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27 Jul 2020, 01:36
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Prices - "Let's not be coy here, PT students are gifted access to the prestige that is earned by full-time students. If you broke off the part-time program and entered it the full-time U.S. News rankings, it would land in the 25-30 range (e.g. 680 GMAT for PT vs 730 GMAT for FT). This wouldn't be a problem if it was clear who attended which program, but PT students are notorious for hiding the fact that they went PT (e.g. falsely listing two years of attendance on LinkedIn, quitting their job and attending FT classes)."
While I don't attend Booth, I do attend the PT program at Kellogg, which is comparable to Booth, and I have to say that you are pretty off-base here. We are not being "gifted" absolutely anything from you. We complete the exact same coursework as you do while also working a full-time job (and pre-COVID, many of us were commuting every week also). Absolutely everyone who gets through the PT program can get through the FT program, but many people in the FT program would get burned out before they could complete the PT program. So, you need not feel morally or academically superior to us. For the record, I, myself, scored a 730 (48Q, 42V) on the GMAT, which is right in line with the average/median GMAT score of students enrolled in the FT M7 programs. Not only that, but I am currently in my second quarter at Kellogg and have been taking 2.5 credits both this quarter and the previous quarter, which is only half a credit less than a fairly typical course load for FT students who don't work a full-time job the way I do (and yes, I know I misplaced my modifier, but I don't care since I don't ever have to take the GMAT again). So, you will really have to forgive me for not feeling inferior or feeling that I am being gifted anything.
Yes, I will concede that getting admitted into the PT program is, significantly, easier, but there is good reason for that. It's because far fewer people are willing to do the work needed to get a top 15 MBA while working a full-time job. Even though the PT program has less selective admissions and admits people year-round, the total number of people enrolling in the PT program every year is still far less than the number of people enrolling in the FT program every year. So, I don't see what's wrong here. MBA admissions are a holistic process, and it, absolutely, makes sense for a business school to value the ability and work ethic to get an MBA while working full-time over a 50 point GMAT difference. Ask yourself this. If you were an employer, which would mean more to you: the ability and work ethic to get a top 15 MBA while working full-time or the difference between scoring in the top 15% and scoring in the top 4% on a pretty arbitrary test (two people who score as high as a 730 can still have very different abilities due to the nature of the test, so don't try to tell me that test is the be-all and end-all of anything)? Universities like Booth, Kellogg, and Ross are not dumb. If PT students were as unqualified as you seem to suggest, then these universities would never admit them as they wouldn't want them diluting their brand.
I will also concede that it's pretty lame and insecure for the PT students to be hiding the fact that they are PT if that's what they are doing. At the same time though, I think it's incredibly sad that so many FT students at Booth are, apparently, so spiteful, insecure, and judgmental that the PT students feel they have to do that. And to be honest, I never hear about these kinds of things happening at Kellogg or Ross, but I have read multiple threads where FT Booth students whine about the PT students. Is this what business school is supposed to be about? Looking down upon and judging your classmates? Or hiding who you are and pretending to be something you are not in case of the PT students? If this is the culture at Booth, then I am thrilled that I didn't end up there. I think the FT students are just insecure that they couldn't get into Harvard, Stanford, or Wharton and just like to beat up on the PT students to feel better about themselves while the PT students are insecure that they couldn't get into the FT program. And I think that is sad because Booth is a terrific university, and anyone who gets an MBA from Booth should feel incredibly proud, whether he/she did FT or PT.
While I don't attend Booth, I do attend the PT program at Kellogg, which is comparable to Booth, and I have to say that you are pretty off-base here. We are not being "gifted" absolutely anything from you. We complete the exact same coursework as you do while also working a full-time job (and pre-COVID, many of us were commuting every week also). Absolutely everyone who gets through the PT program can get through the FT program, but many people in the FT program would get burned out before they could complete the PT program. So, you need not feel morally or academically superior to us. For the record, I, myself, scored a 730 (48Q, 42V) on the GMAT, which is right in line with the average/median GMAT score of students enrolled in the FT M7 programs. Not only that, but I am currently in my second quarter at Kellogg and have been taking 2.5 credits both this quarter and the previous quarter, which is only half a credit less than a fairly typical course load for FT students who don't work a full-time job the way I do (and yes, I know I misplaced my modifier, but I don't care since I don't ever have to take the GMAT again). So, you will really have to forgive me for not feeling inferior or feeling that I am being gifted anything.
Yes, I will concede that getting admitted into the PT program is, significantly, easier, but there is good reason for that. It's because far fewer people are willing to do the work needed to get a top 15 MBA while working a full-time job. Even though the PT program has less selective admissions and admits people year-round, the total number of people enrolling in the PT program every year is still far less than the number of people enrolling in the FT program every year. So, I don't see what's wrong here. MBA admissions are a holistic process, and it, absolutely, makes sense for a business school to value the ability and work ethic to get an MBA while working full-time over a 50 point GMAT difference. Ask yourself this. If you were an employer, which would mean more to you: the ability and work ethic to get a top 15 MBA while working full-time or the difference between scoring in the top 15% and scoring in the top 4% on a pretty arbitrary test (two people who score as high as a 730 can still have very different abilities due to the nature of the test, so don't try to tell me that test is the be-all and end-all of anything)? Universities like Booth, Kellogg, and Ross are not dumb. If PT students were as unqualified as you seem to suggest, then these universities would never admit them as they wouldn't want them diluting their brand.
