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Updated on: 15 Apr 2012, 22:18
Originally posted by novanative on 13 Apr 2012, 22:00.
Last edited by novanative on 15 Apr 2012, 22:18, edited 9 times in total.
Last edited by novanative on 15 Apr 2012, 22:18, edited 9 times in total.
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The background story
I applied to three part time business schools in the Washington area. I applied to Georgetown's, Maryland's, and GW's part time programs, where I got waitlisted by Georgetown, but accepted to Maryland and GW. GW also offered me a scholarship which is $4-5K depending on credit prices this fall.
While I'm happy going to Maryland or GW, the bottom line is that Georgetown is the best school in the area, and if accepted, I'd take it even though I only can use loans. I took the GMAT twice before, but ended up with a 640 with varying quant and verbal splits:
Nov 2011 GMAT - 640 (47Q, 32 V)
Dec 2011 GMAT - 640 (43Q, 34 V)
Both times, I felt like my verbal ability was better than what showed up on the test, because I usually averaged in the mid 30's (35-36). My quant averages were typically in the mid 40's anyway, so the first GMAT I had basically showed a score that was a bit high for me. I applied to all the schools in January after the second GMAT, including G-Town's 1st round, Maryland's 2nd round, and GW has rolling admission. Fortunately my overall app bought me an interview to G-Town, which I thought went smoothly, but I kinda knew from the get go an outright admit was a stretch because both my GMAT and my GPA didn't quite hit the medians for the Georgetown incoming class for its part time MBA program.
Test Experience
I took this test in Bethesda, Maryland, near the heart of its downtown. Bethesda is about 10 miles northwest of Washington's downtown though it's literally two miles or so from the border.. The staff there was very friendly and laid back. Called me often by my first name.
The AWA section went smoothly. The second essay took me longer to write. I finished it, and barely finished proofreading it. Didn't have time to hit next and confirm when time was called. It's my understanding that the essay will still show up so no worries.
Quant went fine I believe, but I felt that the GMAT math section was harder than what I encountered in practice. The verbal section I felt went smoothly. At the end, I saw that I got a 660 (43Q, 38 V). I am overall happy because of these reasons:
1. No section got worse, especially quant.
2. My verbal score was considerably higher than the second GMAT I took.
3. My score moved me up from potentially the 25th percentile of incoming students to the median. I know the point increase was only 20 points, but these 20 points were really big and were likely a factor in why I got waitlisted. My undergrad GPA is around a 3.1 (give or take .02 GPA points), and the mean GPA is 3.32 (median probably around the same level). Having a GPA and GMAT below the median for any particular school, even if both measures are close to the median rarely equals acceptance unless the standards drop considerably one way or another, or I have some really exceptional characteristic somewhere. So in short, the Georgetown students who had a 640 GMAT or lower probably had stronger GPA's in college to even this breakdown out, though the GMAT is obviously a heck of a lot more important than GPA is considering work experience and other post-college factors.
In short when I was given my status update, Georgetown's waitlist letter suggested (probably to everyone) that applicants with a below average GMAT test retake the exam. Now that I have met the median for the GMAT and now that my score is presumably higher than most applicants' (640 was the median score for Georgetown applicants), I now have a stronger shot at admission, because Georgetown has one more round left and my app will be considered with the 2nd rounders from what I was told in January by the admissions office, and I didn't ask for this (really, I didn't).
https://www.businessweek.com/bschools/ra ... etown.html
Why I don't feel super happy
1. It was only a 20 point jump in terms of raw points. If I got a 670 or 680, it would make my chances much stronger.
2. The quant score was still not exactly where I would have liked. I felt that my quant score should have been higher, but I'm not the computer.
3. If I had a good day on quant plus the 38 verbal score, I could have had a 690 or 700 possibly. Maybe the adcom will see that I max out at a 47 on quant, but I'm not a math whiz, banker, or an engineer. However, they still will see that 47 score as potential or as a lucky day? At this point, I'm just happy about that 660.
Books & materials used
I had a $25 gift card from Amazon my sister gave me for X-Mas, so I used it to buy the Official Guide, 13th edition. I reviewed by doing the problems that were previously unreleased in the 12th edition, in particular for the verbal. I of course refreshed in math, which is my "weaker" section.
