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CarlosLaronda
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 03 Apr 2014, 14:53
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Hey, guys.

I just got my 7th ding of the season and I'm totally devastated.

I REALLY need help from you to get ready to reapply later this year.

Here's my profile:

25 years old / Male / Latin American
720 GMAT / 6.2 out of 10 GPA / 109 TOEFL
Undergraduate degree in Business - Top school
Work Experience: Advertising / 3 years
Applied to: GSB, Kellogg, Haas, UCLA, Duke, Columbia, Cornell, NYU

#Interviews: Cornell, Kellogg
#WL: NYU

I guess my red flags are: low GPA and work experience - only 3 years and no prestige companies (they're quite prestigious in the advertising industry, but unknown for the AdComs).

Also, I didn't visit any school, except for Cornell (on the day of my interview). My essays were fine but my recommendation letters were from former supervisors, not current.

What do you guys suggest I focus during the next six months? Should I retake GMAT and TOEFL? Should I take college-level courses to offset my GPA? Should I try to work as hard as I can to earn a promotion? Should I aim for lower-ranked schools? Should I focus on less targets? Should I visit all schools?

Any advice will be highly appreciated!

Thank you,

CarlosLaronda
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CriticalSquare
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 03 Apr 2014, 17:36
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Hey there,

I'm really sorry to hear you haven't had the best of luck in this process so far. I'm glad you're thinking proactively about what you can do to improve your chances for this fall.

First, the good news - you don't need to retake the GMAT or TOEFL. You have a great score! Your verbal is a little low but that's not the end of the world. Definitely doesn't warrant you retaking the test. And it probably wasn't what kept you out.

Now for the rest. Without looking at your application, it's close to impossible to give you pointers on what to work on. I'll say this - as for alternate classes, that could be a good idea. Your GPA is a little low. A class or two could definitely help. When it comes to school visits you really should make an effort of visiting as many as possible. As for your work experience - I have no idea what it is or the impact you had based on what you wrote. If it really is a well known agency in marketing, then that is prestige.

I'd love to help you out - 7 dings can be difficult to swallow. If you'd like to talk about your applications and what lies ahead, feel free to sign up to chat with us [here].

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask!

Bhavik
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gentlejack
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 02:05
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A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.
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GMAT 2: 720 Q48 V41
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 06:06
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gentlejack
A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.
Show more
The class ranking is a great tip: my GPA in Brazilian standards was 7.8 out of 10, but when I asked the school for a ranking statement I found out that I was ranked top 10% of the class. That ranking statement became part of my application and I think it worked fine.

We, latins, are from an underrepresented pool, your stats are really competitive, and given that you were invited to interview at Cornell I'm betting your profile and essays were attractive (at least at a first glance). So I'd like to explore some additional things:

  • Career goals: What did you pitch as post-MBA career goals? Did you put the steak on the ground in terms of setting achievable and believable goals? Was the MBA degree a clear bridge that linked your background to your goals?
  • Achievements/leadership: What are your most significant achievements? Can you tell us a bit about your leadership experience?
  • Interviewing: How well do you handle interviews?
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CarlosLaronda
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 07:36
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CriticalSquare
Hey there,

I'm really sorry to hear you haven't had the best of luck in this process so far. I'm glad you're thinking proactively about what you can do to improve your chances for this fall.

First, the good news - you don't need to retake the GMAT or TOEFL. You have a great score! Your verbal is a little low but that's not the end of the world. Definitely doesn't warrant you retaking the test. And it probably wasn't what kept you out.

Now for the rest. Without looking at your application, it's close to impossible to give you pointers on what to work on. I'll say this - as for alternate classes, that could be a good idea. Your GPA is a little low. A class or two could definitely help. When it comes to school visits you really should make an effort of visiting as many as possible. As for your work experience - I have no idea what it is or the impact you had based on what you wrote. If it really is a well known agency in marketing, then that is prestige.

I'd love to help you out - 7 dings can be difficult to swallow. If you'd like to talk about your applications and what lies ahead, feel free to sign up to chat with us [here].

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask!

Bhavik
Show more

Thank you, Bhavik.
I've just signed up to chat with you guys.
Best
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CarlosLaronda
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 07:47
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gentlejack
A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.
Show more

Hey, gentlejack.

I'm from Brazil, so my GPA can't be converted through WES.

Actually, I ranked terribly within my class. I'm actually on the bottom 30%, or something like that.

I guess my greatest challenge will be overcoming this extremely low GPA. I'm seriously thinking about retaking the GMAT. I think that achieving a 750 might be much more powerful than taking a couple of courses here in Brazil.

