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All all those who think they are good at CR.

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Manager
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All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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27 Aug 2007, 20:18
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OK I am going to give you the disputed answers since this CR has been discussed earlier without any final answer and explanation. The disputed options are B and D but the OA is C. To me both B and C make sense but in GMAT, most such questions have the OA C.

In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

CB

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Manager
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27 Aug 2007, 20:45
You mentioned BCD as possible answers so my thinking got distorted and i went into mode of justifying answer C.
Here is my take-

B- If I negate this assumption then it does not impact conclusion of the argument i.e. that the new Malsenian converts to classical music are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

C-If negative this then it does impact the conlusion as it weakens the premise that classical concert audience are going down.
So it does look correct answer.

D-This weakens the conclusion as it is so it can not be an assumption.

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Manager
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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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27 Aug 2007, 22:28
computer-bot wrote:
OK I am going to give you the disputed answers since this CR has been discussed earlier without any final answer and explanation. The disputed options are B and D but the OA is C. To me both B and C make sense but in GMAT, most such questions have the OA C.

In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

CB

The answer is C, because if there is a decrease in the number of live performances then obviously there will be decrease in the number of people attending the concerts. Then the conclusion will not valid. So answer C.

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Director
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Schools: University of Chicago, Wharton School
Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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27 Aug 2007, 22:34
computer-bot wrote:
In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

I could not figure out any? B is close...

it is one of the most hardest CR questions I ever had.

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Senior Manager
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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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27 Aug 2007, 23:26
surbab wrote:
computer-bot wrote:
OK I am going to give you the disputed answers since this CR has been discussed earlier without any final answer and explanation. The disputed options are B and D but the OA is C. To me both B and C make sense but in GMAT, most such questions have the OA C.

In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

CB

The answer is C, because if there is a decrease in the number of live performances then obviously there will be decrease in the number of people attending the concerts. Then the conclusion will not valid. So answer C.

Wont you define "audience at concerts" as the number of people attending a particular concert? If that's the case dont you think reducing the number of concerts will compensate for the decrease in the public interest at least partially?

Much like reducing supply to compensate for lower demand to keep the prices high.

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Manager
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28 Aug 2007, 00:08
Actually i find another flaw with B.
Use of 'Some'. If it had used the word 'most' then it would have made more sense.
Even if some people have option to attend won't make a big difference.

If B read that most people have the option of attending the concert -- and thus even then the attandances are declining-it would corroborate our conclusion that, yes, people dont have a desire to attend concerts.

And while I am writing this , it actually makes more sense to me and once we can see through B and the flaw with the use of 'some' , picking up choice C is lot easier and fool proof.

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Manager
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28 Aug 2007, 04:41
Very good point by excelgmat on usage of some in the option B.

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Director
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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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28 Aug 2007, 05:04
computer-bot wrote:
In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.
Essentially, the author is saying other things staying the same "audiences are shrinking in live concerts. One of the "otherthings" is the number of concerts, as C suggests. Imagine what would happen, for example, if the audience stay the same but concerts double. Audience per concert would half.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

CB

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Director
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28 Aug 2007, 07:14
I think excelgmat hits the nail right on head!

We know that C is a clear assumption and B becomes right if we take out 'some' part.

We would have had two OAs if we take out the 'some' part from B.

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Manager
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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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28 Aug 2007, 07:38
Evidence 1: In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring.

Evidence 2: The buyers were drawn to it either from television commercials or by theme tunes.

Evidence 3: Audiences at classical concerts,are shrinking in Malsenia.

Conclusion: having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

Assumption: All Malsenians have heard recorded music.
Assumption: There are enough live performance being held.

The argument assumes which one of the following?
(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.
Even if we consider this assumption that some of the new Malsenian buyers have access to classical concerts, it doesnt support author's conclusion. If ALL or MOST of the Malsenian buyers had access to concerts, then this were a valid choice.

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Director
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28 Aug 2007, 11:43
I bet this is not from any standard GMAT material. I doubt they expect us to be such analytical in GMAT.
My GMAT head still hurts from this CR

I wonder what is the source of this?

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28 Aug 2007, 19:49
asaf wrote:
I bet this is not from any standard GMAT material. I doubt they expect us to be such analytical in GMAT.
My GMAT head still hurts from this CR

I wonder what is the source of this?

Well such CRs are always from LSAT. People say that GAMT never asks such difficult questions but what about the CAT system. I mean with every right question, the difficulty level is increased. So is it increased to such a high level????

