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Question

Hi,

I just appeared for GMAT and got 670(QA49 VA33).

Schools I am targeting:
Canada B-Schools(Rotman, Queen's, Schulich, Sauder, McGill)
NUS
Insead, Judge

Profile:
I have 6 years of work ex out of which 4.5 with Adobe but mostly on technical side.
My engineering college is among top 10 Engineering colleges in India. 
Score in BE - 69%

Apart from that I do not have any substantial data to show in terms of NGO, Client interaction etc.

Could some please comment about my chances in above mentioned Schools? Is there any slim chance of getting Scholarship?

If you can list some good schools for me then please do. I am mainly looking for a career in Product Management in big IT firms(Google, MS, Amazon, Adobe etc) after MBA.

Also, I am planning to give GMAT again within 2-3 weeks, hoping to cross 700. But I want to apply this year. So, If I don't get improved score I will apply with this one. Hence, I need inputs from experts.

Thanks

MBAPrepCoach · Answer

I don't really have all the information but here's what I will say. Review the middle 80% GMAT scores for each of the schools listed above, and if you are not right at the top, consider it outside of your reach. This is for two reasons. 1) Indian IT Engineers are the most overrepresented profile out there, with acceptance rates of about 1/3 to 1/2 the average and 2) You are competing against other Indians, who have GMAT scores that are normally quite high. Less so on verbal than quant, but usually in the 700s.

Also, given that you don't have much experience with client interaction or community involvement, there are no offsetting entries here with the sub par GMAT. Admits with GMAT scores on the low end bring some kind of irreplaceable diversity to the school. I would recommend you think about what unique contribution you can make. Anything interesting about your background, hobbies, etc? What is your leadership experience?

If you must apply this year, my advise would be go with R2 and to put your current focus on getting an outstanding GMAT score. Because that is the variable within your locus of control right now. I don't know your age, but if you can wait a year and get some community and leadership experience, along with a 720+ GMAT I think you would be much more competitive.

There are a series of 10 blog articles on my website about preparing for Round 1 that might be helpful to you. A good GMAT is necessary but not sufficient for tech-oriented Indians who want to attend a top business school.

I am not sure about scholarships with your current profile. Think about why the adcom would pick you over all the other applicants with your same profile. If you can't answer that question, they won't be able to either.

scofieldg · Answer

Thanks Farrell,

What do you mean by 80% GMAT score? GMAT club gives 80% GMAT range but that is a big range. For example, for McGill it is 620-730. So, as per your comment I should be around 730? is this what you mean? I listed these colleges based on average GMAT scores.

For hobbies and leadership. I do not have a passionate hobby and I do not think anything else counts. For leadership, I can only make a case for influence on my sub-ordinates. This can be proved by LOR.

My age is 29. I will give GMAT but practically I think I can reach 700 only. After all the preparation and analysis, I do not think I can reach 720.

Does Adobe name won't separate me a bit from other Indian IT applicants who are not from such a big MNC?(Considering everything else same?) Just asking if any Adcom consider it ?

Will it help if I take community service experience now?

Thanks

GyanOne · Answer

Hi

Would like to know a few more details about your work experience - what have you been working on in the last 1.5 years? Also, what was your technical work around in the first 4.5 years? Any international experience to report?

Beyond that, you might like to consider a few points as you go about assessing your next steps: 
1. While the Canadian schools are a possibility (can comment more on that after details of your work-ex), INSEAD, NUS, and Judge will be difficult. Your school selection needs to be more judicious and thought out, especially because the Canadian schools you mention (except for Rotman) aren't known for their strengths in product management either. 
2. Chances of scholarships will be low with this score. You also need to consider what else you are bringing in to make a case for a scholarship apart from your work profile. Extra curricular achievements, community contribution, and of course GMAT scores will all play a role here. 
3. While you will not be considered a typical IT applicant, you do need to show differentiation in your profile, as well as clear career goals.

You might also like to go through the following articles: 
 Improving your profile for MBA admissions 
 Retaking the GMAT: how to do better next time 
 Applying to an MBA program: Indian applicants 
 Indian IT Male MBA applicants

scofieldg · Answer

Thanks GYANONE for your reply,

My whole work ex is in Software Testing. Starting 4.5 years was majorly learning and applying core testing technologies and delivering quality software. In Last 1.5 year I am also mentoring Fresh hires. More efforts are now for changing and optimizing processes. Managing software releases is also added to my job profiles. I do not think my International exposure, which is attending technical conferences and interacting with global teams, is relevant for B-Schools.
My school selection is based on data from LinkedIn alumni database of these schools. Though, this data is not much definitive but I couldn't find any data specific to Product Management. I do not think I can consider IT services data given in placement reports of B-Schools. Any input how could I filter Schools for Product management?

Please let me know if you need anything else. Where should I focus now?

