong in Top 10 to 20 schools try to apply to top 3?

My guess is 25% for Harvard.

My guess is 25% for Harvard.

Tarmac · Answer

Sure, but so what?

You have to also understand that admissions is a crap shoot, if there is suddenly a lack of applicants in whatever specialty you are an expert on, your chances dramatically go up.

Captain · Answer

I agree with you, but when there are between 8,000 and 10,000 applicants per school, it is very difficult to be part of a small group of experts of some specialty.

refurb · Answer

This is true with any school. It's just that most people rely more heavily on it with H/S/W.

I have no doubt that the adcoms sit around and think "Oh! This guy was a <insert job, EC or life experience>! He would make a great addition to our class. His GMAT might be lower than average, but he seems like a great fit."

If the adcom  likes  you, that counts for a LOT.

RF

agold · Answer

Harvard doesn't care about the GMAT score. Also, Harvard and Wharton both have enormous class sizes and therefore have the room to take anyone that they like.

msday · Answer

i think if people have exceptional numbers but are not so great elsewhere in the app, they feel almost compelled to apply to H/S/W in hopes of catching the Adcom snoozing a bit. this probably accounts for the highest percentage of "dreamers".

refurb · Answer

I don't know if I'd go that far. What is the GMAT average? 720?

RF

agold · Answer

They didn't even ask for the GMAT for a period of approximately 10 years, and I believe they still put the least emphasis on it out of any of the top schools. It's just a coincidence that the high achievers that get into HBS have good GMAT scores.

isa · Answer

I think I disagree with the GMAT aspect of that. My understanding was that if they are considering two applications that are fairly similar but can only pick one, they'll use the GMAT/GPA to make a decision. Also, if you have a very low GMAT, that's also a bit of a flag on your app (but in a bad way).

agold · Answer

If your application is very similar to someone else's for HBS - chances are you did not dig deep enough and will get dinged anyway. They look for leadership, pure and simple. The kids with the flashy extracurriculars, VP titles in the workplace at age 23, entrepeneurs, people with significant international experience, etc. If you don't fit that mold - they don't care what your GMAT is.

HBS is a very unique beast and it should not be treated like every other school.

HBS is a very unique beast and it should not be treated like every other school.

refurb · Answer

That statement I can agree with. The GMAT is as important to Harvard as to other schools, but I wouldn't go as far as saying "they don't care".

RF

agold · Answer

Put it this way - a lot of schools would pick a high GMAT over someone with killer extracurriculars, all else equal. They are worried about their brand image and their average GMAT for the class.

HBS would not.

Tarmac · Answer

Basically, it's good to be the king. HBS is very free to do whatever they want, because as #1, they know they have too many qualified applicants anyway.

That said, people do get accepted, obviously. The acceptance rate isn't 0.00001%, it's more like 15%. This is much, much higher than any 'lottery'. It could be you. If you want to go for it, do it. It doesn't hurt at all, except for the $250 application fee, 5 essays which take a month to write and bothering 3 references for recs.

refurb · Answer

Agreed. Like Tarmac said (and true in any aspect of life), when you're on top, you have a lot more leeway.

RF

Anonymous · Answer

If your application is very similar to someone else's for HBS - chances are you did not dig deep enough and will get dinged anyway. They look for leadership, pure and simple. The kids with the flashy extracurriculars, VP titles in the workplace at age 23quote] A VP at the age of 23 works for Daddy

Rubashov1 · Answer

*gulp*

<img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cry.gif" alt=":cry:" title="Crying or Very sad" /> <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cry.gif" alt=":cry:" title="Crying or Very sad" />

agold · Answer

You'd be surprised at some of the kids going into Stanford and HBS. There's going to be at least a few dozen in each class who have attained titles like "Director" or "VP" by age 23-25. I'll admit, they're mostly with smaller companies and start-ups, but it is still pretty impressive to be Director of Strategy or Director of Corp Dev for a venture-funded start up at that age and provides multitudes of leadership stories.

There's also a lot of kids who have had accelerated career paths at banks/consulting firms/other typical MBA employers and are already at the post-MBA level prior to attending HBS/Stanford.

Anonymous · Answer

I understand what you're saying - but I was also kidding.

I get it that people are superstars. However; we need to remember the holistic picture, which I feel is even more important to schools like Harvard.

agold · Answer

I agree, and that's the only reason that I'm bothering to play the lottery. I know that I will stand out from the sea of consultants/bankers/IT guys/engineers, and if they think that I can add value to the class through diversity - then I'll be glad to take them up on it.

Anonymous · Answer

Definitely.. essays are vital. Essays increase our lottery chance

H/S/W Lottery

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