Well all things aside there are two important posts to read. One supports answer B and the other supports answer C. And yes the OA is C and Now I too agree that C makes more sense. but I am a little skeptical about the meaning of "some" being discussed in this post. In logic some means at least one and at least one may mean anything from one to one less than all. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Here are the two Posts

For B.
Quote:
Though the official answer is C, it does not make sense.

Even if number of concerts have decreased, it does not provide a reason for the shrinking audience. The passage has the following sentence:

"Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia". The first hand meaning of this could be that the audience at each of the concerts is shrinking. (and not that the TOTAL audience for concerts in Malsenia was shrinking. If we derive this meaning, then your reasoning could be correct)

Furthermore, look at the wording of C closely.

The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

The BOLD part is imporatant. It suggests that the reduction in audience has ALREADY occured first and in response to that, the number of concert has not reduced. If the reduction in audience has taken place first, what was the reason for that reduction?

To be correct, I think this choice should have been written as follows:

"The lower number of concerts has not lead to the shrinking audience"

I answered this question with B.

My reasoning was: Choice B inicate that the new audience was recommended to attend the concerts, and inspite of that the audience is shrinking at the concerts. So this basically supports the conclusion.

Another way of looking at it would be, negating the choice. If you negate choice B, it would result in : None of the new records buyer were recommended/informed about attending the concerts. So that can provide the alternative explanation for the shrinking concert audience. So the argument "new people are more comfortable with records because there is a shrinking audience at the concerts" does not stand. IN fact, it becomes " the new people are more comfirtable with records because they have not been recommended/informed about attending the concerts".

I would like to invite other comments. The official answer could be wrong.

For C
Quote:
Let us forget about the wording part of choice C. Do you agree with the following part from my earlier post?

Even if number of concerts have decreased, it does not provide a reason for the shrinking audience. The passage has the following sentence:

"Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia". The first hand meaning of this could be that the audience at each of the concerts is shrinking. (and not that the TOTAL audience for concerts in Malsenia was shrinking. If we derive this meaning, then your reasoning could be correct)

Also I think you misread the choice B. There is no word OPTION in choice B. It is about OPINION. Please reread the choice and then go through my reasoning for choice B again in my earlier post.

CB

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CEO
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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR. [#permalink]

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28 Aug 2007, 20:33
computer-bot wrote:
OK I am going to give you the disputed answers since this CR has been discussed earlier without any final answer and explanation. The disputed options are B and D but the OA is C. To me both B and C make sense but in GMAT, most such questions have the OA C.

In Malsenia sales of classical records are soaring. The buyers responsible for this boom are quite new to classical music and were drawn to it either by classical scores from television commercials or by theme tunes introducing major sports events on television. Audiences at classical concerts, however, are continually shrinking in Malsenia. It can be concluded from this that the new Malsenian converts to classical music, having initially experienced this music as recorded music, are most comfortable with classical music as recorded music and really have no desire to hear live performances.

The argument assumes which one of the following?

(A) To sell well in Malsenia, a classical record must include at least one piece familiar from television.

(B) At least some of the new Malsenian buyers of classical records have available to them the option of attending classical concerts.

(C) The number of classical concerts performed in Malsenia has not decreased in response to smaller audiences.

(D) The classical records available in Malsenia are, for the most part, not recordings of actual public concerts.

(E) Classical concerts in Malsenia are not limited to music that is readily available on recordings.

CB

Ya it is C. Its the reverse causation type assumption or (alternate models of causation). These are among the hardest type of CR's you will ever see.

For those of you whom have the CR MGMAT guide see chapter 4.

Lets take another example: Pulling it straight from the CR MGMAT guide:

Economists have noticed that countries with more developed cultures of entrepreneurship and risk-taking have higher economic growth rates. Therefore, they have concluded that cultures of entrepreneurship and risk-taking generate higher rates of growth overtime.

The argument assumes the OPPOSITE IS NOT TRUE. The argument assumes that higher economic growth rates do not cause more developed cultures of entrepreneurship.

essentially X--->Y Not Y--->X

Again these are among the hardest CR problems, and you don't always understand why the assumption is alternate model of causation. But if you practice a few of these type of CRs ul begin to see when these type of assumps are needed or at least when they are among the answer choices... this should sound alarm bells and cause you to stop and think

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Re: All all those who think they are good at CR.   [#permalink] 28 Aug 2007, 20:33
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