I will also concede that it's pretty lame and insecure for the PT students to be hiding the fact that they are PT if that's what they are doing. At the same time though, I think it's incredibly sad that so many FT students at Booth are, apparently, so spiteful, insecure, and judgmental that the PT students feel they have to do that. And to be honest, I never hear about these kinds of things happening at Kellogg or Ross, but I have read multiple threads where FT Booth students whine about the PT students. Is this what business school is supposed to be about? Looking down upon and judging your classmates? Or hiding who you are and pretending to be something you are not in case of the PT students? If this is the culture at Booth, then I am thrilled that I didn't end up there. I think the FT students are just insecure that they couldn't get into Harvard, Stanford, or Wharton and just like to beat up on the PT students to feel better about themselves while the PT students are insecure that they couldn't get into the FT program. And I think that is sad because Booth is a terrific university, and anyone who gets an MBA from Booth should feel incredibly proud, whether he/she did FT or PT.
enger2021mba
Joined: 14 Jul 2020
Last visit: 10 Mar 2022
Posts: 3
Given Kudos: 2
Location: United States (IL)
Concentration: Finance, Strategy
Schools: Booth PT '23 (M)
GMAT 1: 660 Q48 V34
GPA: 3.87
WE:Engineering (Manufacturing)
Updated on: 10 Mar 2022, 14:55
Originally posted by enger2021mba on 08 Nov 2021, 14:35.
Last edited by enger2021mba on 10 Mar 2022, 14:55, edited 3 times in total.
Last edited by enger2021mba on 10 Mar 2022, 14:55, edited 3 times in total.
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I am at Booth as an Evening MBA Student. Started Summer Quarter 2021. The PT (part-time) program feels very isolated from the rest of Booth and is Way overpriced for what you are getting.
PT students at Booth are treated like second-class citizens when it comes to access to university services and student clubs/groups outside-the-classroom.
Booth does everything within their power to separate FT and PT students and Booth doesn't do anything to help facilitate networking between the two groups:
-Separate Slack Forum Channels
-Separate Student Groups/Clubs (47 PT groups vs 153 FT groups as of Fall 2021)
-Separate academic advisors
-Separate Career advisors
-Separate Buildings for classes (Booth doesn't give PT students access to the FT building, Harper Center, by default btw)
-Separate Email distribution lists and access to school and employer events. (PT students don't get notified about all the same cool events available to FT students due to email distribution list separation)
-Separate requirements for access to online career services systems (PT students need to have completed at least 12 of 20 classes to have access to campus recruiting or employer events).
-More restricted access to employers, career fairs, and recruiting.
-Far fewer scholarship/fellowship opportunities
The majority of the really cool and network-building international group trips, outdoor activities, and sport clubs are within the FT student clubs/groups (47 PT groups vs 153 FT groups) . PT students are not allow to join FT clubs by default. PT students need to request specific approval to join by the FT club co-chairs. I have seen multiple instances of PT students (myself and others) being deliberately excluded/denied from joining FT clubs and their events. Typically the denial will look like this:
-FT club Co-Chair says there are a limited number of people who can join a club and they prioritize FT students and their spouses. Thus blocking out PT students. This is the case for all the popular clubs.
-FT club Co-Chair says there is an equivalent PT version of the club and PT students should join that club instead... yet the PT version of the club has far fewer events and much smaller membership.
Booth admissions misleads PT applicants to what the school experience actually is for PT students... the stuff outside the classroom. The school itself runs a segregated separate-but-equal treatment between PT and FT students, but it is not equal in any regard except for coursework, yet all the PT students are paying the same amount to be at Booth as FT students. The Booth PT cohort is not a cohort at all, rather just a dispersion of students all turning though the program and brining extra cash to the university.
PT students at Booth are treated like second-class citizens when it comes to access to university services and student clubs/groups outside-the-classroom.
Booth does everything within their power to separate FT and PT students and Booth doesn't do anything to help facilitate networking between the two groups:
-Separate Slack Forum Channels
-Separate Student Groups/Clubs (47 PT groups vs 153 FT groups as of Fall 2021)
-Separate academic advisors
-Separate Career advisors
-Separate Buildings for classes (Booth doesn't give PT students access to the FT building, Harper Center, by default btw)
-Separate Email distribution lists and access to school and employer events. (PT students don't get notified about all the same cool events available to FT students due to email distribution list separation)
-Separate requirements for access to online career services systems (PT students need to have completed at least 12 of 20 classes to have access to campus recruiting or employer events).
-More restricted access to employers, career fairs, and recruiting.
-Far fewer scholarship/fellowship opportunities
The majority of the really cool and network-building international group trips, outdoor activities, and sport clubs are within the FT student clubs/groups (47 PT groups vs 153 FT groups) . PT students are not allow to join FT clubs by default. PT students need to request specific approval to join by the FT club co-chairs. I have seen multiple instances of PT students (myself and others) being deliberately excluded/denied from joining FT clubs and their events. Typically the denial will look like this:
-FT club Co-Chair says there are a limited number of people who can join a club and they prioritize FT students and their spouses. Thus blocking out PT students. This is the case for all the popular clubs.
-FT club Co-Chair says there is an equivalent PT version of the club and PT students should join that club instead... yet the PT version of the club has far fewer events and much smaller membership.
Booth admissions misleads PT applicants to what the school experience actually is for PT students... the stuff outside the classroom. The school itself runs a segregated separate-but-equal treatment between PT and FT students, but it is not equal in any regard except for coursework, yet all the PT students are paying the same amount to be at Booth as FT students. The Booth PT cohort is not a cohort at all, rather just a dispersion of students all turning though the program and brining extra cash to the university.
01 Dec 2021, 08:53
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M7730 Would you mind sharing how things are structured at Kellogg as compared to what the poster below mentions at Booth (apartheid basically) That would be helpful to me and my clients.
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M7730
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