HBS 2008 GPA/GMAT

Question

I just noticed this on the HBS website:

GMAT Score Range 550-800 
Middle 50% GMAT Score Range 700-750 
Average GPA 3.66

3.66 $($)@$(@*$)$()#*. Maybe I should just bow out now?

dabots · Answer

3.66 isnt THAT much more than other top schools that hover around 3.5 average

sam77sam7 · Answer

Look at that range - fricking 550!

Must be an incredible applicant in all other areas, extremely impressive.

agold · Answer

I'd say it's quite a hike up from the past years and also quite a bit higher than the other Top 10 schools (with the exception of Stanford).

I would venture to guess that their average GMAT score this year must have been in the range of 725-730.

For a reference point, Cornell's GPA last year was 3.31, Darden's was 3.33, and Duke's was 3.38. This is a variation of negative .12-.19 from a mean of 3.5. Cornell, Duke, and Darden have the lowest average GPA, as well as the highest acceptance rate out of the Elite Tier.

A positive .16 variation from a mean of 3.5 really puts Harvard in a different tier from the rest of the UE schools. Last year, Harvard's average GPA was a 3.63 and Stanford's was a 3.61. I would venture to guess that Stanford should definitely be in the mid-3.6 range this year as well.

riverripper · Answer

I am not really shocked at the GPA or GMAT since it is not that big of an increase. They were close to that level anyways 2009 gpa was 3.63 and gmat was 713. The fact that 41% of their class is so young is what shocked me the most and where the students are coming from shows heavy drawing from certain areas...heck there are more people coming from non-profit than investment banking. Tons of PE types and consultants (probably 85% of which are from M/B/B).

Per 2008 Us News.
HBS: 3.63 / 713
Stanford: 3.61 / 721
Wharton: 3.53 / 712
MIT: 3.5 / 705
Kellogg: 3.5 / 704
Chicago: 3.5 / 709
Tuck: 3.46 / 713
Haas: 3.57 / 710
Columbia: 3.4 / 707
NYU: 3.4 / 700
UCLA: 3.6 / 704
Ross: 3.3 / 700
Yale: 3.47 / 700
Cornell: 3.31 / 682

Known so far this year. 
Harvard: 3.66 / ? (0.03+ / ?)
Wharton: 3.5 / 715 (-0.03 / +3)
Kellogg: ? / 712 (? / +8)
Yale: 3.5 / 718 (+0.03 / +18)
Cornell: ? / 695 (? / +13)

I hate to be the one to break it to you but the reality is if you have a 720 and a 3.5 you are basically going to be AVERAGE at best for most top 10 schools. And the honest answer is depending on your demographic and can be much higher or lower...schools wont tell you that but its true. Certain groups definitely bring up the averages for others.

One thing to remember about the ranges for HBS 50%, there are going to be far more 720s than 750s. Also there is probably one 550, maybe a few others in the 500s. They arent even underrepresented minorities necessarily...their dads could be the ruler of some foreign country or the CEO of a fortune 50 company. There are lots of reasons people with such low scores get in...in a class that large maybe HBS lets one low score in just so they can say, see we let in people with 550s.

aceman626 · Answer

I fail to see how the GPA is THAT impressive....GPA is the single most useless and unfair piece of data used in the bschool application process because a 3.6 from one school is completely different from a 3.6 from another school. I don't understand why US bschools even bother publishing that data or why rankings even use it.

There's maybe like ~5 undergrad universities in the US that are truly rigorous. Remember many top schools, feeder schools to top MBA programs, actually have grade inflation.

And international school GPAs are generally not calculated into the average at all.

pelihu · Answer

At least you're not applying to Harvard Law School. The 25-75% GPA range there is 3.75-3.95; which means 25% of the people have GPAs over 3.95. A picnic compared with Yale law school though at 3.77-3.97.

Raabend · Answer

The applicant probably started a successful leper colony in India, figured out how to make $1B from the colony, all while inspiring the lepers to paint abstract art. In the process he lost his own arms due to leprosy..... and because of his lack-of-skill using the mouth stick, he was not able to finish both GMAT sections on time.....hence 550.

sam77sam7

Look at that range - fricking 550!

Must be an incredible applicant in all other areas, extremely impressive.

sonibubu · Answer

With the rampant grade inflation going on, especially at the Ivies, I'm sure H/S GPAs are trending in this direction (but won't reach the levels of Med and Law schools).

isa · Answer

Or has fantastic legacy connections ::sigh:: :roll:

sm332 · Answer

I think the upward trend is going to continue ... yes grade inflation is certainly a factor here ... but to a large extent it balances out since I am yet to hear of a single US UG university which doesnt have significant grade inflation. Before anyone jumps me .. I too did my UG in the US and saw it first hand.

isa · Answer

Sure it's higher than it was in previous but as has been noted in other threads, the app process is getting more and more competitive; I imagine that signif more of the applicants have amazing profiles, leading to higher GPAs, GMATs, etc.

At the end of the day, the GPA is one factor measured in the application. I agree with aceman that it's not the most accurate indicator of how you'll do but for now, it's something they look at.

I'm not planning on worrying about it too much - my GPA would've been lower than HSB's avg from last year too - just will spend my efforts on making the essays spectacular!

sudden · Answer

I think it varies widely. The average grade in my major at a top state school was 2.5. In a class of 40, there would typically be one, maybe two 4.0s. Engineering and physics courses were even worse. My friend scored seven standard deviations above the mean for his final grade in one of his intro engineering courses. Grade? 3.3.

Edit: I should add that he went to HBS about five years after graduating. He had a 3.6 in engineering, which is more like a 3.9 proforma GPA. Not all 3.6s are created equal, so the average is pretty meaningless I think. Given that a lot of strong students in grade deflated majors "only" hit 3.3-3.5, I wonder what that says about the GPAs of those in "easier" majors -- you are probably looking at the 3.8 range as an average. If you are a poli sci major, irrespective of where you went to school, I doubt a 3.6 is going to help you out that much. That being said, I think it's probably easier to earn a 3.6 as a poli sci major at a private school that has a mean GPA of 3.3-3.4 per class than a state school that has a 2.5 average in the same subject. Of course the preference is still for the private school, but nobody said life is fair.

kidderek · Answer

That is just mind boggling, or is it bottling? Damn movies . . .

falibay · Answer

The GMAT score is scary. And I think I was happy with my 710 when I got out of the exam center... My optimism has turned south since then, that's for sure.

sonibubu · Answer

Anyone who graduated with an engineering degree probably did not gain the benefit of grade inflation. Of course this can't be said across the board.

E.g.: Anyone who graduates with over a 3.0 from Berkeley in engineering is doing well, as their eng profs are specifically instructed to keep the avg eng GPA at 2.7. Only 16% of each class is allowed to get an A -- thus a true Bell curve.

The avg eng GPA at my school was 2.7, whereas the overall grad GPA was around 3.3 if I remember correctly.

sam77sam7 · Answer

That would be... boggling. :wink:

agold · Answer

Are you planning to mention notes like these in the optional essay?

sonibubu · Answer

No. Just to minimize confusion from my statements below though, I didn't attend Berkeley.

I'm sure adcoms know about grade inflation and deflation at different schools.

sm332 · Answer

considering they are several hundred ''major" colleges/Uni's in the US i doubt whether they have a matrix laid out to say Berkley + Engr means 3.5 is great whereas Haverford + English Lit 3.8 means par for the course.

I just dont think they will spin their wheels doing that.

Anyways -

HBS 2008 GPA/GMAT

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