I had two tests left over from Manhattan. Took one and got a 720 (44Q, 45V). I took this with a grain of salt because Manhattan has some weird scoring algorithms, my real GMAT scores were considerably under the Manhattan scores based on my strengths and weaknesses I assume, and I got really lucky toward the end of the verbal section imo, but I'll take it. The 45 in Verbal was my best score by far in any practice test administration, so I assumed that I had potential for a high 30's score on the real thing. Took GMATPrep tests again and got 690 and 700. There were a couple repeat questions, but after seeing the test results, I felt that another GMAT try was worth it.
Length of study
I got waitlisted on March 23, so I did some study refreshing each weekday after work. Took one CAT a week.
General strategy
The thing is that I was already taken at two schools, so to some extent, I didn't feel much pressure. If I bombed the test, had a score of slightly under 640, or ended up with a 640 again, I would have kept myself on the Georgetown waitlist, accept whatever outcome came next, but I would also put down a deposit on a school soon after so I know that I can go to school this fall because my Georgetown chances are probably not any better, if not possibly worse. I've leaned toward GW over Maryland because it offers the most flexible curriculum and have met some successful students in their program through visits. Though I don't absolutely have to have flexibility right now (Georgetown has a lockstep part time program for all three years), I can't predict the next four years of my life either. Only Georgetown could trump a flex MBA right now.
Words of Advice
Don't think about your score at any time during the test until after the end of the verbal section. Focus only on ONE question at a time, because you can never go back to it after you hit next and confirm. It's a cliché, but I had to consciously think about that over the last couple weeks. This goes in particular for retakers because of a waitlist where we are really aiming for a certain score. Worrying about this during the exam will probably not help you to say the least. I went to the December test thinking like that during the test.
Take EVERY break and use as many of the eight minutes up as possible.
For guys retaking the GMAT because of a below average score, I would say to keep sanity, understand that you don't have to aim for a 50-60 point increase or bust, in particular if your GMAT puts you in the 25th percentile of incoming students. The 25th and 75th percentile scores are released by most schools on Businessweek, not US News nor the schools themselves. I like this middle 50% range much better actually because it shows where that middle group truly is while the 10th to 90th range starts to show some of the outlying students both from the upper and lower ends, and it may be a marketing tactic for schools to say that they have some students with above a 720, but the 10th percentile score may be used to encourage lower scoring candidates to apply where most students with such scores will only help the acceptance rate for that school, if you know what I mean.
That said, if you were waitlisted to a school and your GMAT was closer to the 10th percentile, then yes, you will likely need a bigger increase to meet the median, and perhaps you may very well need 50 points to meet the median, but it is also possible that you may not need that many points to get accepted because your GPA is likely higher than the median, and you likely have some great recs, work accomplishments, etc.
For guys who scored closer to the 25th percentile than the 10th percentile, even a 30 or 20 point increase, even a 10 point increase at some schools could move your score up as much as 25 percentile points among the applicant pool and ultimately the incoming student pool. Sometimes a bit more than that. Moving up within the applicant pool is going to be more important than moving up in raw score numbers, especially when your score is in the middle 50 percentile (25/75) range.
*****
So I am happy that I at least accomplished my mission to meet a median in a key metric I can control (GMAT).
I applied to three part time business schools in the Washington area. I applied to Georgetown's, Maryland's, and GW's part time programs, where I got waitlisted by Georgetown, but accepted to Maryland and GW. GW also offered me a scholarship which is $4-5K depending on credit prices this fall.
While I'm happy going to Maryland or GW, the bottom line is that Georgetown is the best school in the area, and if accepted, I'd take it even though I only can use loans. I took the GMAT twice before, but ended up with a 640 with varying quant and verbal splits:
Nov 2011 GMAT - 640 (47Q, 32 V)
Dec 2011 GMAT - 640 (43Q, 34 V)
Both times, I felt like my verbal ability was better than what showed up on the test, because I usually averaged in the mid 30's (35-36). My quant averages were typically in the mid 40's anyway, so the first GMAT I had basically showed a score that was a bit high for me. I applied to all the schools in January after the second GMAT, including G-Town's 1st round, Maryland's 2nd round, and GW has rolling admission. Fortunately my overall app bought me an interview to G-Town, which I thought went smoothly, but I kinda knew from the get go an outright admit was a stretch because both my GMAT and my GPA didn't quite hit the medians for the Georgetown incoming class for its part time MBA program.