Thanks,

GyanOne · Answer

scofieldg,

Thanks for posting that info - that helps. Based on that, we can say that almost your entire experience is very technical. The mentoring part helps add a bit of leadership to your profile, but you will also need to demonstrate other skills - project management and development, for example, from your experience, to have a better fit with product management roles. While LinkedIn may be a decent source of career information, it is unlikely to be the best way to choose schools for a certain specialization. You must look not only at placement data (many schools do break up by product v/s service), but also at the curriculum. At many schools, product management may not be separate, but included inside the Marketing specialization. This is why schools such as Kellogg and Haas are considered to be strong at product management.

As of now, though, would recommend that you focus on the GMAT and on increasing your score by 40-50 points to be more competitive.

You may also go through   Why did an Amazon Professional  , the story of a testing professional who made it to Kellogg

scofieldg · Answer

Thanks GyanOne for the tips and link. It really helps.

VeritasPrepEdison · Answer

Thanks for sharing.

You would need to find points of differentiation or be considered strong in more metrics compared with other similarly qualified applicants from the same background. Aside from scores, academic background, and professional experiences, reflect on your personal qualities, motivations, and goals. You may identify something unique or particularly strong that you can contribute. Relating how these have helped you as you have progressed up to this point in your career can help you present a compelling application.

Your application should not focus too much on your technical work save for the unique accomplishments or learnings. Instead, share highlights that would show more of your character, and personality. This could help your profile become more memorable.

Wish you all the best!

VanessaGilMBA · Answer

Greetings and thanks for your request for a profile evaluation! I agree with some of my fellow consultants who have commented on here. It’s true that you are coming from one of the most challenging “applicant pools” (male, Indian, engineer).

My advice to you would be as follows:

--First, re-take the GMAT –but only when you’ve had sufficient time to properly devote yourself to study. I’m confident that, as a graduate of a top engineering college in India, you are capable of an even higher score than you have attained previously. That’s going to be critical if we are to convince AdCom’s at your target schools that you are a student to take a risk on! (Community service can be a strong positive factor, but it's important not to think of it as a cosmetic add-on that can mask or reverse other elements of the profile, especially if you commence involvement too close to application time. There are 'right' ways and 'wrong' ways to add community pro-bono work.)

--Second, the most important suggestion: devote significant time to reflecting on Your Purpose. You must step back and examine why you’re on this quest in the first place. What is motivating you to apply for an MBA? Is it just to have some extra initials attached to your name, for the network, or for some other purpose? (I’m sure you realize that only “some other purpose” will do as the correct response here!) Make sure that you take significant time to do some soul-searching and understand what your mission is. Many people find that working with an expert admissions consultant can help you with that; it’s a difficult thing to do on one’s own. Whether you decide to hire someone or go it ‘alone’, this is a fundamental element of application success.

Let’s put things in perspective. Attending business school is akin to any other business transaction – both sides must give and receive something, or else the exchange will not go forward. What you, the student, gain from business school is already well-documented, on this site and others. But what will that institution, and your fellow classmates, gain from you? Your intellectual contribution inside and outside the classroom, your community participation, and, of course, the future value of your accomplishments, which will lend the university prestige (and perhaps monetary donations someday)--these are the metrics upon which you are being evaluated, even as you apply. The AdCom uses your essays, your recommendations, and your past history of accomplishments (resume and previous academic transcripts) to assess the potential value of what you’ll bring to their school. Scholarships are typically extended to those who schools want most, which means the MBA program believes that applicant will bring even more value than average. You’ll want to reflect on these aspects of your profile as objectively as you can.

So, as others have noted, in the absence of a strong academic record and strong scores, we must turn to other means of assuring the AdCom that you are “worthy” (as complex and loaded a term as that is).

One thing I recommend is to better define your goal (beyond merely “product management”). “Product management” as such, sounds too general and ambiguous – really get a grasp on the business problem you’d like to solve in your lifetime. Remember, as others noted, you are coming from IT with an Indian background, and the competition in this group is particularly fierce – top grades and GMAT are the norm. Again, a great MBA consultant can help you to do that.

The next step would be to articulate the impact you’ve had on current (Adobe) and past organizations – best projects, convey your work in terms of impact on the firm, and describe the mentoring involvement that has recently come about.
There are many steps you can take to refine your profile and present your application in the best light. If you’re interested in a free consultation call with more robust detail, please do not hesitate to contact Arbitrage Admissions Advantage. We're wishing you all the best in life & B-school!

PersonalMBACoach · Answer

Thank you for your detailed post. With your current score, Rotman and NUS may not happen but it depends how strong your extracurricular leadership experiences are. If you manage to increase your score to a 700 you stand a much better chance. Depending on how high you get, you could consider HEC Montreal as well. Email me if you want to discuss further. We can chat about strategies I have used for applicants like you in the past. Good luck! Scott@personalmbacoach.com Best, Scott

aim780 · Answer

Thanks Veritas and Scott for your valuable input. It will surely help me in my application.

aim780 · Answer

Thanks Vanessa for your detailed valuable input. I can devote time to GMAT but I think I am already exceeding the best time to do MBA, since I already have 6 years of work ex. I think one more year in my work ex will increase expectations of Adcoms to a much greater level. But again if I do not get a good B-School then also it will not be fruitful. So, I think I have limited time for re-take.

Thanks,
Rajesh

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