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ncp
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 10:34
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kk.iyer
Your wife might err... will find it easier to find a good job here in LA. Can't really say that about AA.
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Good point. But, my wife is a cardiac RN and will be able to find a job quickly in AA. She interviewed at the U-M hospital while at GBR and is fairly confident of landing an offer there.

kk.iyer
You would have established Michigan residency by the second year right? So you qualify for one year of in-state fees...there too
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Not sure about this. I talked to the financial aid counselor at Ross, but she had no clue about the residency requirement. Will have to research this a bit more.

terp, good info on the apartment situation. Good thing I have a couple of weeks to make up my mind. This decision isn't easy.
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 10:34
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ncprasad
But, what about rent and cost of living in the LA area. For a 2 bed apartment, I suspect it will be in the range of $1700+ whereas in AA, it will be half that rent. Over a period of 2 years, AA's cost of living pretty much evens out the tuition advantage. Is there anyone with a different opinion?
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Yes, it's cheaper in AA, but you also are in an area where it's not livable for up to 6 months of the year. The extra rent you pay in LA is for the location and weather, so take that into account. :) Otherwise, everyone would move to North Dakota and save a lot in rent. :lol:

also remember, Michigan in-state is still about $37K, so you only save 6K the 2nd year even if you establish residency.
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 10:34
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hey nc:

I charge about $50 per hour for golf lessons- ~4 hours a week = $200/week. or $800 a month. So over the course of 20 months, you save about $16k in golf lessons fees as I would give the lessons for free.

Something to think about :lol:
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Very funny.
kryzak
Otherwise, everyone would move to North Dakota and save a lot in rent. :lol:
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 10:37
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ncp- is your $10k some "named" scholarship? If it is, then you should probably think about the impact of it on your resume as well.

Btw- I just dinged Duke- so it is Ross for me :lol:
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That's a bummer man...
I read this and you are right, there is nothing conclusive on it...
https://www.umich.edu/~regoff/resreg.html
UCLA has outlined a much better set of requirements on this front.

Folks are right on the apt numbers. For some reason I had a 1 bed in mind.

ncprasad
kk.iyer
You would have established Michigan residency by the second year right? So you qualify for one year of in-state fees...there too

Not sure about this. I talked to the financial aid counselor at Ross, but she had no clue about the residency requirement. Will have to research this a bit more.

terp, good info on the apartment situation. Good thing I have a couple of weeks to make up my mind. This decision isn't easy.
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 11:22
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Thanks everyone for the comments. Here's how I break down Ross and UCLA.

My career goal is to go into General Management and Consulting in the short-term with an eye on entrepreneurship in the medium to long term. Given that I have some well-matured business ideas and also some background in running a small business,I may even venture to launch my own business, based in India or US or in both places, immediately upon graduation.

Academics

Ross is very strong at general management and corporate strategy - my focus areas. I like how their strategy program has been implemented and am highly impressed by the professors who teach the classes. Ross probably has the edge in the fields that I am interested in.

On the other hand, UCLA has a more flexible program that will allow me to tailor my MBA and only pick courses that I really need. At Ross, I will probably have to "waste" a few courses. That said, the quality of the classes at Ross was a notch above the ones I attended at UCLA and the students appeared to be sharper at Ross.

Advantage : Ross.

Hands-on learning

Both schools provide great opportunities to implement what is taught in class. Ross's MAP program is the heart of its MBA program and is well-regarded by both students and recruiters. UCLA has an equally good AMR program with ample room for hands-on learning.

Advantage : None.

Research Insititutes

From an e-ship perspective, both ZLI center at Ross and Price Center at UCLA are fantastic resources for operational support, inspiration and encouragement. In my mind, there is negligible difference here.

Advantage : None.

Rankings

Ross has a very slight edge in terms of reputation within the US and in India. Coupled with a HUGE and PASSIONATE alumni network, Ross seems to come out on top in this aspect.

Advantage : Ross.

Financial Considerations
UCLA tuition : $40k for 2 years
Ross tuition : $86k for 2 years

AA's lower cost of living(random example, I had subway during my trip to AA - $2.79 for a $4.10 sandwich in CA) and lower rent mitigates the situation somewhat. UCLA will probably be cheaper by 15-20K. However, CitiAssist has a guaranteed loan program at Michigan and I will probably get a better interest rate at Ross in comparison to UCLA. UCLA told me that they are still negotiating rates with lenders who I suspect will be wary about extending loans in this economy. Also, because of my I-485 status and no-visa situation, I dont know for sure that I will get in-state tuition at UCLA. UCLA told me that I shouldn't have trouble, but thats no guarantee.

The move to UCLA will cost me less. I have a new car which I cannot sell now. I will have to transport to AA(will cost around $2500) and re-register etc. Again, minor costs that add up if I decide to go to Michigan.


Advantage : UCLA with some room for debate.

Career Stats/Opportunities

In my mind, very little difference between the schools in this aspect. Ross probably has a small advantage for GM and consulting jobs.However, a UCLA fellowhip on my resume may get the attention of companies during recruiting and help me get my foot in the door. I prefer to work on the West Coast where UCLA enjoys a tremendous advantage but not in the areas I am interested in. That said, I will probably prefer going into the industry of my choice(advantage Ross) rather than working in a location I want(advantage UCLA).

