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16 Nov 2022, 18:05
Kudos
Bookmarks
Harvard and Yale Law Schools drop out of US News Law School Rankings
Reason - seems like too much emphasis on Test Scores.
Just saw this article in NY Times.
I know someone will say this is law school and what does it have to do with MBA? These are Harvard and Yale law schools, which were ranked number one and they are dropping from the US news rankings. I believe Yale was ranked number one for the last 30 years in a row, and apparently they’re not happy with the rankings. One thing is for your number five a number 10 schools to drop out. It’s very different when number one and two drop out.
I suspect that other departments/schools may follow suit within Harvard and Yale, and so business school and undergraduate institutions may also withdraw from US News rankings, which would basically mean who cares about the rankings if the top programs are not there?
Do you think it will spread to MBA Rankings?
Meanwhile, Yale and Harvard, just in one blow put US news, rankings into question, at least for law schools, but if there’s a problem with the US News Rankings methodology, I assume it applies to all other methodologies as well…
Interesting enough, we pointed out flaws and problems with the US news rankings in our review a year ago, https://gmatclub.com/forum/what-us-news ... 55274.html and came up with our own rankings to accommodate for inefficiencies and problems that US News rankings had… of course the problem is that as an accurate and troubled US news rankings are, they are the most reliable In this space…. So it is like a rug getting pulled from under your feet 🥴😱
Full Article:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/16/us/y ... ticleShare
nightblade354 and Regenerate - what do you think?
Posted from my mobile device
Reason - seems like too much emphasis on Test Scores.
Just saw this article in NY Times.
I know someone will say this is law school and what does it have to do with MBA? These are Harvard and Yale law schools, which were ranked number one and they are dropping from the US news rankings. I believe Yale was ranked number one for the last 30 years in a row, and apparently they’re not happy with the rankings. One thing is for your number five a number 10 schools to drop out. It’s very different when number one and two drop out.
I suspect that other departments/schools may follow suit within Harvard and Yale, and so business school and undergraduate institutions may also withdraw from US News rankings, which would basically mean who cares about the rankings if the top programs are not there?
Do you think it will spread to MBA Rankings?
Meanwhile, Yale and Harvard, just in one blow put US news, rankings into question, at least for law schools, but if there’s a problem with the US News Rankings methodology, I assume it applies to all other methodologies as well…
Interesting enough, we pointed out flaws and problems with the US news rankings in our review a year ago, https://gmatclub.com/forum/what-us-news ... 55274.html and came up with our own rankings to accommodate for inefficiencies and problems that US News rankings had… of course the problem is that as an accurate and troubled US news rankings are, they are the most reliable In this space…. So it is like a rug getting pulled from under your feet 🥴😱
Quote:
Full Article:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/16/us/y ... ticleShare
nightblade354 and Regenerate - what do you think?
Posted from my mobile device
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16 Nov 2022, 18:17
Kudos
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Some interesting quotes:
I was not sure how US News was making money off the rankings… or how things relate….
Posted from my mobile device
I was not sure how US News was making money off the rankings… or how things relate….
Quote:
Quote:
Posted from my mobile device
nightblade354
Expert
Current Student
Joined: 31 Jul 2017
Last visit: 23 Aug 2026
Posts: 1,756
Given Kudos: 3,307
Status:He came. He saw. He conquered. -- Going to Business School -- Corruptus in Extremis
Location: United States (MA)
Concentration: Finance, Economics
Schools: Darden '25 (M)
Expert reply
17 Nov 2022, 07:44
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Bookmarks
I was just talking about rankings the other day, and how flawed they are in general. While I may have a bias towards certain schools, I have never understood the reasoning behind US News' methodology -- specifically why GPA and GMAT/GRE/GMAT/LSAT mean so much when statistically there is little to no difference after a certain point.
As for schools deciding to back out, I think this can either create a lot of good or a lot bad. As discussed, the methodology is flawed. Yale points that out and says that they are forced to play by US News' game to maintain rankings, which is in contradiction to the idea that quality education = higher ranking. This is where the good comes from. Once you prove yourself and your abilities, you don't need a 175 (750 on the GMAT) to get into a good business or law school. You would need the benchmark of, say, 700 or 170 (LSAT) and then have good experience. The bad will be that rankings do play an important role. Without them, there is no uniform way to measure schools. So new versions will crop up, one way or another. Do they focus on the right things? Maybe. Or maybe it devolves into something worse and students are forced to guess and/or go with brand-names.
And to your point bb, Yale is the best law school in the country, bar none. They are the top. Harvard Law and Stanford almost always take the second and third spots. Will this benefit some of the T-10 or T15? Hard to say. But it will be interesting to see how it plays out. Power vacuums create a lot of chaos in the interim.
As for schools deciding to back out, I think this can either create a lot of good or a lot bad. As discussed, the methodology is flawed. Yale points that out and says that they are forced to play by US News' game to maintain rankings, which is in contradiction to the idea that quality education = higher ranking. This is where the good comes from. Once you prove yourself and your abilities, you don't need a 175 (750 on the GMAT) to get into a good business or law school. You would need the benchmark of, say, 700 or 170 (LSAT) and then have good experience. The bad will be that rankings do play an important role. Without them, there is no uniform way to measure schools. So new versions will crop up, one way or another. Do they focus on the right things? Maybe. Or maybe it devolves into something worse and students are forced to guess and/or go with brand-names.
And to your point bb, Yale is the best law school in the country, bar none. They are the top. Harvard Law and Stanford almost always take the second and third spots. Will this benefit some of the T-10 or T15? Hard to say. But it will be interesting to see how it plays out. Power vacuums create a lot of chaos in the interim.
17 Nov 2022, 09:57
Kudos
Bookmarks
"I know someone will say this is law school and what does it have to do with MBA? These are Harvard and Yale law schools, which were ranked number one and they are dropping from the US news rankings."
It has A LOT to do with MBA. When the news came out, a number of b-school dean friends started chatting about it. Especially after the news about Kellogg offering test waivers to people who got caught up in the tech industry lay offs.
The only remaining major thing that is still propping the use of tests in MBA admissions are the rankings. As trust in the rankings continues to wane, so will the usefulness of the tests. Ten years from now, assessment of academic readiness for a top MBA program will not look the way it does today.
It has A LOT to do with MBA. When the news came out, a number of b-school dean friends started chatting about it. Especially after the news about Kellogg offering test waivers to people who got caught up in the tech industry lay offs.
The only remaining major thing that is still propping the use of tests in MBA admissions are the rankings. As trust in the rankings continues to wane, so will the usefulness of the tests. Ten years from now, assessment of academic readiness for a top MBA program will not look the way it does today.