Test Experience
I took this test in Bethesda, Maryland, near the heart of its downtown. Bethesda is about 10 miles northwest of Washington's downtown though it's literally two miles or so from the border.. The staff there was very friendly and laid back. Called me often by my first name.
The AWA section went smoothly. The second essay took me longer to write. I finished it, and barely finished proofreading it. Didn't have time to hit next and confirm when time was called. It's my understanding that the essay will still show up so no worries.
Quant went fine I believe, but I felt that the GMAT math section was harder than what I encountered in practice. The verbal section I felt went smoothly. At the end, I saw that I got a 660 (43Q, 38 V). I am overall happy because of these reasons:
1. No section got worse, especially quant.
2. My verbal score was considerably higher than the second GMAT I took.
3. My score moved me up from potentially the 25th percentile of incoming students to the median. I know the point increase was only 20 points, but these 20 points were really big and were likely a factor in why I got waitlisted. My undergrad GPA is around a 3.1 (give or take .02 GPA points), and the mean GPA is 3.32 (median probably around the same level). Having a GPA and GMAT below the median for any particular school, even if both measures are close to the median rarely equals acceptance unless the standards drop considerably one way or another, or I have some really exceptional characteristic somewhere. So in short, the Georgetown students who had a 640 GMAT or lower probably had stronger GPA's in college to even this breakdown out, though the GMAT is obviously a heck of a lot more important than GPA is considering work experience and other post-college factors.
In short when I was given my status update, Georgetown's waitlist letter suggested (probably to everyone) that applicants with a below average GMAT test retake the exam. Now that I have met the median for the GMAT and now that my score is presumably higher than most applicants' (640 was the median score for Georgetown applicants), I now have a stronger shot at admission, because Georgetown has one more round left and my app will be considered with the 2nd rounders from what I was told in January by the admissions office, and I didn't ask for this (really, I didn't).
https://www.businessweek.com/bschools/ra ... etown.html
Why I don't feel super happy
1. It was only a 20 point jump in terms of raw points. If I got a 670 or 680, it would make my chances much stronger.
2. The quant score was still not exactly where I would have liked. I felt that my quant score should have been higher, but I'm not the computer.
3. If I had a good day on quant plus the 38 verbal score, I could have had a 690 or 700 possibly. Maybe the adcom will see that I max out at a 47 on quant, but I'm not a math whiz, banker, or an engineer. However, they still will see that 47 score as potential or as a lucky day? At this point, I'm just happy about that 660.
Books & materials used
I had a $25 gift card from Amazon my sister gave me for X-Mas, so I used it to buy the Official Guide, 13th edition. I reviewed by doing the problems that were previously unreleased in the 12th edition, in particular for the verbal. I of course refreshed in math, which is my "weaker" section.
I had two tests left over from Manhattan. Took one and got a 720 (44Q, 45V). I took this with a grain of salt because Manhattan has some weird scoring algorithms, my real GMAT scores were considerably under the Manhattan scores based on my strengths and weaknesses I assume, and I got really lucky toward the end of the verbal section imo, but I'll take it. The 45 in Verbal was my best score by far in any practice test administration, so I assumed that I had potential for a high 30's score on the real thing. Took GMATPrep tests again and got 690 and 700. There were a couple repeat questions, but after seeing the test results, I felt that another GMAT try was worth it.
Length of study
I got waitlisted on March 23, so I did some study refreshing each weekday after work. Took one CAT a week.
General strategy
The thing is that I was already taken at two schools, so to some extent, I didn't feel much pressure. If I bombed the test, had a score of slightly under 640, or ended up with a 640 again, I would have kept myself on the Georgetown waitlist, accept whatever outcome came next, but I would also put down a deposit on a school soon after so I know that I can go to school this fall because my Georgetown chances are probably not any better, if not possibly worse. I've leaned toward GW over Maryland because it offers the most flexible curriculum and have met some successful students in their program through visits. Though I don't absolutely have to have flexibility right now (Georgetown has a lockstep part time program for all three years), I can't predict the next four years of my life either. Only Georgetown could trump a flex MBA right now.