So, Advantage : Debatable.

Buildings/Facilities

UCLA has an amazing location with world-class facilities. Ross will soon have a world-class facility of its own by the end of this year. And I will get first use of those facilities.

Advantage : None.

Culture/Fit

Here, Ross is head and shoulders above UCLA. I have been to Ross more than 3 times in the last year and have made very good friends and contacts. My wife has been to AA 2 times and she loves the town and the friendly people there, but she also hates the weather. UCLA is a small speck on the LA landscape and I suspect there isn't as much collobaration between students outside of school. At Ross, the football team and the school-town atmosphere permeates everywhere and people are very gung-ho about AA and U-M. Personally, I love Michigan football and will tremendously enjoy my time there. Also, GBR was fantastic and I know I will be at home in AA just based on my interactions with other admits and their families. My wife said she felt very comfortable at AA and eventhough her background is vastly incompatible with most of the other partners, she enjoyed the interactions very much and feels she will be happy. Childcare is right next door to the apartment we picked out in AA. In LA, I am not sure how difficult/expensive child care and pre-school will be.

Finally, UCLA sent my decision very late and therefore denied me the opportunity to attend A-days. So, I dont have much to go on here. I still think LA with the proximity to Artesia and disney land etc will be great place for my son to spend two years in lovely weather. But, if I have to pick UCLA, I will have to do so without having good grasp of the culture at UCLA.

Advantage : Ross, by miles.

Weather
No arguments here. UCLA beats Ross easily.

Advantage : UCLA, by several celsius.

Any comments?
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ncprasad.. you have your reasons to choose why you fit with Ross more than UCLA but for me UCLA is a great fit..

I might agree with you that for consulting, Ross might have an advantage but overall I like UCLA much better..

Rankings aside -

I went to A Days II.. I loved the school - I also came to realize why I applied to the school in first place and am glad I chose not to apply to Berkley (no offence Kry).. I met couple of people who were going to Berkley .. and I am glad that I wasn't part of them.. Berkley was too nerdy/engineery for me from day one..

I got this feeling that people were genuine.. How in admit weeekends everyone is trying to sell the school .. In Anderson it felt like what you see is what you GET!

I agreee I only have admits from two schools and can only compare UCLA with 4-5 other schools..
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 13:23
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I guess thats why it is called "fit".
bewakoof
ncprasad.. you have your reasons to choose why you fit with Ross more than UCLA but for me UCLA is a great fit..
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ncprasad
I guess thats why it is called "fit".
bewakoof
ncprasad.. you have your reasons to choose why you fit with Ross more than UCLA but for me UCLA is a great fit..
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I guess so.... I didn't mean it an offensive way..
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bewakoof, I didn't take any offense. No worries at all.

About fit, I really dont know if I will fit in at UCLA. If only I attended A-days, then I would had the opportunity to check it out.
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ncprasad

Good point. But, my wife is a cardiac RN and will be able to find a job quickly in AA. She interviewed at the U-M hospital while at GBR and is fairly confident of landing an offer there.
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Are you familiar with "traveling nurses."? My SO, among other things, used to be an RN (still picks up shifts from time to time). Your housing situation will be a complete non-issue if she works as a traveler in either AA or LA.
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The thing is we have a 3 year old. If my wife travels and I slog in B-school, the family situation becomes untenable.

ryguy904
Are you familiar with "traveling nurses."? My SO, among other things, used to be an RN (still picks up shifts from time to time). Your housing situation will be a complete non-issue if she works as a traveler in either AA or LA.
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 14:25
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with family its totally a different story..

my perspective is of a 24 year old single Good looking male.. :)
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ncprasad
The thing is we have a 3 year old. If my wife travels and I slog in B-school, the family situation becomes untenable.

ryguy904
Are you familiar with "traveling nurses."? My SO, among other things, used to be an RN (still picks up shifts from time to time). Your housing situation will be a complete non-issue if she works as a traveler in either AA or LA.
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I guess what I was saying, is your wife would be "traveling" at or close to the same hospital in which she would be working if she got a "traditional" job. She could probably get the travel assignment at UM hospoital or a hospital in LA. I don't mean you live in AA and she travels to San Fran or Chicago or anything like that. As you know, there is a huge nursing shortage almost anywhere you go in this country. She can pretty much call the shots on the schedule, location, etc.

Just a thought. :)
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Calling UCLA Fall 2008 Applicants 15 Apr 2008, 14:42
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Got it. I guess I need some caffeine.

ryguy904
ncprasad
The thing is we have a 3 year old. If my wife travels and I slog in B-school, the family situation becomes untenable.

ryguy904
Are you familiar with "traveling nurses."? My SO, among other things, used to be an RN (still picks up shifts from time to time). Your housing situation will be a complete non-issue if she works as a traveler in either AA or LA.

