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# None of the attempts to specify the causes of crime explains why most

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Intern
Joined: 16 Jul 2011
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 11:49
"D" is a good choice and looks using the proper grammar (present perfect)
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 11:55
agdimple333 wrote:
problem # 4 in SC sample questions of OG.

none is more concentrated...
may be it is none that was more concentrated than..

In this case, I agree with you that "None" may imply anything here. Further details will definitely help to figure what exactly is needed in this question. But in most cases none would be plural such as "None of my friends", "None of my shirts", and "None of your programs".There are very few cases in which I found OK to use singular with NONE such as "It is none of your business", "None of your code is working" and "None of the above is correct".
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 12:02
Quote:
Dude they say None is singular..........

so whats your take on this

we should consider None as singular or plural???

Can you post this question on MGMAT forum and ask for the opinion?
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 12:19
sgupta0827 wrote:
agdimple333 wrote:
problem # 4 in SC sample questions of OG.

none is more concentrated...
may be it is none that was more concentrated than..

In this case, I agree with you that "None" may imply anything here. Further details will definitely help to figure what exactly is needed in this question. But in most cases none would be plural such as "None of my friends", "None of my shirts", and "None of your programs".There are very few cases in which I found OK to use singular with NONE such as "It is none of your business", "None of your code is working" and "None of the above is correct".

Dude
I think We can separate the above problem by making a general rule
for None Of....XXXX(plural) construction type of questions we will take it as plural

what do you say this will solve the problem of above question as well
none is more concentrated [this is not None Of....XXXX(plural) ] hence singular...

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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 12:29
Warlock007 wrote:
sgupta0827 wrote:
agdimple333 wrote:
problem # 4 in SC sample questions of OG.

none is more concentrated...
may be it is none that was more concentrated than..

In this case, I agree with you that "None" may imply anything here. Further details will definitely help to figure what exactly is needed in this question. But in most cases none would be plural such as "None of my friends", "None of my shirts", and "None of your programs".There are very few cases in which I found OK to use singular with NONE such as "It is none of your business", "None of your code is working" and "None of the above is correct".

Dude
I think We can separate the above problem by making a general rule
for None Of....XXXX(plural) construction type of questions we will take it as plural

what do you say this will solve the problem of above question as well
none is more concentrated [this is not None Of....XXXX(plural) ] hence singular...

We don't have to reinvent the wheel: SANAM rule already defines it well. I have only listed few examples of the SANAM rule.
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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20 Jul 2011, 12:43
sgupta0827 wrote:

We don't have to reinvent the wheel: SANAM rule already defines it well. I have only listed few examples of the SANAM rule.

I didn't ask to reinvent the wheel
we all have got all material of the world
the very purpose of the forum is to bring easy understanding
if this simple understanding is going to help any one then the purpose is served
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2011, 04:17
I took D.

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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2011, 04:34
WishMasterUA wrote:
I took D.

according to MGMAT answer is A
as none will be considered plural in this case
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2011, 07:42
OG12#SC-Q22-Page-661

None of the attempts to specify the causes of crime explains why most of the people exposed to the alleged causes do not commit crimes and, conversely, why so many of those not so exposed have.
(A) have
(B) has
(C) shall
(D) do
(E) could
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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21 Jul 2011, 08:29
Hmm picked A as well. Need to refresh SANAM pronouns.

Posted from my mobile device
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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31 Jul 2011, 12:45
1
This post was
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MGMAT SC says: Technically, none of + plural noun can take either a singular or a plural verb forms.

I think GMAT will never make you choose between A and D. I think Kaplan guys messed it up. Both A and D are correct. Whoever created this question forgot that that none is one of the SANAM pronouns and, moreover, none is still under scrutiny/debate among the big guns of Grammar.

I read a bunch of articles online on none of. This is the gist: Some people insist that since “none” is derived from “no one” it should always be singular: “none of us is having dessert.” However, in standard usage, the word is most often treated as a plural. “None of us are having dessert” will do just fine.

I highly doubt GMAT will test us on this, while all the Grammar experts are still arguing :p. Who are we to make a call?
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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31 Jul 2011, 14:21
abhicoolmax wrote:
MGMAT SC says: Technically, none of + plural noun can take either a singular or a plural verb forms.

I think GMAT will never make you choose between A and D. I think Kaplan guys messed it up. Both A and D are correct. Whoever created this question forgot that that none is one of the SANAM pronouns and, moreover, none is still under scrutiny/debate among the big guns of Grammar.

I read a bunch of articles online on none of. This is the gist: Some people insist that since “none” is derived from “no one” it should always be singular: “none of us is having dessert.” However, in standard usage, the word is most often treated as a plural. “None of us are having dessert” will do just fine.