What do you think?

Best
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 08:09
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CarlosLaronda
Thank you, Bhavik.
I've just signed up to chat with you guys.
Best
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Hey Carlos,

That's fantastic and we're looking forward to speaking with you!

Bhavik
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gentlejack
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 11:14
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CarlosLaronda
gentlejack
A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.

Hey, gentlejack.

I'm from Brazil, so my GPA can't be converted through WES.

Actually, I ranked terribly within my class. I'm actually on the bottom 30%, or something like that.

I guess my greatest challenge will be overcoming this extremely low GPA. I'm seriously thinking about retaking the GMAT. I think that achieving a 750 might be much more powerful than taking a couple of courses here in Brazil.

What do you think?

Best
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A 720 or 750, that is not that much of a difference. I would stick to your score. Bottom 30% for your undergrade studies is not that good though... The good thing is that you are international, so it does not count for the schools stats if they admit you. But they will be bothered that you are academically not on par with the other students. They are less concerned about people that lack a business background, but people that ask stupid questions - that can lower the satisfactory level for other students. And that will have, once again, have a negative impact on the rankings.

By taking 2 or 3 courses on a master's level and having good grades in those, you can show you academic ability. Then you have to explain your low GPA in the optional essay. This, combined with an extra year of work experience, should help you in the next admissions cycle!
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 11:47
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CarlosLaronda
gentlejack
A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.

Hey, gentlejack.

I'm from Brazil, so my GPA can't be converted through WES.

Actually, I ranked terribly within my class. I'm actually on the bottom 30%, or something like that.

I guess my greatest challenge will be overcoming this extremely low GPA. I'm seriously thinking about retaking the GMAT. I think that achieving a 750 might be much more powerful than taking a couple of courses here in Brazil.

What do you think?

Best
A 720 or 750, that is not that much of a difference. I would stick to your score. Bottom 30% for your undergrade studies is not that good though... The good thing is that you are international, so it does not count for the schools stats if they admit you. But they will be bothered that you are academically not on par with the other students. They are less concerned about people that lack a business background, but people that ask stupid questions - that can lower the satisfactory level for other students. And that will have, once again, have a negative impact on the rankings.

By taking 2 or 3 courses on a master's level and having good grades in those, you can show you academic ability. Then you have to explain your low GPA in the optional essay. This, combined with an extra year of work experience, should help you in the next admissions cycle!
Show more

I also agree about the GMAT score. GMAT has a margin of error of +/- 30 points (or something close to that). I think your GMAT is fine and definitely above the average for Cornell. No red flag there.

I think it may help to take a quant class or two; however, I think your GMAT score can offset that. You need to really address this in your optional essay. I know Cornell gave you plenty of room to explain things such as this.

Here are where I think the red flags lie:

1) LORs: Why are you not using your current supervisors letter of recommendations? IMHO, it's imperative to use a current supervisors LOR.

2) Extra-curriculars: Do you have any? Even more so, do you have any experience leading people in extra-currics? This brings me to your last point...

3) Leadership experience: Do you have any real leadership experiences within your professional area? Make sure these are covered within your essays and LORs.

Hope it helps.
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 04 Apr 2014, 21:59
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jckval
gentlejack
A V39 is 88th percentile, so actually a great score, even more so for a non-native speaker. For Toefl, I don't think that that is more than a "check" for the Adcoms. 109 is good enough for any school.

Have you self-evaluated your GPA using the conversion from WES? Or asked your university to tell you how you ranked within your class? Maybe it is not really as "bad" as it looks at first.
The class ranking is a great tip: my GPA in Brazilian standards was 7.8 out of 10, but when I asked the school for a ranking statement I found out that I was ranked top 10% of the class. That ranking statement became part of my application and I think it worked fine.

We, latins, are from an underrepresented pool, your stats are really competitive, and given that you were invited to interview at Cornell I'm betting your profile and essays were attractive (at least at a first glance). So I'd like to explore some additional things:

  • Career goals: What did you pitch as post-MBA career goals? Did you put the steak on the ground in terms of setting achievable and believable goals? Was the MBA degree a clear bridge that linked your background to your goals?
  • Achievements/leadership: What are your most significant achievements? Can you tell us a bit about your leadership experience?
  • Interviewing: How well do you handle interviews?
Show more

+1
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ZERO ADMIT with 720 GMAT and 109 TOEFL 02 Jan 2021, 21:38
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Hello from the GMAT Club MBAbot!

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