I guess what I was saying, is your wife would be "traveling" at or close to the same hospital in which she would be working if she got a "traditional" job. She could probably get the travel assignment at UM hospoital or a hospital in LA. I don't mean you live in AA and she travels to San Fran or Chicago or anything like that. As you know, there is a huge nursing shortage almost anywhere you go in this country. She can pretty much call the shots on the schedule, location, etc.

Just a thought. :)
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very tough choice NC... it sounds like your fit at Ross is better than UCLA based on all your reasoning. I wish I could give more comments, but I don't know Ross' program well enough, so I can only say that the E-ship at UCLA will definitely get you doing startups immediately. But it sounds like Ross can do that too.

The cost of living difference is solely determined by the location and weather. Like my previous comment about Fargo (North Dakota), you get what you pay for. If you and your wife are ok with that, then by all means, the location and weather should no longer be a factor (whereas in my case, both are huge factors and thus strikes against Kellogg, since I pretty much refuse to live in those sort of winter conditions if I don't *have* to :P)

bewakoof, no offense taken, it's all about your individual fit. To give NC a different viewpoint, comparing Days at Haas and Anderson Days, I was blown away by DAH. A-Days was fun, well organized, professional, informative, and cool. The people were friendly, genuine, and helpful. But Haas was simply awesome for me. I felt the energy and friendliness of the students, the love they have for the school, and the excitement they bring to everything they do at every event. It's also interesting to note that I met very few engineers at Days at Haas, whereas many people I met at A-Days were engineers... it's probably just a luck of the draw. Also, no offense to any Anderson students, past, present or future, I did feel that the "sharpness" (as NC puts it) of the students at Haas were slightly higher than Anderson, ONLY based on the people I met. Again, this is NOT intended to be a knock at Anderson people, whom I was quite impressed with, but just drilling down to the very fine points (nitpicking). Maybe it's because I'm one of those "nerdy/engineery" types? :wink: hahaha :lol:

It is unfortunate that Anderson didn't tell you about your admit until too late, because A-Days would be crucial for you to decide your fit at Anderson. I wish we could tell you what the experience was like, but just from reading bewakoof's and my polar opposite experiences at A-Days, it really all depends on the person.

Check with red_s4, maybe he can give a 3rd unique perspective of A-Days to help you learn vicariously through your GMATClubbers to help you make the decision?
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ncprasad
Thanks everyone for the comments. Here's how I break down Ross and UCLA.


Academics

Ross is very strong at general management and corporate strategy - my focus areas. I like how their strategy program has been implemented and am highly impressed by the professors who teach the classes. Ross probably has the edge in the fields that I am interested in.

On the other hand, UCLA has a more flexible program that will allow me to tailor my MBA and only pick courses that I really need. At Ross, I will probably have to "waste" a few courses. That said, the quality of the classes at Ross was a notch above the ones I attended at UCLA and the students appeared to be sharper at Ross.

Advantage : Ross.

Culture/Fit

Here, Ross is head and shoulders above UCLA. I have been to Ross more than 3 times in the last year and have made very good friends and contacts. My wife has been to AA 2 times and she loves the town and the friendly people there, but she also hates the weather. UCLA is a small speck on the LA landscape and I suspect there isn't as much collobaration between students outside of school. At Ross, the football team and the school-town atmosphere permeates everywhere and people are very gung-ho about AA and U-M. Personally, I love Michigan football and will tremendously enjoy my time there. Also, GBR was fantastic and I know I will be at home in AA just based on my interactions with other admits and their families. My wife said she felt very comfortable at AA and eventhough her background is vastly incompatible with most of the other partners, she enjoyed the interactions very much and feels she will be happy. Childcare is right next door to the apartment we picked out in AA. In LA, I am not sure how difficult/expensive child care and pre-school will be.

Finally, UCLA sent my decision very late and therefore denied me the opportunity to attend A-days. So, I dont have much to go on here. I still think LA with the proximity to Artesia and disney land etc will be great place for my son to spend two years in lovely weather. But, if I have to pick UCLA, I will have to do so without having good grasp of the culture at UCLA.

Advantage : Ross, by miles.

Any comments?
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Two things, the corporate strategy professors at Anderson are some of the best out there. Unfortunately, they are anal about class visitors so you do not get to see them during campus visits :)

As for fit, I am not sure how you can say Ross by miles without ever visiting Anderson. I have never been to AA, but I can tell you that Anderson folks definitely hang out quite a bit off campus whether they be tailgating outside the annual beating at the hands of USC football or at bars across the west side. Then again with it being so absolutely cold and miserable in AA, I guess you will spend a lot of time in close proximity to your classmates in-doors =)
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:lol:
socalconsult
Then again with it being so absolutely cold and miserable in AA, I guess you will spend a lot of time in close proximity to your classmates in-doors =)
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Actually I visited UCLA 2 times in the last few months. The thing is, I never really got to talk to that many students. The few folks that I talked to were great and even had a great time at an ice cream social at the Cornell Hall. Just that I had significantly more such experiences at Ross. A-days would have helped me, but unfortunately it didn't happen for me.
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socalconsult, you might want to chat with the admissions office regarding extending an offer the Friday before A-Days II and how Anderson may have lost someone because that person never got the chance to experience A-Days. :)
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