Words of Advice
Don't think about your score at any time during the test until after the end of the verbal section. Focus only on ONE question at a time, because you can never go back to it after you hit next and confirm. It's a cliché, but I had to consciously think about that over the last couple weeks. This goes in particular for retakers because of a waitlist where we are really aiming for a certain score. Worrying about this during the exam will probably not help you to say the least. I went to the December test thinking like that during the test.
Take EVERY break and use as many of the eight minutes up as possible.
For guys retaking the GMAT because of a below average score, I would say to keep sanity, understand that you don't have to aim for a 50-60 point increase or bust, in particular if your GMAT puts you in the 25th percentile of incoming students. The 25th and 75th percentile scores are released by most schools on Businessweek, not US News nor the schools themselves. I like this middle 50% range much better actually because it shows where that middle group truly is while the 10th to 90th range starts to show some of the outlying students both from the upper and lower ends, and it may be a marketing tactic for schools to say that they have some students with above a 720, but the 10th percentile score may be used to encourage lower scoring candidates to apply where most students with such scores will only help the acceptance rate for that school, if you know what I mean.
That said, if you were waitlisted to a school and your GMAT was closer to the 10th percentile, then yes, you will likely need a bigger increase to meet the median, and perhaps you may very well need 50 points to meet the median, but it is also possible that you may not need that many points to get accepted because your GPA is likely higher than the median, and you likely have some great recs, work accomplishments, etc.
For guys who scored closer to the 25th percentile than the 10th percentile, even a 30 or 20 point increase, even a 10 point increase at some schools could move your score up as much as 25 percentile points among the applicant pool and ultimately the incoming student pool. Sometimes a bit more than that. Moving up within the applicant pool is going to be more important than moving up in raw score numbers, especially when your score is in the middle 50 percentile (25/75) range.
*****
So I am happy that I at least accomplished my mission to meet a median in a key metric I can control (GMAT).
Two64
Joined: 30 Mar 2012
Last visit: 27 Jun 2016
Posts: 140
Given Kudos: 14
Location: United States (TX)
Concentration: Strategy, Finance
Schools: McCombs PT '18 (A) McCombs '17 (WL)
GMAT 1: 670 Q45 V38
GPA: 2.64
WE:Supply Chain Management (Consumer Electronics)
Products:
15 Apr 2012, 02:52
Kudos
Bookmarks
Awesome and inspiring story. I agree that those twenty points could make a positive difference. For one, you've shown that you are active in your pursuit. That has to count for something to the admissions committee. Secondly, with your score, it's obviously much easier to stay flat or go down. In this case, a twenty point increase is much more meaningful than a twenty point decrease. Best of luck and please keep us in the loop!!!
novanative
Joined: 16 Aug 2011
Last visit: 14 Apr 2013
Posts: 378
Own Kudos:
Given Kudos: 50
Status:schools I listed were for the evening programs, not FT
Location: United States (VA)
Schools: McDonough '14 (WL) Smith (A)
GMAT 1: 640 Q43 V34
GMAT 2: 660 Q43 V38
GPA: 3.1
WE:Research (Other)
15 Apr 2012, 21:46
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Bookmarks
jxatrillion
Thanks. I never thought too much about it being easier staying flat or going down, especially these last couple weeks. But it is true that the higher someone scores on average, the harder it is to move the score up. Granted, a 640 may be below Georgetown's part time median, and pretty much every Top 25 Full Time MBA program's median. After all, we definitely see many guys here who are so disappointed with only a 680 or even a 700 sometimes in their debriefs because they want to go to a Top 25 or Top 10 school. But in the grand scheme of things, a 640 is essentially in the top 25 percentile of all scores too.
Either way, I'm really happy that I never had an overall score drop during any test examination, especially on this test in "overtime." Sure, this may still not be enough to get in, but I can't say that I didn't do everything I could at this point.
