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The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman

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Re: The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 23 Mar 2017, 15:47
Split 1: that vs of.
Term that the Roman Catholic Church vs. Term of the Roman Catholic Church
It's weird to say that term was proclaimed, hence 'of'. (I'm not sure on this one, please comment)

Better split:
A) that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, not referring to the conception of Jesus, which, according to Christianity, occurred miraculously despite his mother Mary being a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that they believe this conception occurred with

B) that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, did not refer to the conception of Jesus, which, as Christianity says, occurred miraculously even though his mother Mary was a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to be occurring by

C) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, referring not to the conception of Jesus, that in Christianity occurred miraculously with his mother Mary being a virgin, and to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to have occurred in

D) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, refers not to the conception of Jesus, which, according to Christianity, occurred miraculously even though his mother Mary was a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to have occurred by

E) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, referred not to the conception of Jesus, that, as Christianity says, occurred miraculously when his mother Mary was a virgin, and to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that they believe this conception occurred by
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Re: The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jun 2017, 00:05
mikemcgarry

Sir, I have found that you ,sometimes, create tricky questions by applying the exception of noun modifier touch rule,specially while using "which". One example is this question and another one is the question with Cloud Monet

"Between 1892 and 1893, Claude Monet produced a series of paintings of the Rouen Cathedral, revised in his studio in 1894, and with the French public receiving it as an emblem of all that was noble about their history and customs."

Now Sir, I have found that the touch rule can be lifted only when a noun hides in a prepositional phrase.Now my question is why,in this question, the use of which is not ambiguous?
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Re: The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jun 2017, 07:58
Very beautiful question
Meaning plays a very important part in questions such as this .
D has all the correct modifier
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Re: The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jun 2017, 09:56
techiesam wrote:
mikemcgarry

Sir, I have found that you ,sometimes, create tricky questions by applying the exception of noun modifier touch rule,specially while using "which". One example is this question and another one is the question with Cloud Monet

"Between 1892 and 1893, Claude Monet produced a series of paintings of the Rouen Cathedral, revised in his studio in 1894, and with the French public receiving it as an emblem of all that was noble about their history and customs."

Now Sir, I have found that the touch rule can be lifted only when a noun hides in a prepositional phrase.Now my question is why,in this question, the use of which is not ambiguous?

Dear techiesam,

I'm happy to respond. :-)

My friend, you may have heard me say before that the GMAT SC is NOT simply a test a grammar. In fact, it is a test of grammar, logic, and rhetoric all at once. You are trying to answer a logic question with grammatical means. That's like someone deciding whether a novel is well-written by the font used: it's at a completely different level of analysis.

The relationship of a noun modifier to a noun is one of logic, and the grammar simply supports this logical relationship. Of course, the clearest and most common way to show this logical relationship is to have the noun and the noun modifier touching each other, hence the widespread use of the Touch Rule. The Touch Rule is simply a consequence of this fundamental logical relationship: it's the most basic way to demonstrate the relationship between noun and noun-modifier.

To understand the most important exception to the Touch Rule pattern, you need to understand vital noun modifiers. You have to analyze the logic and decide whether any modifier is vital or not vital. Similarly, when a phrase, such as "according to Christianity" in (D) of this question, is set off between two comma, that is called a parenthetical remark or an aside. This is an extra little bit of information that the author throws in: it 100% removable and always understood not to interrupt any grammatical or logical relationships, so of course one of these always can come between a noun and noun modifier.

My friend, there is absolutely no way to get to GMAT SC mastery simply by learning some mythical "complete" collection of rules. You have to develop intuition for the language, and the only way you do this is to develop the habit of reading. See:
How to Improve Your GMAT Verbal Score

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)
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The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 30 Mar 2018, 10:52
mikemcgarry wrote:
Marcab wrote:
Hii Mike.
So in the answer choices, is "proclaimed" being used as a "participle" and not a "verb"? If it is the case, then the question is crystal clear now.
Thanks in advance.

Dear Marcab,

This is one of the devilish things about this question ------
In the answers with the word "that"
... a doctrine that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854,
the whole segment from the word "that" to the comma is a subordinate clause, a "that"-clause --- the words "Roman Catholic Church" is the subject of the clause and "proclaimed" is the verb of the clause, a bonafide real verb. Clauses always have a bonafide noun-subject and bonafide verb.

BUT
In the answers with the word "of"
... a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854,
now, the phrase "of the Roman Catholic Church" is just a prepositional phrase, a self-contained modifier, and the word "proclaimed" (same spelling!) now functions as a participle modifying the word "doctrine." It is not a full bonafide verb, but merely a participle, a modifier.

When I designed this question, I included this split, setting it up so the exact same form of the verb, proclaimed, same spelling and everything, would be used in some of the answers as a verb and in others as a participle. This is one of the harder features of the question to recognize.

Does all this make sense?

Mike :-)



Hi mikemcgarry

Reviewing your explanation ...understood what is being said ...

However, what is the implication ?

Can i eliminate the answer choices based on this information alone ?

Also just wondering, from a GMAT perspective -- what are rules for usage between a prepositional phrase

vs

usage for a subordinate clause (that + clause)

Any differences in rules between them ?

Thank you !
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The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman [#permalink]

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New post 16 Apr 2018, 05:07
mikemcgarry wrote:
The term “Immaculate Conception,” a doctrine that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, not referring to the conception of Jesus, which, according to Christianity, occurred miraculously despite his mother Mary being a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that they believe this conception occurred with ordinary procreative means.


(A) that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, not referring to the conception of Jesus, which, according to Christianity, occurred miraculously despite his mother Mary being a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that they believe this conception occurred with

(B) that the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, did not refer to the conception of Jesus, that, as Christianity says, occurred miraculously even though his mother Mary was a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to be occurring by

(C) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, referring not to the conception of Jesus, that in Christianity occurred miraculously with his mother Mary being a virgin, and to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to have occurred in

(D) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, refers not to the conception of Jesus, which, according to Christianity, occurred miraculously even though his mother Mary was a virgin, but to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that this conception is believed to have occurred by

(E) of the Roman Catholic Church formally proclaimed in 1854, referred not to the conception of Jesus, that, as Christianity says, occurred miraculously when his mother Mary was a virgin, and to the conception of Mary in the womb of her mother, Anne, despite the fact that they believe this conception occurred by

We need "but" in place of "and " to show the contrast.

"They" is not correct as we don't have any plural noun.

Correct parallelism is "not to - but to".

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The term Immaculate Conception , a doctrine that the Roman   [#permalink] 16 Apr 2018, 05:07

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