I highly doubt GMAT will test us on this, while all the Grammar experts are still arguing :p. Who are we to make a call?

More: Seems like GMAT doesn't think "none" is a SANAM pronoun. So if, in GMAT, you see "none" PREFER SINGULAR. I thing MGMAT should add this in their book.

See OG12 SC #4 vast-tides-of-migration-105900.html
Right answer is: Of all the vast tides of migration that have swept through history, perhaps none was more concentrated than the wave that brought 12 million immigrants onto American shores in little more than three decades.

This example proves my point. Anyways, whatever . If GMAT says Singular, I will take that as true - I don't care anymore :p

If someone has a strong objection or knows a spy working undercover in GMAT, please give post your alter-thoughts
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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02 Aug 2011, 11:33
My 2 cents - Which one of the below is correct ?

None of my friends have been able to solve the puzzle .
None of my friends has been able to solve the puzzle

GMAT does not care about advanced rules....It always looks for meaning, Logic and then basic grammar....Grammar is secondary if the rules are advanced....
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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06 Aug 2011, 15:46
Can somebody pls come up with a correct answer for everybody's sake?.
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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06 Aug 2011, 15:58
maheshsrini wrote:
Can somebody pls come up with a correct answer for everybody's sake?.

It should be D in this case....

FYI -
http://www.beatthegmat.com/none-of-my-f ... 64141.html
http://www.beatthegmat.com/none-of-my-f ... 62-15.html
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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06 Aug 2011, 17:34
maheshsrini wrote:
Can somebody pls come up with a correct answer for everybody's sake?.

I wrote an email to our Technical Writer at work. She has a PhD in literature and working as a Technical Writer for past 5-6 years. See her response below.

My Question to her:
---
Hey Meghan,

Sorry to bother you Meghan. I have had a question for you.

I am sure you have heard of SANAM pronouns - Some, Any, None, All, More/Most. When these pronouns act as the subject of a verb in a sentence, the verb agrees in number with the pronoun, the subject, based on the Of-prepositional phrase (with noun) that modifies the pronoun.

For instance,
All of my friends love sushi. (verb love here agrees in number with the abstract noun friends, which combined with the preposition of modifies the pronoun all)
All of the US army is alert. (verb is here agrees in number with the collective noun army, which is singular)

But with none there is HUGE controversy among the elite grammarians.

Orthodox grammarians say none is etymologically derived from the phrase "no one", hence it must be used as singular regardless of the Of-prepositional phrase that modifies it.
- None of my friends likes to eat sushi.
- None of the sugar is on the floor.
Some, not all, modern grammarian say, being a SANAM pronoun, it should have a cardinality that agrees in number with the noun in the Of-prepositional phrase that modifies it.
- None of my friends like to eat sushi.
- None of the sugar is on the floor.

I have never read a single article that has clearly stated which between the two is correct. I was hoping if you have any comment(s) or bias

Thanks.

---

Her response:
---
The discussion of "none" is a long one; however, the most well-written response I found so far comes from this guy: http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-non2.htm

He states that "none" should follow the same rules as the rest of SANAM pronouns, since it can mean either "no one" (singlular) or "no persons" (plural). So you can treat it as either singular or plural based on the prepositional phrase. Based on his thorough research, I can't help but agree with him.

---

Based on the above discussion, A should be the right answer. But GMAT seems to prefer D usage - see my explanation here none-singular-or-plural-117407.html#p954852

Nobody can tell for sure, I personally think there is too much debate w.r.t. none, for GMAT to test it.
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Re: None (singular or plural) [#permalink]

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07 Aug 2011, 07:51
D. As per manhattan SC guide, when in doubt, think singular. So as per that logic, think "none" as singular and select the answer choice.
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Re: As of this morning, none of my friends have been able to [#permalink]

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08 Nov 2011, 07:19
I went with A, hopefully we dont see one of these in the real thing.
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Re: As of this morning, none of my friends have been able to [#permalink]

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08 Nov 2011, 07:43
Manhattan says that none + plural noun can take either singular or plural verb.
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As of this morning, none of my friends have been able to [#permalink]

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10 Dec 2011, 17:04
As of this morning, none of my friends have been able to solve the puzzle contained in last week's newspaper.
(A) none of my friends have been able to solve
(B) none of my friends was able to solve
(C) not one of my friends has yet been able to solve
(D) none of my friends has been able to solve
(E) nobody among my friends have solved

IMO-D
As of this morning, none of my friends have been able to   [#permalink] 10 Dec 2011, 17:04

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